Why Chengdu J-10C 4.5th Gen Fighter Can Easily Eat Alive F-16 Block 52 ?

[Daniel808]

In case of Taiwan Island Conflict Air Battle between China's Air Force Chengdu J-10C vs ROCAF F-16 Block 52, it will be an easy prey for J-10C pilots to shot down their enemy. It shows us, that Chinese Air Force (Chengdu J-10C) can easily decimated ROCAF (F-16 Block 52) very easily.


The most 2 Fatal Disadvantages of ROCAF F-16 Block 52 compared to China's Air Force Chengdu J-10C are :

1. F-16 Block 52 still using Old Generation AN/APG-68 Pulse Doppler Radar compared to much more Sophisticated KLJ-10 AESA Radar from NRIET onboard Chengdu J-10C



Old Generation AN/APG-68 Pulse Doppler Radar

KLJ-10 AESA Radar from NRIET onboard Chengdu J-10C

F-16 Block 52 still using Pulse Doppler Radar meanwhile Chengdu J-10C already using more sophisticated AESA Radar Technology.




2. For BVR Engagements F-16 Block 52 using AIM-120D Amraam with Max Operational Range of only 160Km, meanwhile Chengdu J-10C using PL-15 BVR Missile with Max Operational Range of more than 300Km


F-16 Block 52 using AIM-120D Amraam with Max Operational Range of only 160Km

Chengdu J-10C using PL-15 BVR Missile with Max Operational Range of more than 300Km

So with more Sophisticated AESA Radar, and more longer range BVR Missile, of course China's Air Force Chengdu J-10C can Detect & Shot ROCAF F-16 Block 52 long before F-16 pilots detect or even have a chance to shot J-10C.


In Modern Air Battle, the One that can Detect & Shot enemy first is the One that can Win the Battle

 

[Daniel808]

In Taiwan Island Conflict Scenario

With Mass Production of Y-20U Strategic Tanker begin Entering Service in China's Air Force, J-10C Fighters can Patrol East Taiwan sky 24 hours non-stop from any Incoming enemy or Any point in ASPAC (Asia Pacific) very easily



Y-20U Strategic Tanker Fleet on China's Air Force Service

Chengdu J-10C Fleet

Via @航空工业成飞 from Weixin

 

[Viet]

In case of Taiwan Island Conflict Air Battle between China's Air Force Chengdu J-10C vs ROCAF F-16 Block 52, it will be an easy prey for J-10C pilots to shot down their enemy. It shows us, that Chinese Air Force (Chengdu J-10C) can easily decimated ROCAF (F-16 Block 52) very easily.


The most 2 Fatal Disadvantages of ROCAF F-16 Block 52 compared to China's Air Force Chengdu J-10C are :

1. F-16 Block 52 still using Old Generation AN/APG-68 Pulse Doppler Radar compared to much more Sophisticated KLJ-10 AESA Radar from NRIET onboard Chengdu J-10C



Old Generation AN/APG-68 Pulse Doppler Radar
View attachment 761301


KLJ-10 AESA Radar from NRIET onboard Chengdu J-10C
View attachment 761302View attachment 761303


F-16 Block 52 still using Pulse Doppler Radar meanwhile Chengdu J-10C already using more sophisticated AESA Radar Technology.




2. For BVR Engagements F-16 Block 52 using AIM-120D Amraam with Max Operational Range of only 160Km, meanwhile Chengdu J-10C using PL-15 BVR Missile with Max Operational Range of more than 300Km


F-16 Block 52 using AIM-120D Amraam with Max Operational Range of only 160Km
View attachment 761304



Chengdu J-10C using PL-15 BVR Missile with Max Operational Range of more than 300Km
View attachment 761305View attachment 761307View attachment 761306


So with more Sophisticated AESA Radar, and more longer range BVR Missile, of course China's Air Force Chengdu J-10C can Detect & Shot ROCAF F-16 Block 52 long before F-16 pilots detect or even have a chance to shot J-10C.


