Vietnam Defence Forum

[Carlosa]

Chinese fishing boat asked to leave Vietnamese waters

http://www.thanhniennews.com/politi...t-asked-to-leave-vietnamese-waters-64096.html

By Nguyen Phuc, Thanh Nien News

QUANG TRI - Tuesday, July 12, 2016

Vietnamese border guard officers check the Chinese boat with five crew members that illegally fished near Con Co Island in Quang Tri Province on July 11, 2016. Photo: Phuoc Trung

Border guards in the central province of Quang Tri said they turned away a Chinese fishing boat that was caught in Vietnamese waters on Monday.

At 7 a.m. the local border guard agency was informed by local fishers that the Chinese boat was fishing illegally in the waters only three nautical miles from the island of Con Co, where the agency has a station.
One and a half hour later, a boat carrying a team of officers approached the Chinese boat codenamed 13177.

The officers checked the boat and informed the captain and five other crew members on the Chinese vessel that they had violated Vietnamese territorial waters. They ordered the crew to sign a report on the violation and confiscated their catch and fishing gears.
The boat was asked to leave immediately.

According to the local border guard, there has been recently an increase of Chinese boats fishing illegally in Vietnamese waters, especially around the seafood-rich Con Co Island.

 

[Aqsuperman]

Well i LOVE when a military thread turn political by people who dont have remotely enough information about what is going on around the world or the history of a country yet boldly made many conclusions. Since certain people cant read and probably having a hard time on Google, i will give you some interesting information:

1/ "Baseless", "limited" ? Well the guy said that surely dont know anything about "Democracy" in the world except on books and pure theory. Let me list a few notable examples about what happen to "democracy" in the past. Do remember that i dont claim all democracy will be like this:

_ South Vietnam: A "certified" democracy by US standards. Now let google Ngo Dinh Diem assassination or coup and election frauds in South Vietnam. Feel free to read English sources and see what happen to that "democracy". Democracy like communism in a sense that if people act precisely and exactly like what on the theory, things will surely better, they both have a tight procedure and structure to follow. But as the VN old slogan :'Làm theo năng lực, hưởng theo nhu cầu" or "Do what you can, earn what you want" that fail miserably, democracy in Vietnam was and will face the same destruction. People care little about the country benefit, only about themselves. In just 5 years from 1960 to 1965 there are numerous coup attempts and assassination. The election frauds and corruptions are rampaging. Are there anyone got punished by the constitution? A few............if you lose that is. Guess the people at this time will do MUCH better eh ?

_South Korea: Another "certified" democracy by US standards. Nowadays the country is fine and prosperous because the people see the COUNTRY benefits first. Before that, things were much more difficult. I guess we all know the name of Park Chung Hee and Chun Doo hwan. These are generals that utilize the political instability to become president. While i do see many advantage they bring to the country, they are famous for many thing else. And for people that thought constitution will always fair and square, Yushin constitution will be a damn nice example. And what happen to them ? Chun Doo Hwan nearly kill a future SK president, embezzle state fund and what ? "A president pardon" and he got out easily.

_United States: Here we are, the biggest democracy in the world. I dont see any TRANSPARENCY anywhere. 2003 Iraq invasion, where is the god damn WMD ? The newspaper that cover the war sunk the issue down like nothing. 2011 Libya bombing, i mean for what ? "Free the people and bring them happiness" ? Now surely Libyan is in a state of "extreme happiness". And of course let talk about Richard Nixon with the famous Watergate scandal, what happen to him ? Jail time ? nope. "A president pardon" and there he goes out happy and fine. Well i guess being a president do help you a lot. Immunity were given out like fall leaves. Other people involved in such a massive scandal and surely unconstitutional event under orders by an active President never spend more than 3 years in jail............Well the biggest Democracy in the work "work out" very good eh ? Such "good and precise" punishment for Richard Nixon and his cliche, right ? "Challenge it and you will be punished" my butt. And you talk about the Second Amendments, you call its a tool for people to keep the government in check, i call it a cause for uncontrollable mass shootings and murders. Pick the one you like

2/ For the person that are NOT from Vietnam, here are also good stuff for you:

_ Dis i say we achieve stability right after 1975 ? i only say we have it NOW after LONG time. Dont put your "assumed" words into my mouth. And about the naming of the city. Ho Chi Minh is our leader in our war of revolution since the France time. People that serve the France and then the American against him were TRAITORS. You dont colonize a country, cut it in half and when someone achieved victory, re - unite the country and made changes, you claim that is wrong ? A location name can easily change a dozen times, why do we have to play by someone else preference ? I guess Washington D.C that is named after George Washington better change back to something like "State of Potomac" ? HISTORICALLY correct right ?

