Wrong fatwa of Kufr upon Pakistani Constitution

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

People---young pakistanis---young muslims---please understand the difference between 'usury' and simple interest

lol hahaha
this is trolling, and you stupid same answers to everything isnt?
dude you brain is frozen in time and you keep repeating the last thought you had before the freeze, like a broken record, still totally nonsense



Like I said it does not put any barriers whatsoever, for example I inquired about Islamic mortgage in Canada and here is how it works. you pay 25% down so you own 25% of that property, you make mortgage payment which is called rent on 75% and plus you pay some more towards your principle. So when I worked out Islamic and capitalistic banking, my mortgage stood the same for 25 years mortgage. For trade you just pay pay service charges anyway its not called interest.

Hi,

As muslims are supposed to follow the 'law of the land' --- then why the islamic banking be available in a country which has a fair banking system of its own.

 

[FunkyGen]

Keep crying baby---Islam and democracy is not compatible!

So what are your suggestions, Genius!? Maybe we should go back 1400 years, eh? And yeah maybe you're right Islam and democracy are not compatible i'd still go with democracy though, i have seen enough Islam in here, just wish it was less deadly. Just look around you dude, you are sitting in France without being worried that the next time you are in a crowded market you might get blown up, and trust me dude you can call me a coward but i have nightmares about it, that's why i'm saying that before typing a comment think about yours and ours (Pakistanis living in Pakistan) position.

What's wrong with living in france?

Please read my above stated reply you'll know my concern.

As a muslim and as pakistani, i have all rights to judge pakistan and pakistani constitution.

Yes you do, but i wish that you'd do something about it too, other than being a keyboard warrior which we all are (few exceptions might be there, FEW ).

1. Laws that are defined in basic in the Quran..and given an exemplary implementation for the 6th Century in the Sunnah. Even in the Sunnah, the laws evolved to meet the requirements of the time.. or rather the conditions that existed. The more stronger and more concrete Muslim rule.. the more strict the laws.. that is not in Pakistan.

Any examples Sir? Well.... except from Saudis of course! And IMP religious laws are never going to work in Pakistan, not only do we have a diverse society but also very diverse minds unwilling to accept anything other than what our own minds interpret and not to mention Islamic laws have MANY interpretations.

 

[Fracker]

No personal attacks please.

I have been respectful in letting you know that one SHOULD NOT quote single verses.

2:275 is part of a s"story" that Allah swt is relaying to us. And you must start reading the whole section, right after Allah showed the miracle of creating life.

Thank you.

p.s.
Islamist scholars with perhaps an exception of one or two are the most despicable people on earth

They are like the hypcrites of Mohammad pbuh time. Don't be their follower.

apologies for my arrogance.

Sorry it will be hard to give up following a scholars since they are specialists of their field. Like we go to doctors...

And some time there are constrains which keep people away from right path, but it doesnt mean he is hypocrite. We are humans and should understand limitations of each others. Since Islam teach us another thing as well, ' Ammar bil marouf nahin anal munqir'

May Allah guide us all, and save us from Harram.. Ameen.

 

[Secur]

One thing is for sure your all forgetting the British have left rules that have not changed from day one the whole system is currupt taliban have a point I think you guys need to no your history no country in the world has full sharia law that's a fact Pakistan definintly doesn't.thats a fact

The system is corrupt not because of the Crown , but because of the people and their elected representative . Maybe you should come back to Pakistan to enjoy the glorious Taliban ideology and practices and their laws . You are criticizing the British despite sitting in the same country , that is beyond me . Otherwise , explain to me , how the same darned system of governance is working in your " present country " more than fine , but not for us .

Lately , I have seen this trend amongst Pakistanis living in foreign countries and passing judgements of how good can the Islamic system be , for our country , whilst enjoying the same secular/liberal/infidel laws in their country of residence . However they do not want the same " great and one magical solution " to all our country's problem in their own Dar-ul-Harb . Ironic , eh ? I suggest they come here and live some years to understand " what we are talking about " .

Next , they aren't even aware properly of the reality on ground in this country and what wonders the rampant Islamism and subsequent radicalization has done for Pakistan and what do Pakistanis go through each through and what they have to face - a long term side effect of the ill advised " Jihad " in the 80's .

 

[Informant]

One thing is for sure your all forgetting the British have left rules that have not changed from day one the whole system is currupt taliban have a point I think you guys need to no your history no country in the world has full sharia law that's a fact Pakistan definintly doesn't.thats a fact

If you're so interested in Taliban, go live for a year in Afghanistan. Spare us your bullshit lectures.

