Where's the beef? Indians don't want to know

[kingkobra]

True but Hinduism changed continuously. (there is a however a mention in the Atharva veda of a form of token Sati -the widow lying down on the pyre for some time before getting up & joining the mourners) Manu in his smriti takes a hardline view of widow remarriage as does the Aditya-purana though others like the Agni-purana take a more lenient view as do the Arthasastra & the Kamasutra. Later though, the views against widow remarriage hardened & Sati which is never mentioned by Manu starts getting the sanction of lawgivers like Brihaspati.

I dont speak for all hindus but i do not view puranas as religious texts..they are against vedas though they claim to be in terms of vedas..but vedas no where mention sati system..i can not deny that there where people who would have tried to modified vedas and misquote them..but we should reject those forms of vedas..

PS:todays hinduism is not even close to be vedic.

 

[Bang Galore]

what makes you think that mahabharata and ramayana are vedic times? and i have no doubt in my mind that ramayana and mahabharta were greatly modified during thousands of years..

Some instances of voluntary self-immolation by both women and men that may be regarded as at least partly historical accounts are included in the Mahabharata and other works. However, large portions of these works are relatively late interpolations into an original story,[4] rendering difficult their use for reliable dating. Also, neither immolation nor the desire for self-immolation are regarded as a custom in the Mahabharata. Use of the term 'sati' to describe the custom of self-immolation never occurs in the Mahabarata, unlike other customs such as the Rajasuya yagna. Rather, the self-immolations are viewed as an expression of extreme grief at the loss of a beloved one.

Not my argument, just mentioning that the act of Sati finds mention in the epics. Almost certainly known that Alexanders's generals witnessed it. Your point on later interpolations may well be correct since that happened routinely.

As regarding the term Sati, it was originally used to describe a person (virtuous & faithful wife). The correct Sanskrt term for Sati was sahamarana; dying together.

---------- Post added at 05:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:12 PM ----------

I dont speak for all hindus but i do not view puranas as religious texts..they are against vedas though they claim to be in terms of vedas..but vedas no where mention sati system..i can not deny that there where people who would have tried to modified vedas and misquote them..but we should reject those forms of vedas..

PS:todays hinduism is not even close to be vedic.

True, otherwise you would be worshiping Indra, Varuna ,Agni & Soma

 

[kingkobra]

Not my argument, just mentioning that the act of Sati finds mention in the epics. Almost certainly known that Alexanders's generals witnessed it. Your point on later interpolations may well be correct since that happened routinely.

As regarding the term Sati, it was originally used to describe a person (virtuous & faithful wife). The correct Sanskrt term for Sati was sahamarana; dying together.

---------- Post added at 05:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:12 PM ----------



True, otherwise you would be worshiping Indra, Varuna ,Agni & Soma

indra,varuna,agni are devatas and they are properties of ishwar ..they are not worshiped...ishwar is only one who is worshiped as Ishwar is the Devata of Devatas and hence called ‘Mahadeva’....
Devata=any entity – living or non-living – that helps us or is useful for us is termed ‘Devata...good old max muller and griffith thought they know sanskrit but they where only half learned...
same thing happened with 33 crore gods...vedas mention 33 koti devata..now koti in sanskrit means types and not crore..

Rig Veda, 1.64.46:

“Indram Mitram varunamagnimaahuratho divyah sa suparno garuthmaan|
Yekham sadvipra bahudha vadantyagnim yamam maatarishwanamaahuh||”

‘The real God is one, the enlightened ones, speak of Him in several ways, God is divine, the supreme protector and graceful sentient, the Universal soul. They call Him Indra, the Almighty, the universal friend [mitra]. Varuna the most acceptable and obliterator of sins, they describe Him as [agnim] the supreme guide of the Universe, {Yaman} the controller of the Universe, and {matarishvanam] the life of all lives.’

 

[Manas]

The thing is hindu caste system was never rigid it become after the muslim rule of india .

Maharshi Balmiki who wrote Ramayana wasn't a Brahmin . Initially he was lower caste dacoit who later had such spiritual transformation of Sadhu that he wrote Ramayana,one of greatest epic of Hinduism. And no upper caste brahmin questioned his authority to write Ramayana at that time on the basis of his lower castes .

But once hindus lost rule of the land to foreign muslim invaders everything thing . Hindus were left in desperate condition at the loss opportunites hense each caste only thought for himself. Kristriyas tried to portray themselves as martial and made fun of Brahmins ,Baishya ,and sudras as being coward and non warrior type . Brahmins in term begun to define themselves as only people who has the authority over the Vedas and other religious texts ,and tried to keep the knowledge to only themselves.

To give an statistc on precarious position hindus of in terms state sponsored job opportunities during the Muslim rule.

In UP, according to Alavi, the Muslims constituted 13 percent of the population in 1857 but held 64 percent of the jobs. However, after the British takeover by 1913, their “share of jobs fell to 35 percent”

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan

Similar is the case with Sati pratha where women can or should immolate herself on funeral pyre of his dead husband , but it is never supposed to be enforced in the manner it was being practiced in medieval era of Muslim rule of india.