In Modern Air Battle, the One that can Detect & Shot enemy first is the One that can Win the Battle

You are biased. When coming to vaccines chinese old fashioned inactivated are superior ok, much modern mRna are too risky. Just the latter come from other countries.
you will probably say the opposite if China uses Doppler radars. They are certainly superior to AESA radars.

 

[Genghis khan1]

In case of Taiwan Island Conflict Air Battle between China's Air Force Chengdu J-10C vs ROCAF F-16 Block 52, it will be an easy prey for J-10C pilots to shot down their enemy. It shows us, that Chinese Air Force (Chengdu J-10C) can easily decimated ROCAF (F-16 Block 52) very easily.


The most 2 Fatal Disadvantages of ROCAF F-16 Block 52 compared to China's Air Force Chengdu J-10C are :

1. F-16 Block 52 still using Old Generation AN/APG-68 Pulse Doppler Radar compared to much more Sophisticated KLJ-10 AESA Radar from NRIET onboard Chengdu J-10C



Old Generation AN/APG-68 Pulse Doppler Radar
View attachment 761301


KLJ-10 AESA Radar from NRIET onboard Chengdu J-10C
View attachment 761302View attachment 761303


F-16 Block 52 still using Pulse Doppler Radar meanwhile Chengdu J-10C already using more sophisticated AESA Radar Technology.




2. For BVR Engagements F-16 Block 52 using AIM-120D Amraam with Max Operational Range of only 160Km, meanwhile Chengdu J-10C using PL-15 BVR Missile with Max Operational Range of more than 300Km


F-16 Block 52 using AIM-120D Amraam with Max Operational Range of only 160Km
View attachment 761304



Chengdu J-10C using PL-15 BVR Missile with Max Operational Range of more than 300Km
View attachment 761305View attachment 761307View attachment 761306


So with more Sophisticated AESA Radar, and more longer range BVR Missile, of course China's Air Force Chengdu J-10C can Detect & Shot ROCAF F-16 Block 52 long before F-16 pilots detect or even have a chance to shot J-10C.


In Modern Air Battle, the One that can Detect & Shot enemy first is the One that can Win the Battle

APG-83 AESA Radars to Improve F-16 Air-to-Air, Air-to-Ground Performance

Last December, the Air Force awarded Northrop Grumman a contract potentially worth $1 billion for 372 of the radars.

 

[TheSnakeEatingMarkhur]

APG-83 AESA Radars to Improve F-16 Air-to-Air, Air-to-Ground Performance

Last December, the Air Force awarded Northrop Grumman a contract potentially worth $1 billion for 372 of the radars.

Don't worry we will know everything once we get J10Cs

 

[Daniel808]

APG-83 AESA Radars to Improve F-16 Air-to-Air, Air-to-Ground Performance

Last December, the Air Force awarded Northrop Grumman a contract potentially worth $1 billion for 372 of the radars.

Good then, but unfortunately APG-83 is still kinda inferior compared to APG-80 on F-16V

For reference :
The APG-80 is the AESA radar on UAE’s Block 60 F-16s while the APG-83 is a Scalable radar that is available to both older F-16s (Block 20 to 50) and the current Block 70 F-16.

The APG-83’s scalable design allows it to be integrated into all F-16s going back to Block 20 as in case of Taiwan.[1] However, performance of a retrofitted APG-83 will be limited by the cooling capacity of the aircraft which was designed for a Mechanical radar. So APG-83 on older F-16s will have lower peak power and therefore, smaller range than APG-80 on Block 60 but its a major performance upgrade for the older F-16s flying with Mechanical radars.
https://www.quora.com/Which-one-APG...wer-theoretically-higher-resolution-and-range




Meanwhile, China's KLJ-10 AESA Radar from NRIET onboard J-10C is in the same level of APG-80 AESA Radar, if not Superior.

