WSJ: China’s Fading Recovery Reveals Deeper Economic Struggles

[F-22Raptor]

Even easier thing to compare and win the argument on more conclusively versus the CCP spambots:

Largest Chinese companies by market capitalization

List of the largest companies in China by market capitalization, all rankings are updated daily.

companiesmarketcap.com

Largest American companies by market capitalization

List of the largest american companies by market capitalization, all rankings are updated daily.

companiesmarketcap.com

One can easily see where the Chinese economy is over leveraged on (things to do with real estate and banking finance regarding that) and where the "money where your mouth is" capacities actually are regarding innovation companies.

Simply put, the Chinese themselves (even with the current demographic dividend + earning potential before that sunsets) dont really see their "innovation" companies as that worthwhile to invest in....especially after the CCP crackdown on parts of the service industry.

PRC will just be another Soviet Union in the end...a larger version of it, with more market forces allowed to operate to some degree.....but in the end the upcoming demographic collapse is going to be brutal on PRC (whatever the other consequences of that will be)....their breakout does not have the raw institutional credibility, heft and sustainability long term....as they simply do not have the free enough system to achieve those tiers.

@gambit @jhungary @VCheng

US with 1900 companies with over $1B valuation

China with 200

It’s clear investors place their bets on American innovative capacity.

China is a larger Soviet Union and the demographic decline will be a sight to behold.

 

[kankan326]

Not again. I have been reading China collapse articles in the forum for 10 consecutive years.

China 2023 Q1 GDP growth is 4.5%.
US 2023 Q1 GDP growth is 1.3%.

 

[GiantPanda]

China can produce an endless amount of empty buildings, but can’t produce a single reusable rocket.

This is why I’ll always bet on the American economy over Chinas.

Please, if China could produce an endless amount of empty buildings then it is surely a bigger economy than the US. I bet the US can't build one city to house its homeless if it tried. China builds dozens of so-called "Ghost Cities" that usually fill up in a few years or so.

But evennif they are a complete waste, they show that China has the hard economic power to build things on scale the US can't.

China is simply a much larger economy in every sense of the term.

 

[CIA Mole]

Please, if China could produce an endless amount of empty buildings then it is surely a bigger economy than the US. I bet the US can't build one city to house its homeless if it tried. China builds dozens of so-called "Ghost Cities" that usually fill up in a few years or so.

But evennif they are a complete waste, they show that China has the hard economic power to build things on scale the US can't.

China is simply a much larger economy in every sense of the term.

america's problems doesn't make xi any more viable

 

[renhai]

america's problems doesn't make xi any more viable

 

[GiantPanda]

Not again. I have been reading China collapse articles in the forum for 10 consecutive years.

China 2023 Q1 GDP growth is 4.5%.
US 2023 Q1 GDP growth is 1.3%.

Yes, the funniest thing is not only did China not collapse but it actually became the world's largest economy by most measures.

Since 2013.

All this talk about "whether" China will overtake the US in GDP is just silly copium. It has already happened and China is already a MUCH larger economy (20% more) by any reasonable measure.

China is the World’s Largest Economy: Get Over It

Some folks seem to find it hard to accept that the US does not have the world’s largest economy, but such is life. Donald Trump lost the election and the US is number 2.

cepr.net

 

[CIA Mole]

View attachment 932416

again america's problems doesn't make xi more viable

Yes, the funniest thing is not only did China not collapse but it actually became the world's largest economy by most measures.

Since 2013.

All this talk about "whether" China will overtake the US in GDP is just silly copium. It has already happened and China is already a MUCH larger economy (20% more) by any reasonable measure.

China is the World’s Largest Economy: Get Over It

Some folks seem to find it hard to accept that the US does not have the world’s largest economy, but such is life. Donald Trump lost the election and the US is number 2.

cepr.net

View attachment 932414

View attachment 932415

chinese economy could still grow 7-8% if terrorking xi is removed

 

[GiantPanda]

again america's problems doesn't make xi more viable



chinese economy could still grow 7-8% if terrorking xi is removed

Who cares. China is the biggest economy on earth and will continue to grow until its per capita income reaches that of Shanghai or Hong Kong nationwide. No matter who is in charge.

