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Why A Medium / Heavy Strike Aircraft For Defense of Pakistan?

If that is where we are today then we are already doomed. You're telling me in any India/Pak conflict today our planes will be taken out before they even take off?????
That is always the aim of the enemy and can be possible outcome. Whether it happens soon, later or never.
So now if you want me to spell it clearly let me know and I will paint the scenario but no need to say everything. Those who want to, can understand.
 
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Getting bad pilots is the fault of the airline; an airline run by people. Hence the people are at fault.

Having your phuppa in the Armed forces does not automatically qualify you as intelligent or capable of assimilating or disseminating truthful information.
I love the arrogance of an enlightened mind. It shines so bright that it can hide the truth sometimes.
 
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That is always the aim of the enemy and can be possible outcome. Whether it happens soon, later or never.
So now if you want me to spell it clearly let me know and I will paint the scenario but no need to say everything. Those who want to, can understand.
The life expectancy of the PAF in an all out offensive from India is around a week or ten days at max.
The week isnt just all aircraft blown out of the sky, but damage to infrastructure, leadership targets and logistics that will make it ineffective.

It is likely a lot of assets will survive and fall back to the western bases; but by that time you are alread losing the ground war.. and the nukes are out.. its all over for everyone.

I love the arrogance of an enlightened mind. It shines so bright that it can hide the truth sometimes.
 
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The life expectancy of the PAF in an all out offensive from India is around a week or ten days at max.
The week isnt just all aircraft blown out of the sky, but damage to infrastructure, leadership targets and logistics that will make it ineffective.

It is likely a lot of assets will survive and fall back to the western bases; but by that time you are alread losing the ground war.. and the nukes are out.. its all over for everyone.
Agree but can we plan for a few days more of conventional warfare. If the conventional imbalance is huge the stronger enemy is tempted to call the bluff and .... it can lead to either way.

The life expectancy of the PAF in an all out offensive from India is around a week or ten days at max.
The week isnt just all aircraft blown out of the sky, but damage to infrastructure, leadership targets and logistics that will make it ineffective.

It is likely a lot of assets will survive and fall back to the western bases; but by that time you are alread losing the ground war.. and the nukes are out.. its all over for everyone.


Try me
 
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Agree but can we plan for a few days more of conventional warfare. If the conventional imbalance is huge the stronger enemy is tempted to call the bluff and .... it can lead to either way.
All the plans of mice and men. In 65, had the plan laid out by Asghar Khan been followed to the letter then India would have suffered a defeat the likes even the Israelis could not replicate.
But that did not happen.

All plans require allocation of enough funds to plan correctly and then the usage of those funds effectively; neither of which is possible given the social and moral constructs of Pakistani society of which undoubtedly the PAF is a product.
The recently introduced PAF bill is going to be a joke at the end and will be used for more witch hunts rather than being effective in ending corruption for which the PAF outpaces even the Army in terms of per-person unscrupulous behavior.
 
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All the plans of mice and men. In 65, had the plan laid out by Asghar Khan been followed to the letter then India would have suffered a defeat the likes even the Israelis could not replicate.
But that did not happen.

All plans require allocation of enough funds to plan correctly and then the usage of those funds effectively; neither of which is possible given the social and moral constructs of Pakistani society of which undoubtedly the PAF is a product.
The recently introduced PAF bill is going to be a joke at the end and will be used for more witch hunts rather than being effective in ending corruption for which the PAF outpaces even the Army in terms of per-person unscrupulous behavior.
I agree and my opinion is the same about corruption, so we should give up?
 
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I agree and my opinion is the same about corruption, so we should give up?
Corruption isnt an institutional idea but a societal one. Modern Pakistani society is too self absorbed or whimsical to realize that the solution lies within themselves and not complaining about politicians or generals or Mossad.
See my post within this thread.
 
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Corruption isnt an institutional idea but a societal one. Modern Pakistani society is too self absorbed or whimsical to realize that the solution lies within themselves and not complaining about politicians or generals or Mossad.
See my post within this thread.
I could not agree more as I always say to my friends that the Army, Politicians, Police, Judges, media all are from Pakistan. Still PAF needs latest multirole Aircraft with a mix of air superiority and bombing abilities. Will it happen or when it will happen do not know.
 
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A question being discussed is that why does Pakistan not have medium to heavy strike aircraft when it is facing an enemy 5 times its size---.