Because KLJ-10 AESA Radar from NRIET itself have more than 1,200 T/R Modules compared to APG-80 with 1,000 T/R Modules

APG-80 with 1,000 T/R Modules onboard F-16V

KLJ-10 AESA Radar from NRIET with more than 1,200 T/R Modules onboard J-10C

You are biased. When coming to vaccines chinese old fashioned inactivated are superior ok, much modern mRna are too risky. Just the latter come from other countries.
you will probably say the opposite if China uses Doppler radars. They are certainly superior to AESA radars.

You are the one that biased, mister viet.


Everyone knows that AESA Radar are much better & sophisticated than Old tech Pulse doppler radar

 

[khanmubashir]

In case of Taiwan Island Conflict Air Battle between China's Air Force Chengdu J-10C vs ROCAF F-16 Block 52, it will be an easy prey for J-10C pilots to shot down their enemy. It shows us, that Chinese Air Force (Chengdu J-10C) can easily decimated ROCAF (F-16 Block 52) very easily.


The most 2 Fatal Disadvantages of ROCAF F-16 Block 52 compared to China's Air Force Chengdu J-10C are :

1. F-16 Block 52 still using Old Generation AN/APG-68 Pulse Doppler Radar compared to much more Sophisticated KLJ-10 AESA Radar from NRIET onboard Chengdu J-10C



Old Generation AN/APG-68 Pulse Doppler Radar
View attachment 761301


KLJ-10 AESA Radar from NRIET onboard Chengdu J-10C
View attachment 761302View attachment 761303


F-16 Block 52 still using Pulse Doppler Radar meanwhile Chengdu J-10C already using more sophisticated AESA Radar Technology.




2. For BVR Engagements F-16 Block 52 using AIM-120D Amraam with Max Operational Range of only 160Km, meanwhile Chengdu J-10C using PL-15 BVR Missile with Max Operational Range of more than 300Km


F-16 Block 52 using AIM-120D Amraam with Max Operational Range of only 160Km
View attachment 761304



Chengdu J-10C using PL-15 BVR Missile with Max Operational Range of more than 300Km
View attachment 761305View attachment 761307View attachment 761306


So with more Sophisticated AESA Radar, and more longer range BVR Missile, of course China's Air Force Chengdu J-10C can Detect & Shot ROCAF F-16 Block 52 long before F-16 pilots detect or even have a chance to shot J-10C.


In Modern Air Battle, the One that can Detect & Shot enemy first is the One that can Win the Battle

Well as 27 Feb 19 air battles showed it's not just fighter jets but entire network of assets that results in success

Btw the mere size of Chinese military guarantees success

But issue is what's next
Taiwan being global supplier of chips and electronics would affect global economy

Resulting in serious backlash against China

Perhaps USA won't come to liberate it like it came for Kuwait under Iraq
But still the world will be divided
And Chinese would have to spend great resources to keep control of Taiwan

Which can become it's Vietnam or Afghanistan

But most probably if China attacks Taiwan USA would already dispatched stationed it's military there seeing worsening conditions
And then attacking Taiwan would be doing a pearl harbor to USA
Giving USA justification And push for a full war

A war in which both sides would suffer badly .and if goes nuclear
No one will be left

 

[Daniel808]

Well as 27 Feb 19 air battles showed it's not just fighter jets but entire network of assets that results in success

Btw the mere size of Chinese military guarantees success

But issue is what's next
Taiwan being global supplier of chips and electronics would affect global economy

Resulting in serious backlash against China

Perhaps USA won't come to liberate it like it came for Kuwait under Iraq
But still the world will be divided
And Chinese would have to spend great resources to keep control of Taiwan

Which can become it's Vietnam or Afghanistan

But most probably if China attacks Taiwan USA would already dispatched stationed it's military there seeing worsening conditions
And then attacking Taiwan would be doing a pearl harbor to USA
Giving USA justification And push for a full war

A war in which both sides would suffer badly .and if goes nuclear
No one will be left

Taiwan island is not vietnam nor afghan.

According to Taiwan island media itself

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3970392

And Taiwan also basically an island surrounded by sea.