If this too hard to stomach for you, check this: Mount Rushmore. This is the place taken by American after the American - Indian war. Now in the 1927 after all the Indian got throw into the conservation, the first four presidents of the United States faces are carved into the mountain. Sound fair to the Indian ? Oh lets use your own word instead : "A political gestures to show that the Indian has lost their land, we own you now and here we will carve our founding presidents into the mountain to mark the occasion".

Purge and concentration camps. Well after the American Revolution and then the Civil war, things have to done about the American Royalist and the South States. Much have nothing against the new regime but there are people seeking the old ways. That when stuff go bad. In Vietnam, its the same. Printing counterfeit, mounting arms resistance, sabotaging key facilities, etc. What is your suggestion to stop it ? Sit by and wait till it happen more and more on a wider scale ? We did what it take, there are controversial mistakes and grave errors were makes but we try our best to made up for those people.

Foe conclusion, i did see many good qualities of democracy. but i also know that its can only be exploited by people with high cultural standards. If people only care about their own benefits, democracy will bring nothing but extra problems. Greek government now struggle to survive due to many presidents post - retirements care programs that strain the nation budgets. And that is only if we dont kill ourselves first and do China a big favor. Have fun hoping that our people can refine the thing instead of smashing it down and turn the country into a mass exodus that is happen on plenty of countries now.

 

[Viet]

@Carlosa
@3Kingdoms

we have a big island in the South China Sea. and not many people know about it. we can upgrade the infrastructure, making it to a naval base, to a military stronghold: Côn Đảo. Basing S-400 long range radar and air defence missiles there. the distance between the island and the spratlys is about 550 km. currently a hidden hotspot for holidaymakers. the islands have everything needed for people to live.

when a russian media reports a potential sale of 4 divisions of S-400 airdefence system to Vietnam, then the thing gets a serious touch. the russians know how to make weapons. Let bring S-400 to Côn Đảo island.

http://rbth.com/news/2016/07/12/vietnam-eyes-s-400-triumf-system_610777

 

[Han Patriot]

That would not be a good idea. It will just get destroyed. We have S-400 too, we will get to all it's weaknesses and limitation. Imagine J-20s taking all of them out in night ops.

Don't think the US is an angel, they will just turn you into an R&R base (You know what I mean) when you submit to their overlordship.

 

[Viet]

That would not be a good idea. It will just get destroyed. We have S-400 too, we will get to all it's weaknesses and limitation. Imagine J-20s taking all of them out in night ops.

Don't think the US is an angel, they will just turn you into an R&R base (You know what I mean) when you submit to their overlordship.

no need to resort to insult. do you really want to attack S-400 missile battery with unproven airplanes?

 

[cnleio]

Vietnam 'Gepard' simulator

 

[cnleio]

Vietnam 'Gepard' simulator

 

[Viet]

@cnleio

Wow great pictures thank for posting

 

[Han Patriot]

no need to resort to insult. do you really want to attack S-400 missile battery with unproven airplanes?

Firstly, you need to get S400, second, if we have S400, we know how it works, surely there mus be some flaw we can exploit. Why no test the radar in China, and see if they can detect J20.

 

[Viet]

Firstly, you need to get S400, second, if we have S400, we know how it works, surely there mus be some flaw we can exploit. Why no test the radar in China, and see if they can detect J20.

yes China is the best. you probably know everything, even the weakness of our AK-47s we are using.

your planes are welcome to evade our radars, trying to escape our missiles. and as an appetizer for you, a picture during the Vietnam war, with the US, having the most powerful military on the planet, with supersonic airplanes employing all sorts of tricks including electronic warfare. 50 years ago.

 

[cnleio]

Firstly, you need to get S400, second, if we have S400, we know how it works, surely there mus be some flaw we can exploit. Why no test the radar in China, and see if they can detect J20.

Vietnam just purchase what China ever imported from Russia ... S-300, Kilo, Su-27sk, Su-30mk2, maybe S-400, the Russian sold these to Vietnam and make sure China know how to detect & defeat it. Right now Russia not stupid to hurt Sino-Russia relationship for Vietnam arms sale, there's nobody can replace China for Russia's biggest ally. Vietnam military force should try some West weapons.

 

[Viet]

Vietnam just purchase what China ever imported from Russia ... S-300, Kilo, Su-27sk, Su-30mk2, maybe S-400, the Russian sold these to Vietnam and make sure China know how to detect & defeat it. Right now Russia not stupid to hurt Sino-Russia relationship for Vietnam arms sale, there's nobody can replace China for Russia's biggest ally. Vietnam military force should try some West weapons.

since when is Russia your ally?

can you show me the China-Russia treaty?

