When did you first decide you hated Israel and why?

[Icarus]

We don't hate Israel, we don't hate Israelis, they are people like us with a right to live but then so are the Palestinians, they also have the right to live, that is why we hate Israeli policies.

 

[kugga]

I hate Israel the biggest terrorist on earth...

 

[vsdoc]

The Israelis have merely retaken what was theirs in the first place. Historically. If any people on earth have first right to the holy land, it is the Jews who were there first. If we are to debate the right and wrong of things here, please be impartial enough to realize that. Once this basic fundamental human truth is internalized and accepted all around, maybe that part of the world has a shot at peace.

Cheers, Doc

 

[TaimiKhan]

The Israelis have merely retaken what was theirs in the first place. Historically. If any people on earth have first right to the holy land, it is the Jews who were there first. If we are to debate the right and wrong of things here, please be impartial enough to realize that. Once this basic fundamental human truth is internalized and accepted all around, maybe that part of the world has a shot at peace.

Cheers, Doc

Wasn't expecting that at least from you doc.

" Recent genetic evidence has demonstrated that Palestinians as an ethnic group are closely related to Jews and represent modern "descendants of a core population that lived in the area since prehistoric times,"[15][16] largely predating the Arabian Muslim conquest that resulted in their acculturation, established Arabic as the predominant vernacular, and over time also Islamized many of them from various prior faiths. "

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_people

http://bric.postech.ac.kr/science/97now/00_10now/001030a.html

This is not only Jews land, its the land of the people who lived in this area before Islam came to this area or there was anything religious in it. But sadly the people who lived with these same Jews since pre historic times are and have been thrown out based on being Muslims. If these same Palestinians had been Jews, they would not have been given the treatment which we are seeing now.

The only crime is that these Palestinians are Muslims now.

 

[vsdoc]

Wasn't expecting that at least from you doc.

I do not want to give the discussion a religious flavour cause then the tempers will fly Taimi.

And then Persia/Iran will come in.

As will Kashmir.

Can you deny that the Jews have first right to Jerusalem? If you cannot, then can you condone the relentless attacks on the state of Israel since its creation by its neighbouring countries?

Why? For what?

Its their land from the time of Moses. It is their land once again. And they will defend their right to live there in peace.

Simple.

And who said anything about the Palestinians not having a right to live there or their genetic ties to the land (tenuous at best as they may be)? But they need to learn how to share and coexist. Cause the Jews have had enough of being pushed around for one millenium my friend.

Cheers, Doc

 

[TaimiKhan]

I do not want to give the discussion a religious flavour cause then the tempers will fly Taimi.

And then Persia/Iran will come in.

As will Kashmir.

Can you deny that the Jews have first right to Jerusalem? If you cannot, then can you condone the relentless attacks on the state of Israel since its creation by its neighbouring countries?

Why? For what?

Its their land from the time of Moses. It is their land once again. And they will defend their right to live there in peace.

Simple.

Cheers, Doc

Read the post again buddy, i have amended it.

 

[Old School]

Well , Forget about Israeli . We have Pakistanis killing other Pakistanis in the name of sect and political ideology. We have 'provincial supremacists' who do not accept a Sindhi to be the president. Therefore, it is not about Israel , it is the hateful mindset shared by some people. How many of the Israeli haters in our country in fact met an Israeli in person ?

 

[Icarus]

Well , Forget about Israeli . We have Pakistanis killing other Pakistanis in the name of sect and political ideology. We have 'provincial supremacists' who do not accept a Sindhi to be the president. Therefore, it is not about Israel , it is the hateful mindset shared by some people. How many of the Israeli haters in our country in fact met an Israeli in person ?

Very sensible post............I have met Israelis and as I said, they are just people like us, it's their policies that need revising.

 

[Awesome]

I think for most people it can't be just ONE thing, and it will be a series of incidents.

Above everything else for Pakistanis is the one thing that in Musharraf's time there was a strong initiative to build some sort of Turkey-like neutrality with Israel and even recognize them. The biggest opposition came from Israeli public and the Israeli forums were hate ridden and there was an image being portrayed that "Them Pakistanis are going to befriend us and then stab us in the back".

All in all Israel rejected a very bold move by Pakistan which could've in due time led to other nations following suit.