And why US fail in Vietnam, it's because US didn't invading vietnam in the first place. Because of what? Because they don't want to escalate the conflict and afraid of Chinese intervention
https://www.quora.com/Why-didnt-the-US-invade-North-Vietnam-during-the-Vietnam-War#:~:text=The US never sent soldiers,as it did in Korea.


The last one Chinese intervene in their war, they got bleed nose. Retreating all the way back from Yalu to Seoul. And never come back again

 

[Genghis khan1]

Well as 27 Feb 19 air battles showed it's not just fighter jets but entire network of assets that results in success

Btw the mere size of Chinese military guarantees success

But issue is what's next
Taiwan being global supplier of chips and electronics would affect global economy

Resulting in serious backlash against China

Perhaps USA won't come to liberate it like it came for Kuwait under Iraq
But still the world will be divided
And Chinese would have to spend great resources to keep control of Taiwan

Which can become it's Vietnam or Afghanistan

But most probably if China attacks Taiwan USA would already dispatched stationed it's military there seeing worsening conditions
And then attacking Taiwan would be doing a pearl harbor to USA
Giving USA justification And push for a full war

A war in which both sides would suffer badly .and if goes nuclear
No one will be left

Taiwanese are essentially Chinese. China can easily overwhelmed them with their military might, so close to their border. I don’t think they will even fight. China is just waiting for the right time. Taiwan is strategically important to them.

US has already done their calculations and ran all scenarios, US decided not to be a grantor for Taiwanese defense . Taiwan is indefensible. US is not fighting China for Taiwan, but will use this opportunity to isolate China worldwide.

 

[iLION12345_1]

More TRM modules ≠ a better radar. They can indicate a more powerful radar yes, but they’re not the deciding factor.
F-16 block 60-72 all carry AESA radars.

And if the KLJ-7A is anything to go by, Chinese AESA radars need some work. I’m sure the KLJ-10 is comparable to the APG 80 and 83 but I doubt it’s any better.

On an unrelated note; AESA is Generally better than PESA, but not always, a larger and more powerful or modern PESA can easily outperform older or smaller and less powerful AESAS. Though these two are a similar size so that doesn’t apply here. FYI the PESA in the older F-16s are very very potent, much more so when compared to Chinese PESAs of similar size.

PL-15 does NOT have a 300KM range. It’s simply impossible for a missile of that size. It can’t even be 200KM. It’s range is at most comparable to AIM-120C7 and Maybe AIM-120D. PLAAF and the missile designers never claimed such a range either, its falsely reported by some Chinese media. Even if they somehow managed to make a revolutionary missile, you won’t be shooting a target with your BVR missile more than a 100KM away. Range is one of the least important factors for missiles beyond a certain limit because then many other things come into play.

I’m not saying either KLJ-10 or PL-15 are bad, they are both very potent and advanced, just like their American counterparts, but they’re not anything revolutionary like claimed here. They’re both comparable.

I will not get into a Taiwan vs China discussion though. One is tiny and the other is massive, I’m sure we all know what the outcome to that fight would be. A few F-16s even if they were better could not hold out in that case. And the aircraft supporting them matter a lot too. PLAAF has too many other advantages, it’s simply an unfair comparison…

 

[Genghis khan1]

Don't worry we will know everything once we get J10Cs

USAF is extending F-16 serviceable life to 2040/50. I would rather go for cheaper radar and service life upgraded first.

F-16s Could Still be Flying Into the 2070s | Air & Space Forces Magazine

The F-16’s sunset years now could come in the 2070s, or later, based on Lockheed Martin’s backlog of F-16 orders and planned upgrades.

www.airforcemag.com

 

[Daniel808]

Taiwanese are essentially Chinese. China can easily overwhelmed them with their military might, so close to their border. I don’t think they will even fight. China is just waiting for the right time. Taiwan is strategically important to them.

US has already done their calculations and ran all scenarios, US decided not to be a grantor for Taiwanese defense . Taiwan is indefensible. US is not fighting China for Taiwan, but will use this opportunity to isolate China worldwide.

Not only that.

