Why there won’t be an anti-terrorists million man march in the Arab/Muslim world

[Solomon2]

Saturday, January 17, 2015

Why there won’t be an anti-terrorists million man march in the Arab/Muslim world

The vast majority of terrorists’ victims are Muslims. One poll after the other reassures that citizens of Arab/Muslim countries are against what the jihad-inspired terrorists do. But why is there so little public reaction against terrorists especially if most of the victims are Muslims? The answer is threefold: denial, sense of victimhood and lack of religious reformation.

Denial:

Many in the Arab/Muslim world would rather keep their eyes shut towards certain realities that they don’t like, including the fact that there are psychopathic bloodthirsty maniacs who call themselves Muslims. Denial mixed with chauvinism is huge in the Arab/Muslim world: we follow the best religion, we don’t have any homosexuals, we don’t have kids having premarital sex and definitely we don’t have terrorists. Denial is a river that runs across the Arab/Muslim world and not just in Egypt.

Sense of victimhood:

It is more comfortable to be confined in your sense of victimhood than look in the mirror and admit that something is wrong with you. This is how the Arab/Muslim world is reacting. It is so cocooned in the impression that the entire world is conspiring against it and it would rather indulge in that feeling than embrace the painful admission that there is something wrong, something rotten, within it. This is the reason why massive demonstrations would erupt when Israel attacks Gaza and kills Palestinians or when some Danish cartoonist draws the Prophet yet the massacre of school kids in Peshawar by the Taliban would trigger a much feebler response. Following the Peshawar massacre, moments of silence were held across schools in India; it was business as usual in Egyptian schools.

Lack of religious reformation:

Every religion believes that it is the best; however, what differentiates Islam from its fellow Abrahamic faiths is the lack of any critical thinking at the present moment. Christianity, after years of corrupt church rule, entered the furnace of critical thinking resulting in the Reformation. Jewish scholars produced various interpretations of their faith, ranging from the sane to the crazy. When a Jewish Orthodox magazine removed female politicians from the Paris March photo, the world did not freak out because the rest of the Jews made fun of that magazine. Islam does not have that at the moment because critical thinkers are killed, flogged or tarnished.

Islam that was once rich in scholarship and analysis got reduced to one puritanical line of thought that dominates the current religious discourse. This line of thought cannot revolt against terrorists because it shares many of the things that terrorists do and believe in. Take stoning the adulterer as an example. It is not practiced anywhere outside areas that are under the control of hardline extremists such as ISIS and the Taliban. Very few in the Arab/Muslim world would welcome the legislation of such a cruel punishment; however, very few would actually confidently say that it is not sanctioned by religion as a punishment for adultery. This is the problem. Stoning is mentioned in Islam’s religious texts just as it is mentioned in the Christian and Jewish holy books. Christians and Jews managed to find an interpretation that makes stoning an unacceptable behavior in today’s world, however, the Islamic religious discourse is still mired in the outdated interpretations of the ancient religious texts because critical thinkers, such as the Saudi blogger Raif Badawi, get flogged.

There won’t be a million man march in the Arab/Muslim world against terrorists because there is no strong religious counter argument to refute these terrorists.

 

[OldenWisdom...قول بزرگ]

I don't know when you were born but a world existed before 2001. Muslim grievances real or perceived have a background that Muslims understand better. I don't think is worth responding to aforementioned reasons as I have pretty much had enough of everyone being an expert on all things Muslim.

 

[Foggy_Bottom]

I don't know when you were born but a world existed before 2001. Muslim grievances real or perceived have a background that Muslims understand better. I don't think is worth responding to aforementioned reasons as I have pretty much had enough of everyone being an expert on all things Muslim.

If you notice the title it is about muslims from the Arab/Muslim world- and not about American Muslims

 

[sree45]

Because deep down they support some of the actions.

 

[Viper0011.]

The vast majority of terrorists’ victims are Muslims. One poll after the other reassures that citizens of Arab/Muslim countries are against what the jihad-inspired terrorists do. But why is there so little public reaction against terrorists especially if most of the victims are Muslims? The answer is threefold: denial, sense of victimhood and lack of religious reformation..