There are instances of of Sati in also Mahabharat . Second wife of King Pandu become Sati after king Pandu died in the jungle while but his first wife Queen Kunti lived to looked after her kids, the five pandavs.

 

[Bang Galore]

The thing is hindu caste system was never rigid it become after the muslim rule of india .

Maharshi Balmiki who wrote Ramayana wasn't a Brahmin . Initially he was lower caste dacoit who later had such spiritual transformation of Sadhu that he wrote Ramayana,one of greatest epic of Hinduism. And no upper caste brahmin questioned his authority to write Ramayana at that time on the basis of his lower castes .

But once hindus lost rule of the land to foreign muslim invaders everything thing . Hindus were left in desperate condition at the loss opportunites hense each caste only thought for himself. Kristriyas tried to portray themselves as martial and made fun of Brahmins ,Baishya ,and sudras as being coward and non warrior type . Brahmins in term begun to define themselves as only people who has the authority over the Vedas and other religious texts ,and tried to keep the knowledge to only themselves.

To give an statistc on precarious position hindus of in terms state sponsored job opportunities during the Muslim rule.


Similar is the case with Sati pratha where women can or should immolate herself on funeral pyre of his dead husband , but it is never supposed to be enforced in the manner it was being practiced in medieval era of Muslim rule of india.

There are instances of of Sati in also Mahabharat . Second wife of King Pandu become Sati after king Pandu died in the jungle while but his first wife Queen Kunti lived to looked after her kids, the five pandavs.

Unfortunately, the above is simply not true. The caste system hardened in the Gupta period much before the advent of Muslim conquerors. As far as Sati goes, it was largely curtailed by the Mughals with special permission being required for performing it. No point in blaming others for all the absurd social practices among Hindus.

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

Unfortunately, the above is simply not true. The caste system hardened in the Gupta period much before the advent of Muslim conquerors. As far as Sati goes, it was largely curtailed by the Mughals with special permission being required for performing it. No point in blaming others for all the absurd social practices among Hindus.

I thought Caste system got stronger under king Manu

 

[kingkobra]

Unfortunately, the above is simply not true. The caste system hardened in the Gupta period much before the advent of Muslim conquerors. As far as Sati goes, it was largely curtailed by the Mughals with special permission being required for performing it. No point in blaming others for all the absurd social practices among Hindus.

Fall of vedic Dharma had started way before muslim invasion...

---------- Post added at 05:13 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:12 PM ----------

I thought Caste system got stronger under king Manu

manu was a hrishi and manusmirit written by him was highly modified later...many people added verses in manysmriti for their own benefit..

 

[PlanetWarrior]

Wow. A thread which started off with an attempt to upset Hindus with information relating to cow rustling between India and Bangladesh ends up in a Hindu satsangh


All these discussion relating to Hinduism and its history are irrelevant. All religions evolve and Hinduism is no exception. I guess that the evolution of religion is as a result of the change of mankind's personal values and the interpretation of the scripture in accordance with the current day lifestyle of the followers. Can one claim that the values, interpretation of the Bible, attitudes of the followers of Christianity of today is the same as some 600 years ago for example? Definately not. Therefore to look at the attitudes of Hindus some 2000 years ago and compare it to todays Hinduism is equally silly.

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

There are adherents of some religion who are still in a time wrap and though religion evolves, these fundamentalists don't.

 

[Zabaniyah]

I like beef. Whenever I see a cow or goat, I think about how delicious they look!

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

I like beef. Whenever I see a cow or goat, I think about how delicious they look!

Beef is fine.

Don't try the Indian subcontinent beef. You will get sick.

Stick to Australian, Argentinian and New Zealand variety. Said to be safe.

Remainder are steroid activated!

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

Zabs,

I am a strict non vegetarian and I wan to go to China since they eat everything that moves and I want to test myself.

I somehow did not find the snails very relishing.

Maybe it was because of inhibitions!

 

[Zabaniyah]

Zabs,

I am a strict non vegetarian and I wan to go to China since they eat everything that moves and I want to test myself.

I somehow did not find the snails very relishing.

Maybe it was because of inhibitions!

I don't know about snails.

But I tasted squid and octopus. They're awesome. Am a great fan of Japanese cuisine and culture. Kobe beef!

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

In Malaysia and Singapore, I tasted snails, frogs leg, oysters, octopus and giant Australian crabs.

Honestly, it was OK since it gave me a chance to be in with the Joneses.

However, the only think I liked was the Giant Australian Crabs at Nosignboard in Singapore!

But then, nothing to beat Paddar Ilish!

 

[Tiki Tam Tam]

In Malaysia and Singapore, I tasted snails, frogs leg, oysters, octopus and giant Australian crabs.

Honestly, it was OK since it gave me a chance to be in with the Joneses.

However, the only think I liked was the Giant Australian Crabs at Nosignboard in Singapore!

But then, nothing to beat Paddar Ilish!

I also like Japanese cuisine, but you get so little and shell out so much!!