 

[xyxmt]

Hi,

People---young pakistanis---young muslims---please understand the difference between 'usury' and simple interest



Hi,

As muslims are supposed to follow the 'law of the land' --- then why the islamic banking be available in a country which has a fair banking system of its own.

yes if thats the only option you have available, I dont know much about the banking laws but mortgage companies are not banks but like credit unions.

 

[FaujHistorian]

...... I have seen this trend amongst Pakistanis living in foreign countries and passing judgements of how good can the Islamic system be , for our country , whilst enjoying the same secular/liberal/infidel laws in their country of residence .

Well said.

Sometimes I wonder if these West settled Pakistanis are our biggest enemies.

Why?

They want to enjoy all the freedoms but they want to make sure people in Pakistan get forked day and night with burning red hot steel rods

in Talibarbarian hell.



So sad to see this mortal enemy like behavior from those who themselves or their forefathers were born in Pakistan.

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

Mortgage companies are banks who lend money for mortgage loans and charge interest. Credit unions are banks. They lend money and charge interest.

By 'Law of the land' I mean---existing legal practises of that nation.

The bottomline is that all this means nothing---if the muslims don't provide justice and equality to the masses---they will keep having major internal issues in their nations.

Interest free mortgage and banking----stoning women to death---insulting the Prophet---desecration of qura'an---killing of minorities---lying in testimony---contaminating food with inferior items---producing an inferior product---and things like these are of a major threat that is facing the world of islam.

Muslims world over have taken over the traits of dishonesty---and that is a bigger problem than anything else.

 

[PWFI]

So what are your suggestions, Genius!? Maybe we should go back 1400 years, eh? And yeah maybe you're right Islam and democracy are not compatible i'd still go with democracy though, i have seen enough Islam in here, just wish it was less deadly. Just look around you dude, you are sitting in France without being worried that the next time you are in a crowded market you might get blown up, and trust me dude you can call me a coward but i have nightmares about it, that's why i'm saying that before typing a comment think about yours and ours (Pakistanis living in Pakistan) position.

i won't say anything, since i am living in a secular state myself, But what you think about Islam is completely wrong, and what Tehrik e taliban Pantagon is doing have nothing to do with Islam, that for sure!

 

[FaujHistorian]

apologies for my arrogance.

Sorry it will be hard to give up following a scholars since they are specialists of their field. Like we go to doctors...

And some time there are constrains which keep people away from right path, but it doesnt mean he is hypocrite. We are humans and should understand limitations of each others. Since Islam teach us another thing as well, ' Ammar bil marouf nahin anal munqir'

May Allah guide us all, and save us from Harram.. Ameen.

Here are some very simple questions that you must ask YOURSELF

--- When you have question about your eyes, you go to ophthalmologist and not a Mullah
--- When you have question about your teeth, you go to dentist and not a Mullah
--- When you have question about your knee, you go to orthopedic doctor and not a Mullah

--- When your wife, sister, daughter etc are going to have a baby, you take them to a gynecologist

or

you tell your women that here is Islamic scholar Mullah fulana fulana in our Mohallah who will make sure the baby is delivered correctly.

Do you? Do you?

In all these cases, do you ever wonder how Khulfa Rashideen treated the eyes, the teeth, the knee, or delivered babies?

Heck NO!

Because you know very well that whatever treatment was used back in 600 AD has been superseded by 20th century methods


Then why on earth, a normal, educated man would suddenly get this urge to run to the pathetic two-bit Mullahs when they have questions about banking systems.


Just Like Allah swt never wrote detailed instructions in Quran for
--- treating the eyes
--- fixing the teeth
--- doing surgery on the knee


AND

the most important aspect of our lives

-- delivering babies



And yet
-- you walk like zombies straight towards Mullahs when it comes to economy


What is this

if not pure jahiliyyah


Quran is a collection of stories and morals Do not use it as book of science, economy, biology, chemistry, and astronomy

Because you will be violating the very essence of Quran.

 

[Secur]

Hi,

Thank you----there is no such thing as islamic law----or shariah law---that was the law of the arabs.

Pakistanis need justice---the problem in getting justice is not in the enforcement of shariah law or lack of it----it is due the lack of a back bone in the prime minister of pakistan who cannot enforce any law.

The problem with shariah enforcers is that the first thing they want to do is to STONE women---that is all they want to do----. There are a million and one other problems destroying the society---but all the taliban want to do is to suppress women.

More than half the taliban are active in sodomy---pornography---stealing and robbing----drugs and drug smuggling---they have no issues with these evils.

The taliban don't have a war waging against corrupt officials---criminals who have looted and plundered the nation---they don't have a problem with criminals who have built sub standard items for the state or those who mix harmful items in food----but the only thing they know of are stoning the women for fornication and whipping them for not covering up---they don't have a problem with those who have destroyed the railways or the air force.