This is pretty much my understanding and research on this topic as well. I also have a couple of additional items that contribute to this issue. I'll add to the top three, so my stuff will start from number 4:
4) Threat of retaliation from violent fractions
5) Sociology-Economical backlash / Alienation
6) Lack of higher education
7) Lack of democratic systems
8) Lack of opportunity - individual / family's financial improvement

If number 6,7,8 can be fixed, I think we should expect a sea of change in the Muslim world. However, it is their respective leaderships responsibility to provide better education to masses, create a People based system so people get to vote who they want. The elected leaders' should then create opportunity for people's financial growth and bring about real modern change.

Because deep down they support some of the actions.

That can be said for any nation or religion. I've just had a debate about Hindu nationalists, who are forcing Christians and Muslims to forcefully change their religions, and there have been thousands killed over decades in India. Folks from India tried to cover the topic up and made many personal attacks and all against me.

I can just as easily say that these people on here in fact support the Hindu nationalists agenda to convert all Christians and Muslims to Hinduism or the killings of minorities. But I also know that I personally have Hindu friends who even being Hindus, don't like or appreciate the treatment of minorities in India. So I can't really generalize the entire country, whether its India or Egypt or Pakistan.

The thing is that, you'll always have an element of a society filled with people with strong religious sentiment and these people will make an effort to convert others towards them. Every religion has it. What people around these religious nut cases need to do, is to ensure that these religious nuts don't take steps to jeopardize peace and stability. There should never be any force applied to innocent humans no matter what believe system they come from. People are people and they deserve the right to live their life peacefully. But if someone converts on their own, their shouldn't be any stopping. In my opinion, all is good without hurting anyone. When someone gets hurt due to another one's religious beliefs, it becomes religious terrorism.

 

[Winchester]

Because deep down they support some of the actions.

And you have come to this conclusion by interacting with your fellow Indian Muslims???
.
.
If so than you guys have a huge problem !

 

[blood]

also because of fear , there is a small minority of liberals amongst muslims who wouldn't dare to convince the rest of the majority on whats wrong within islam because instantly they would be treated as an outcast and punished for expressing themselves . So they continue to remain silent to avoid any trouble .

remember what happened with tasmila nasreen and worse would have happened had she been from the middle east .

 

[Imran Khan]

because millions of Muslims think terror is ok and its way to impose sharia law. they support terrorists

 

[sree45]

And you have come to this conclusion by interacting with your fellow Indian Muslims???
.
.
If so than you guys have a huge problem !

Indian muslims are a lot saner and moderate than any arab/wannabe arab Muslims.

@orangzaib
Compare the reaction of Muslims and Islamic countries to Kashmir and Palestine problem and their reaction to radical Islam.

Even though the later is a bigger problem to their culture and way of life, you will find them being soft on it.

 

[Winchester]

Indian muslims are a lot saner and moderate than any arab/wannabe arab Muslims.

So the only Muslims you have interacted with in your real life don't feel this way !
.
.
That begs the question how did you come to the conclusion of Muslims supporting these acts deep down
Are you a mind reader Guru or something???
Maybe using some ancient Indian technology for that !
If not than it would be like me saying
"Rape happens in India because Indian men support some of it deep down"

 

[OldenWisdom...قول بزرگ]

I'm just going to flip the coin here... that may rationalize for some what is going on and for others well who knows... the fundamental issue and whose blow back we are seeing in this day and age is due to the power vacuum created after the dissolution of 'Ottoman Empire'. Blow back and insurgency come from inadequate or non existent dispute resolution. For over a century middle east has been grappling with this issue and to a large extent European colonialism. Current regimes owe there existence to their former overlords. In fact so much so that the penal codes are still the same as English common law in much of these countries. Another major issue is inadequate education system that produces nothing but slaves to the system who just tow the party line. I know everybody's gripe here 'oh but the extremist Muslim' well oddly enough large proportions of Muslims have been very successfully weaned off the basics of Islam hence leaving individuals with desire to learn at the behest of the mullah and his pedigree. So my friends I'm sorry couldn't come up with anything sensational. Though maybe an appetite to learn just maybe...