Other than that, there is continuous supply of modern hardware to India - that too such weapons that are Pakistan specific.

You have to acknowledge that peace with Pakistan is not on Israel's top agenda as well and this is at the basic public level too.

Till there is no change in these two things there will be no diplomatic niceties exchanged between us and it will also be reflected in the public opinion.

Other than that a couple of incidents that stand out are:

1. The shooting of a father and son crouching for cover.
2. Overkill use of force used to remove Palestinian settlements
3. The Rachel Corey incident
4. The war on Lebanon in 2006
5. The popularity of "Shoot the pregnant Palestinian woman" shirt in Israel.
6. The assassination in Dubai
7. The barring of aid, An illegal naval blockade

Somethings from our side are probably not that fair on Israel, or even unproven propaganda as well like:

1. Mossad agents are everywhere
2. The repeated notion that every Israeli serves in the military so killing a civilian is okay
3. The Coke and Pepsi rumors and chain mails
4. The overkill demonization of the Jewish faith as they are set to exert their dominance on the world
5. A sense of superiority over the Jews
6. The basic lack of tolerance amongst the far right
7. Third world country issues, poverty, crime, a natural sense of bitterness

All in all it comes down to this, that we both need a strong men like Musharraf, at the same time in both countries that can ride the storm and show a path of peace and perhaps humanize each other.

 

[Ahmad]

I love Israel and it should be able to exist in peace with its neighbors.

but what can you say if israel denies the existence of other people?

 

[Ahmad]

The Israelis have merely retaken what was theirs in the first place. Historically. If any people on earth have first right to the holy land, it is the Jews who were there first. If we are to debate the right and wrong of things here, please be impartial enough to realize that. Once this basic fundamental human truth is internalized and accepted all around, maybe that part of the world has a shot at peace.

Cheers, Doc

you sound like osama bin laden.

 

[Icarus]

you sound like osama bin laden.

Hahahahahahahahaha............................I just noticed........

 

[Rumporum]

I cannot say about Zionists but i do not hate any Jew. My teacher was a Jew and i have mentioned here several times that he is probably the best teacher i have met so far in my life. My experience with jews so far is very good and i have no means to hate them

But at the same time... I hate Israeli Government for their evil actions against palestinians and feel sorry for the poor palestinians dying either with hunger or by the bullets fired by Israeli Army

If I may something here..... by the way no Palestinian is dying of Hunger or anything like that. Pakistan has a nuclear bomb but can you tell me can one get a glass of clean drinking water directly from tap ( drink it without treating it first) everywhere? in Gaza and West-Bank you can...

The Government of Israel is a democratically elected and although we may not agree with some policies we are fully behind our state. When Israeli Army hits back at Gaza or terrorists its everyone calls it brutal, barbaric,...etc

These military actions are responses to terror attacks against our civilians in café's, restaurants, shopping malls, buses, schools etc. These acts I presume you classify freedom fighters. These are acts of terror and we do not compromise with terrorists.

Lastly the Gaza blockade is there and should stay there as along as Hamas doesn't renounce violence Period and as long as they keep on firing Qassam rockets we reserve the right to hit back at Hamas munitions.

 

[RescueRanger]

I find it funny that the protagonist of this thread has has failed to make any further appearances and in his stead we have misinformed friends from across the border "forcing" us to accept the history according to what they believe is correct.

It is also interesting that these very same posters decide to omit historical facts such as the grand crusades and the Nakba.

 

[Ahmad]

If I may something here..... by the way no Palestinian is dying of Hunger or anything like that. Pakistan has a nuclear bomb but can you tell me can one get a glass of clean drinking water directly from tap ( drink it without treating it first) everywhere? in Gaza and West-Bank you can...

The Government of Israel is a democratically elected and although we may not agree with some policies we are fully behind our state. When Israeli Army hits back at Gaza or terrorists its everyone calls it brutal, barbaric,...etc

These military actions are responses to terror attacks against our civilians in café's, restaurants, shopping malls, buses, schools etc. These acts I presume you classify freedom fighters. These are acts of terror and we do not compromise with terrorists.

Lastly the Gaza blockade is there and should stay there as along as Hamas doesn't renounce violence Period and as long as they keep on firing Qassam rockets we reserve the right to hit back at Hamas munitions.

can you tell me why you steal their land?