But say talk about a woman wholding her bare hand out of the burqa---and they are ready to chop it up.



You know how mentally sick the muslim community is----they will argue about the intricacies of interest and sood and shariah a million times----but none will fight for the justice for the weak and the poor----.

That is why these muslims are cursed all over the world---. They are suffering from the wrath of Allah---for they have not provided HIS weak and the poor with justice and equality---.

For that reason---the muslims all over the world will stay cursed.

Sir , one thing we all need to understand that Muslims and specially that of Subcontinent have always mistook Arabism and Arabic culture for Islam and tried to get away as far they can from their " own culture " and reject and hate it , in one way or other . What they do not understand that the religion never forbade culture of the people , to be followed , it just couldn't . The problem with my countrymen that they are a confused bunch who are still in a " bamboozled state " if the country was supposed to be secular or Islamic * The Jinnah debate * and what system of governance is best for the nation .

The problem with the " Mullah Brigade " and " Shariah enforcers " and the people agreeing with them either in principle or more dangerous in its practicality , is the fact they are idealist and not realists . Hypocrites of the highest order too . They do not seem to understand their " locus of control " and their limitations . There's very little knowledge of the world with them and how it runs - all they have in abundance is the delusion of a perfect world - an utopia . They do not want to solve basic problems or try to increase the quality of life , but will talk all day long against the modernity , the West and the infidels and the vices or the ways of the men and how people or the society have gone unislamic . Hence the reason , you see this emphasis only on stoning , beheading , killing , maiming , blasting and chopping off people for their " perceived wrong as per their interpretations of the religion " . They think they have a one stop " broad spectrum cure " to all the problems and ills they face - a wunderwaffe if you will .

What they fail to see , that their outdated 6th century laws which aren't modified or reviewed and made compatible with the requirements of the modern era - since well according to them - its supposed to remain " static " , " fixed " and carved in stone - have little respect and recognition amongst the literates and every person with a free and critical thinking mind ( not talking about the people high on the opiate of the masses ) and hence the continuous resistance they face to enforcing the " God's laws " in different Muslims countries by the same Muslims . This TTP ideology of " Caliphate and Sharia on gun point and psychopathic violence " isn't limited to Pakistan , it is present under different names in various Muslim and non Muslim countries and the response from the people for their " perfect system " is more than evident too .

Case in Point : This country's constitution is as Islamic as it gets , you can implement Islam within the framework of this system - the same damned democracy . But need I remind anyone of the people's response to the religious parties and their agenda in the last 60 years , who if they get the majority required to legislate , can do whatever they want with the consent of the governed and most importantly peacefully ?

 

[Fracker]

Here are some very simple questions that you must ask YOURSELF

--- When you have question about your eyes, you go to ophthalmologist and not a Mullah
--- When you have question about your teeth, you go to dentist and not a Mullah
--- When you have question about your knee, you go to orthopedic doctor and not a Mullah

--- When your wife, sister, daughter etc are going to have a baby, you take them to a gynecologist

or

you tell your women that here is Islamic scholar Mullah fulana fulana in our Mohallah who will make sure the baby is delivered correctly.

Do you? Do you?

In all these cases, do you ever wonder how Khulfa Rashideen treated the eyes, the teeth, the knee, or delivered babies?

Heck NO!

Because you know very well that whatever treatment was used back in 600 AD has been superseded by 20th century methods


Then why on earth, a normal, educated man would suddenly get this urge to run to the pathetic two-bit Mullahs when they have questions about banking systems.


Just Like Allah swt never wrote detailed instructions in Quran for
--- treating the eyes
--- fixing the teeth
--- doing surgery on the knee


AND

the most important aspect of our lives

-- delivering babies



And yet
-- you walk like zombies straight towards Mullahs when it comes to economy


What is this

if not pure jahiliyyah


Quran is a collection of stories and morals Do not use it as book of science, economy, biology, chemistry, and astronomy

Because you will be violating the very essence of Quran.

Lol, i thought you gonna say;

if you have a religious matter you will goto Islamic Scholar.

It's not a Job of Scholar's Job to dilver a baby, but certainly what need to be done after delivery so he become muslim it is. And who told you that these was no doctors 1400 years ago? Health care is as old as Human history. Even at that time people used to go to the doctors, those who wanted to build house used to go to the builders, barbers, etc.

If you have some financial mater ofcourse you will go to the financial specialist to get advice, And may be then next line would be, if you want to murder someone you will go to a killer, or if you want to rob, you might need training from some thief. Possibilities can be endless. Those might also be just some business as usual for some people , but our religion speaks about righteous and wrongs in every field. And financial maters are no exception to that.