Why are some of the aircraft in the inventory of the Paf not proportionately similar in size and performance to those of the enemy aircraft---?

Why are there no aircraft in Paf's inventory matching the enemy's tier 1 aircraft?

Why is it that the enemy that is 5 times larger---has tier 1 aircraft that are carrying a load of 5 times more BVR missiles than our tier aicraft---is more mobile and nimble---carries a stronger and more powerful radar and yet the Paf is trying to make believe that their little birdie will devour the enemy's massive bird of prey.

50 years ago--a good strike aircraft could carry 5000 lbs---now the similar aircraft in service carries around 20000 + lbs of weapons load---.

In the past---where the aircraft had dedicated roles---today there are aircraft that perform their duties in multiple specialized roles according to the need.

In the past where you needed to drop 50000 lbs to do the damage---today---you can do it with a 1000---2000 lb weapon---.

If we look at pakistan's geography in relation to its primary enemy----it is very unique---. From the frontal position---it makes it impossible for deep strike missions, but when taking into consideration the flanks---the one bordering the water is the most deadly and do the worst damage to the enemy.

The enemy has a long long flank open on the sea / ocean front---which means that every city on that front is vulnerable to standoff weapons strike---which also means that due to open space available to Paf---the enemy will have to move a larger number of its assets to protect a vaster number of assets from its primary face to face position from the main border.

Incidently---the enemy also have limited resources to protect all its assets in a strong and prudent manner for its seaside cities down the coast line.

So---if we can do the similar damage with a 2000 lb weapon---then why is there a need for a heavy strike aircraft.

The reason being---that as the heavy aircraft can fly farther with a heavier load---it can hit EXTREMELY IMPORTANT targets that have never felt any threat of war before---. These targets are the very wealthy and affluent areas that may dictate and determine the time of war---but are in no way ready to take the casualties of war---.

A strike in these areas would create massive panic and chaos---the fear of death and destruction will create uncertainty amongst the masses---tactical strikes at crucial points will bring the metropolis city life to a stand still---and when a metropolis city life comes to a stand still---it means that its death bell has been rung---.

The first to leave are the rich with their money---when rushing to exit in emergency---it creates opportunities for accidents---accidents create traffic stoppage---traffic stoppage stops emergency operations---stoppage and lack of of emergency operations creates unrest in the area---and the creation of unrest in the area is what the primary purpose of the deep strike mission.

This unrest will turn into small street fight---that will turn into larger street fights---small fires will result and will turn into larger fires---and as the emergency units are bogged down due to stoppage of traffic---each area will become the center of chaos and anarchy---and this will spread like wild fire thru out the metropolis---.

@Khafee @Indus Falcon @war&peace
Can't that be done with BM or CM with heavy warheads?
And then, A country is not an army with limited flanks and a center.. the mechanized strike corps of the Indian " cold start" doctrine might be handled that way, but for a country like India to be dealt that way, you will need at least the US bombing power, and stealthy at that..
 
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Can't that be done with BM or CM with heavy warheads?
And then, A country is not an army with limited flanks and a center.. the mechanized strike corps of the Indian " cold start" doctrine might be handled that way, but for a country like India to be dealt that way, you will need at least the US bombing power, and stealthy at that..

Hi,

That is why I say---there is an easy way out---sell the nucs and kiss the ar-se of the baniya and get done with it---.

Why beat around the bush and talk about giving someone a bloody nose.
 
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That is always the aim of the enemy and can be possible outcome. Whether it happens soon, later or never.
So now if you want me to spell it clearly let me know and I will paint the scenario but no need to say everything. Those who want to, can understand.

You don't need my permission to spell out anything and I won't miss it if you keep it to yourself.
 
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Hi,

That is why I say---there is an easy way out---sell the nucs and kiss the ar-se of the baniya and get done with it---.

Why beat around the bush and talk about giving someone a bloody nose.

Right, before we make that conclusion let's analyze all our options and we are nowhere close to achieving that.

Sadly so, read my post for an insight into why.


1. To remove an enemy you need an offensive force; be it Afghanistan, Germany or the Falklands.
2. To an extent that depends on staying power. Air power is costly and maintaining a round the clock presence is not for everyone.
3. Not sure which possible front you are referring to

No. 3 about using C-130 is against Afghanistan and any Indian targets of opportunity that present themselves. In later posts I'll expand on the role of C-130 but let's see how I am faring so far.
 
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