Taiwan island also located very close to Mainland China

China's Artillery hiding in the hills of Fujian Province can bombard all parts of Taiwan island non-stop 24 hours.

China's MLRS located in neighbouring Province like Zhejiang and Guangdong Province can also cover entire Taiwan island.

With Chinese Huge Production capability, Ammo & Weapons Production is no problem for them

More TRM modules ≠ a better radar. They can indicate a more powerful radar yes, but they’re not the deciding factor.
F-16 block 60-72 all carry AESA radars.

And if the KLJ-7A is anything to go by, Chinese AESA radars need some work. I’m sure the KLJ-10 is comparable to the APG 80 and 83 but I doubt it’s any better.

On an unrelated note; AESA is Generally better than PESA, but not always, a larger and more powerful or modern PESA can easily outperform older or smaller and less powerful AESAS. Though these two are a similar size so that doesn’t apply here. FYI the PESA in the older F-16s are very very potent, much more so when compared to Chinese PESAs of similar size.

PL-15 does NOT have a 300KM range. It’s simply impossible for a missile of that size. It can’t even be 200KM. It’s range is at most comparable to AIM-120C7 and Maybe AIM-120D. PLAAF and the missile designers never claimed such a range either, its falsely reported by some Chinese media. Even if they somehow managed to make a revolutionary missile, you won’t be shooting a target with your BVR missile more than a 100KM away. Range is one of the least important factors for missiles beyond a certain limit because then many other things come into play.

I’m not saying either KLJ-10 or PL-15 are bad, they are both very potent and advanced, just like their American counterparts, but they’re not anything revolutionary like claimed here. They’re both comparable.

I will not get into a Taiwan vs China discussion though. One is tiny and the other is massive, I’m sure we all know what the outcome to that fight would be. A few F-16s even if they were better could not hold out in that case. And the aircraft supporting them matter a lot too. PLAAF has too many other advantages, it’s simply an unfair comparison…

Yes agree, it's not absolute factor. But it's one of the Most important indicator to calculate the capability of AESA Radar

You should read this, about PL-15 Missiles

https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/defense/2017-07-20/new-chinese-weapons-seen-j-10c-fighter

 

[iLION12345_1]

Not only that.

Taiwan island also located very close to Mainland China

View attachment 761336

China's Artillery hiding in the hills of Fujian Province can bombard all parts of Taiwan island non-stop 24 hours.

China's MLRS located in neighbouring Province like Zhejiang and Guangdong Province can also cover entire Taiwan island.

With Chinese Huge Production capability, Ammo & Weapons Production is no problem for them


According to your logic then F-22 Raptor AESA radar should have 800 T/R modules (lower than APG-80) instead of 1,500 T/R modules

View attachment 761337



Bla bla bla, yeah PL-15 Missiles only have 2 kilometers range then

I assume you don’t know the first thing about radars and missiles with arguments like that. Just regurgitating media articles you don’t even understand. Not worth responding to.
I’ll leave you with the PL-15 ICBM and the magical KLJ-10 radar.

 

[Daniel808]

I assume you don’t know the first thing about radars and missiles with arguments like that. Just regurgitating media articles you don’t even understand. Not worth responding to.
I’ll leave you with the PL-15 ICBM and the magical KLJ-10 radar.

That's it..you are too much assuming.
Meanwhile, I'm using the data.

You using Amraam to make assumption about the capability of PL-15 Missile.
But when you do that, there is 1 Fatal Mistake you don't realize @iLION12345_1 Both are different missiles with different technology. AIM-120D still using Conventionally rocket motor, meanwhile PL-15 AAM already using Dual-pulse Rocket Technology


PL-15 AAM using Dual-pulse Rocket Technology which extend the range of the missiles compared to Conventional one



This is a depth Analysis about PL-15 Missiles, you can activated english subtitle too for you

 

[Genghis khan1]

PL-15 ICBM

Lol… btw Hypersonic Air to Air missiles are already under-consideration. Scientists are already working on them. Guidance is a major challenge in here.