 

[Chak Bamu]

because millions of Muslims think terror is ok and its way to impose sharia law. they support terrorists

Maybe a million or two are like that, but then more than a billion are not like that.

Complaining about less than 1% people from among a diverse group is not right.

Old fogies like us two might have difficulty in changing our mind-set. But that is not so the case with younger people whose perceptions have been molded by the anti-terrorist narrative.

While we are at it, may I point to the Egyptian police shooting at unarmed and peaceful protesters who were holding flowers to commemorate 25 Jan 2011 (or 12?) events at Tahrir square. These were Egyptian leftists, not Islamists. Shaimaa was a young mother who got shot and died in her husband's arms. I would like to share the picture of her dying in her husband's arms as people are walking in the street and a lone soldier is seen in the back-ground. To me that shows everything that is wrong with Muslim world today. I can not show the picture because it is a bit gory despite its poetic and tragic quality. I am sure you would find it, if you search for this name.

The point is that such simplistic narratives and explanations are motivated and colored by your bias, just like OP.

 

[Viper0011.]

Indian muslims are a lot saner and moderate than any arab/wannabe arab Muslims.

@orangzaib
Compare the reaction of Muslims and Islamic countries to Kashmir and Palestine problem and their reaction to radical Islam.

Even though the later is a bigger problem to their culture and way of life, you will find them being soft on it.

See my responses to your questions in bold:
1) My post was not about Indian Muslims. It was about Hindu fanatics. My case was that you have a lot of Hindus supporting conversions of Christians, Muslims and Sikhs by force, and these minorities have been under the wrath of Hindu fanatics. Thousands and thousands have been killed by Hindu fanatics. So every religion has this extremist element in it. Its not right to just say "Muslims support the extremist behavior", its that all religions have bad sides and some support that terrorism like behavior unfortuntely due to their religious siding with such extremism for their religion's superiority. One of India's federal minister made a statement that by 2030, India will be 100% a Hindu nation only. What does that mean????
It means they'll forcefully convert these minorities into accepting Hinduism or will kill them like before. And this Minister guy and his buddies came into power with MILLIONS of votes so there are sympathizers of extremists in EVERY religion. Which is wrong at all counts. Religion is a personal matter. No group should force its believes by violence on others. Simple is that.

2) Accepting that what's happening inside Indian states (See above), Kashmir or Palestine or Israel is one thing. These are issues that require everyone to sit down and come up with a peaceful solution, WITHOUT violence, terrorism, raping of women, killing of children or blowing up bombs in public places in Israel. None of the violence will help solve these issues. Just like Palestinians want peace, Israelis deserve to live peacefully too. So there needs to be a dialogue.
However, this issue is different than the forceful conversions and killings of minorities happening in Kashmir and India. That's a 80% Hindu majority, bringing a party in power with extremist agenda that then supports creating a 100% Hindu India by 2030 through violence and oppression. So yes, just like in this case, the Hindu followers are supporting extremist based agenda to use force to kill or convert minorities into Hinduism, I am POSITIVE there are some people in the Arab world who will support extremism too. In fact, Saudis sponsored a lot of these issues inside the Arab world. Iran sponsors Hizbullah and Hamas. I don't think there is any denying of it.

3) If you go back and read my first post on this topic, you'll see the meaning behind "soft". The OP did a good job in identifying three elements of WHY this reaction seems soft. But then I added a few more core issues. Like I said, I've not seen a million people's march in India either for the mass killings of Christians and Muslims or rallies in support of Peace and Protection of Minorities. So every culture and religion unfortunately has followers who have extremist based ideas and they want to use force an violence against others and many support it.
In the US, we've discovered a few hard line extremist organizations who are non Muslim. So what does that tell you? A month or so ago, there was a 15 year old child who was literally smashed between a wall of some sort and a truck by the driver as the kid was a muslim. I saw reports on it, the kid's body was cut into two pieces when the police got there. The motive was hate against Islam and the guy who murdered this child in such cold blood, was a Christian guy. There was attacks on Sikh and Hindu temples in the US.
If you watch Fox news, they are so busy bastardizing muslims, including the ones living in the US, that it's sad to see lying at that level. But that's Christian extremists for you. So every religion has its share of some sort of extremism. Which is ok, AS LONG as no human is suffering because of another one's religious views. When other people are terrorized to convert or change or die in the name of religion, that's when it becomes terrorism. Otherwise, religion is a peaceful personal matter and it doesn't need to leave the 4 walls of one's home.