 

[CIA Mole]

Who cares. China is the biggest economy on earth and will continue to grow until its per capita income reaches that of Shanghai or Hong Kong nationwide. No matter who is in charge.

your history have shown you whoever in charge in china is all that matters

 

[renhai]

again america's problems doesn't make xi more viable



chinese economy could still grow 7-8% if terrorking xi is removed

But what does this have to do with me? I just sympathize with your forced execution of the Patriot Act...

 

[GiantPanda]

I want people to look closely at this:

That's like 80% of the world's HSR network.

It's not like building cars (China builds twice as many as the next country) or ships (China had 76% of GLOBAL orders in April, 2023), HSR is building high technology vehicles PLUS infrastructure.

There is simply no other country with the economic and industrial power to do things at this scale. It is the largest economy on earth by a wide margin.

Oh it is 42000kms now in 2023. Added 7000 kms since 2021. Just the addition in two years is several times more than the next country. lol

 

[CIA Mole]

But what does this have to do with me? I just sympathize with your forced execution of the Patriot Act...

I want people to look closely at this:
View attachment 932417

That's like 80% of the world's HSR network.

It's not like building cars (China builds twice as many as the next country) or ships (China had 76% of GLOBAL orders in April, 2023), HSR is building high technology vehicles PLUS infrastructure.

There is simply no other country with the economic and industrial power to do things at this scale. It is the largest economy on earth by a wide margin.

Oh it is 42000kms now in 2023. Added 7000 kms since 2021. Just the addition in two years is several times more than the next country. lol

doesnt change fact xi is a terrorist

 

[F-22Raptor]

Please, if China could produce an endless amount of empty buildings then it is surely a bigger economy than the US. I bet the US can't build one city to house its homeless if it tried. China builds dozens of so-called "Ghost Cities" that usually fill up in a few years or so.

But evennif they are a complete waste, they show that China has the hard economic power to build things on scale the US can't.

China is simply a much larger economy in every sense of the term.

Nope, there’s no such thing as a national cost of living, thereby making PPP worthless on a national scale. China is not a larger economy no matter how many times you try and convince yourself. The cope is real

 

[GiantPanda]

Nope, there’s no such thing as a national cost of living, thereby making PPP worthless on a national scale. China is not a larger economy no matter how many times you try and convince yourself. The cope is real

You are the one coping. There is no such thing in the real world as a "nominal" -- meaning a made up or arbitrary -- value . Again, all it takes is for China to change the RMB peg to the Dollar and boom! China can have a bigger nominal GDP instantly. Even you can see the stupidity in such a system.

The only real measure is what you can make, what you consume and what you can do. And China makes, consumes and does stuff on a scale that US can't.

Seriously, only an idiot would think that the US using less than half the electricity of China would somehow end up with a bigger economy. The only way you can make things without energy is to make them up in your mind:

 

[jhungary]

Even easier thing to compare and win the argument on more conclusively versus the CCP spambots:

Largest Chinese companies by market capitalization

List of the largest companies in China by market capitalization, all rankings are updated daily.

companiesmarketcap.com

Largest American companies by market capitalization

List of the largest american companies by market capitalization, all rankings are updated daily.

companiesmarketcap.com

One can easily see where the Chinese economy is over leveraged on (things to do with real estate and banking finance regarding that) and where the "money where your mouth is" capacities actually are regarding innovation companies.

Simply put, the Chinese themselves (even with the current demographic dividend + earning potential before that sunsets) dont really see their "innovation" companies as that worthwhile to invest in....especially after the CCP crackdown on parts of the service industry.

PRC will just be another Soviet Union in the end...a larger version of it, with more market forces allowed to operate to some degree.....but in the end the upcoming demographic collapse is going to be brutal on PRC (whatever the other consequences of that will be)....their breakout does not have the raw institutional credibility, heft and sustainability long term....as they simply do not have the free enough system to achieve those tiers.

@gambit @jhungary @VCheng

A country can't stay a manufacture base forever, condition and progress will move you away from that because competition will grow (even tho most Chinese member here think otherwise) and the condition is going to make manufacturing industry unviable. Which is why most western countries have a fully function service industry.

The problem is, if the Chinese develop their service industry, then power would need to shift from central government to the individual owner, which is what Jack Ma rant on before he "Disappeared" but that means the government will lose regulatory power, and that's a big No-No for the Chinese. Until the Chinese realise this, they are going to stay in this state until one day the profit margin felt below and the demand shifted elsewhere, and when China had not developed an advnace service economy by then, then it would be like robbing the bank and left holding the bag.