Pure Jahiliyyah would be,
- My doctor tell me i have might be a issue in my heart, and now i have to consult Cardiologists, and I say, what the hell i feel fine why should i consult?
- I call my self a muslim, I know Quran forbidden Ribba, but still go for same thing since I think!.

Quran is not just book of stories, it pure guidance for the muslims to the right Path till the world end.

 

[FaujHistorian]

Lol, i thought you gonna say;

if you have a religious matter you will goto Islamic Scholar.

It's not a Job of Scholar's Job to dilver a baby, but certainly what need to be done after delivery so he become muslim it is. And who told you that these was no doctors 1400 years ago? Health care is as old as Human history. Even at that time people used to go to the doctors, those who wanted to build house used to go to the builders, barbers, etc.

If you have some financial mater ofcourse you will go to the financial specialist to get advice, And may be then next line would be, if you want to murder someone you will go to a killer, or if you want to rob, you might need training from some thief. Possibilities can be endless. Those might also be just some business as usual for some people , but our religion speaks about righteous and wrongs in every field. And financial maters are no exception to that.

Pure Jahiliyyah would be,
- My doctor tell me i have might be a issue in my heart, and now i have to consult Cardiologists, and I say, what the hell i feel fine why should i consult?
- I call my self a muslim, I know Quran forbidden Ribba, but still go for same thing since I think!.

Quran is not just book of stories, it pure guidance for the muslims to the right Path till the world end.

Now you are making a joke out of serious subject.


For most of us, from early childhood we are all taught our religion and thus we can read stuff ourselves.

But

We are all not taught economy, or medicine etc. from the childhood.

Mullah is optional when it comes to daily practice of religion.

But doctor is not.


you are gravely mistaken about your understanding of Quran

Because you follow Mullahtic idiots who read one verse and issue fat fat fatwas.

It is time you quit spreading misinformation and out of context stuff from Quran


Allah swt has strictly forbidden to quote Quran out of context.

Thank you

 

[Fracker]

Now you are making a joke out of serious subject.


For most of us, from early childhood we are all taught our religion and thus we can read stuff ourselves.

But

We are all not taught economy, or medicine etc. from the childhood.

Mullah is optional when it comes to daily practice of religion.

But doctor is not.


you are gravely mistaken about your understanding of Quran

Because you follow Mullahtic idiots who read one verse and issue fat fat fatwas.

It is time you quit spreading misinformation and out of context stuff from Quran


Allah swt has strictly forbidden to quote Quran out of context.

Thank you

Unless your daily life don't include Islam as basic need, you will never require a scholar to give you islamic lesson. unless you don't want to differentiate right from wrong still it will never. You don't want to follow islamic code in your business then as well you will never need a Quran reference or Islamic scholar explaining.

My understanding of Quran may be incorrect, but I know without Quran guidance following I am not a muslim at all.

PS: I didn't pick that versus out of contest, all scholars do accept this Ayah contest is same. If i read english translation, it also confirm same. But yet you are arguing about thing where clear you are mistaking. Come on..

 

[FaujHistorian]

Unless your daily life don't include Islam as basic need, you will never require a scholar to give you islamic lesson. .

That's the point bro.

I have seen 50 years old asking childish nay utterly $tupid questions from a so-called scholar.

And that's OK by me as long as that 50 years old or 40 or 30 or 20 keep this as his personal business like how to clean his balls after a dump.

I thought dude! Hey old f@rt dude, where the fork were you born.

did your mum dad didn't teach how to wash your balls.

Huh

Did they give you birth in a cave and left you out there with bunch of monkeys that you come here and ask this "scholar"

Hey scholar what is the Islamic method of washing balls.

Me and buddies wanted to roll on the floor laughing looking at this old dude who is mocking nay forking the whole damn religion.

And the most horrible thing was that the so called scholar instead of saying "wear diapers dude" you don't deserve to be answered
on this question,.

No that scholar launches into this long turdy discussion like according to Islam, you hold your weewee this way, you move your balls this way, you hold lotta (water jug) this way, you pour the forking water this way.


And the whole damn audience (minus me and buddies) were like wow scholar, you really know the Islamic way of washing balls.

Wah ji wah. Wah molana, wah


This is what has come down to my dear poster this what has come down.

Our global concerns of 50 year old men wondering Islamic way of washing balls.

yeah. Islam is complete code of life. No doubt

We all must go to a Mullah and Aytaullah 5 times a day asking him how to wash our noggins.

Pathetic. Dare I say pathetic.

.....
PS: I didn't pick that versus out of contest, all scholars do accept this Ayah contest is same. If i read english translation, it also confirm same. But yet you are arguing about thing where clear you are mistaking. Come on..

Do you bro

even know what it means "context"?

Because you are still refusing to stop quoting one single Ayah

Sorry to see.