 

[rockstar08]

Why there wont be a Million March in West Against Insult of our Prophet ?

 

[Mav3rick]

Saturday, January 17, 2015

Why there won’t be an anti-terrorists million man march in the Arab/Muslim world

The vast majority of terrorists’ victims are Muslims. One poll after the other reassures that citizens of Arab/Muslim countries are against what the jihad-inspired terrorists do. But why is there so little public reaction against terrorists especially if most of the victims are Muslims? The answer is threefold: denial, sense of victimhood and lack of religious reformation.

Denial:

Many in the Arab/Muslim world would rather keep their eyes shut towards certain realities that they don’t like, including the fact that there are psychopathic bloodthirsty maniacs who call themselves Muslims. Denial mixed with chauvinism is huge in the Arab/Muslim world: we follow the best religion, we don’t have any homosexuals, we don’t have kids having premarital sex and definitely we don’t have terrorists. Denial is a river that runs across the Arab/Muslim world and not just in Egypt.

Sense of victimhood:

It is more comfortable to be confined in your sense of victimhood than look in the mirror and admit that something is wrong with you. This is how the Arab/Muslim world is reacting. It is so cocooned in the impression that the entire world is conspiring against it and it would rather indulge in that feeling than embrace the painful admission that there is something wrong, something rotten, within it. This is the reason why massive demonstrations would erupt when Israel attacks Gaza and kills Palestinians or when some Danish cartoonist draws the Prophet yet the massacre of school kids in Peshawar by the Taliban would trigger a much feebler response. Following the Peshawar massacre, moments of silence were held across schools in India; it was business as usual in Egyptian schools.

Lack of religious reformation:

Every religion believes that it is the best; however, what differentiates Islam from its fellow Abrahamic faiths is the lack of any critical thinking at the present moment. Christianity, after years of corrupt church rule, entered the furnace of critical thinking resulting in the Reformation. Jewish scholars produced various interpretations of their faith, ranging from the sane to the crazy. When a Jewish Orthodox magazine removed female politicians from the Paris March photo, the world did not freak out because the rest of the Jews made fun of that magazine. Islam does not have that at the moment because critical thinkers are killed, flogged or tarnished.

Islam that was once rich in scholarship and analysis got reduced to one puritanical line of thought that dominates the current religious discourse. This line of thought cannot revolt against terrorists because it shares many of the things that terrorists do and believe in. Take stoning the adulterer as an example. It is not practiced anywhere outside areas that are under the control of hardline extremists such as ISIS and the Taliban. Very few in the Arab/Muslim world would welcome the legislation of such a cruel punishment; however, very few would actually confidently say that it is not sanctioned by religion as a punishment for adultery. This is the problem. Stoning is mentioned in Islam’s religious texts just as it is mentioned in the Christian and Jewish holy books. Christians and Jews managed to find an interpretation that makes stoning an unacceptable behavior in today’s world, however, the Islamic religious discourse is still mired in the outdated interpretations of the ancient religious texts because critical thinkers, such as the Saudi blogger Raif Badawi, get flogged.

There won’t be a million man march in the Arab/Muslim world against terrorists because there is no strong religious counter argument to refute these terrorists.

People killed by terrorists V/S People killed by the US Military

Around 100, 000 (around One Hundred Thousand) V/S Over 10 Million (Ten Million ONLY)


Stats calculated on: Past 10 years, around the world.

Apparently, we are using different dictionaries for the definition of the word 'terrorism' and 'victim'!