If I was you I would not lay my fate on the Russians, sending young Chinese soldiers on suicide missions, hoping Putin would give you the code how to defeat Vietnam air defense.

True, we tend to copy goodies of China. Our next acquisition would be aircraft carriers, nuclear submarines with ballistic missiles.

by the way, I hope you have enough minesweepers in service, once we begin to lay out mines, protecting our islands, potentially bringing the entire commercial shipping in the SC sea to a standstill. As the biggest trader, you certainly know what that means for you.

we have 8 minesweepers in service. Old but still ok.

 

[3Kingdoms]

Vietnam just purchase what China ever imported from Russia ... S-300, Kilo, Su-27sk, Su-30mk2, maybe S-400, the Russian sold these to Vietnam and make sure China know how to detect & defeat it. Right now Russia not stupid to hurt Sino-Russia relationship for Vietnam arms sale, there's nobody can replace China for Russia's biggest ally. Vietnam military force should try some West weapons.

My guess is a smart country would want technology so they engineer nuance to their particular region of operations. Besides Vietnam has the ultimate trump card China doesn't want ever happening, give Cam Ranh port to foreign power - maybe even a north port or THAAD! Vietnam doesn't want this but its a possibility nonetheless.
"Annam borders on China; her security concerns us. China's protection of that country should have no difference from that of Chinese provinces." - Marquis Zeng Jize 1881

@Viet @Carlosa - this is wishful thinking here but with the Spartly Island of Vietnam how I wish they would turn those islands into a tourist destination. Firstly we get international funding for the project (I know this is hard sell), international funding means any attack on those islands will automatically attack the nation of funds 'Hedging'. Also warfare is not just about bombs and bullets, this modern warfare involves information and public opinions, hence an enemy would dare not attack a place of international tourism (they could intimidate though). And who wouldn't want to holiday in the beautiful spartly islands where one can chillax while neighboring islands perform military drills.
Check out these floating island we could link small island to island creating a chain. Because of tourist maybe we could secure region of fishing EEZ? Hire foreign as well as local coast guard as 'Hedging'.
Floating & maneuverable

 

[vtnsx]

Yes, indeed you were wrong about me. You thought I was some kind of naive malleable kid who could easily be influenced and brain washed, didn’t you? Hence, why you insists on lecturing me about how bad VN govt is, etc.

I am a leftist socialist, an independent thinker. And no, I don’t think VN is a genuine socialist country and neither is the VCP a genuine communist party. I hate the pro-VCP apologists who gives nonsense argument just to defend the party. But let me tell you, I also hate as much the anti-VCP camp, especially the oversea ones like the Viet Tan, who talks as much nonsense as the pro-VCP apologists. Nonsense that they commonly say are things like , “the VCP is controlled by the CCP”, etc. Things that even western analysts will disagree with. Nonsense like that coming from nonsense group like Viet Tan does more harm than good. Real Viets who want to work for change can get associated with their nonsense and lose credential.

If you genuinely want Vietnam to progress, then by all means you have the right to criticize or discuss issues wrt VN. But do it with proper data and intelligence, don’t just scream out slogans like “VN govt is destroying the country”, “VCP dont know how to rule” or outright lies like “VCP is controlled by CCP”. I have previously opened many topics on issues related to VN, and even asked non-VNmese for comments and knowledge. I have learnt more from that than the slogans screamed out by VT and the likes.

Well, first of all, you have gone way too far on analyzing my comment regarding your first paragraph. I was wrong about you because you're defending AQ, who lacks the knowledge about Democracy, Social structure & orders and technology. This guy never live in a Democratic country and study in a Democratic country. I'm not asking who you shouldn't or should defend. I know that is your choice. I'm just more surprised that you are defending his wrong about Democracy and how little he understand technology and his government, VCP. I never said you are naive. You are putting words in my mouth. I've always known you to be careful with your wordings. Your command of the English language is better than most people on PDF. It means you have a lot of patient which I can respect that.

"hen by all means you have the right to criticize or discuss issues wrt VN. But do it with proper data and intelligence, don’t just scream out slogans like “VN govt is destroying the country”, “VCP dont know how to rule” or outright lies like “VCP is controlled by CCP”"

Carlosa has his reason to criticize just like you and me and AQ. My criticisms are mostly based on fact and data as you have mentioned above. Although, you and AQ don't acknowledge it. And that's fine with me. Of course, I want Vietnam to be a much better place, who doesn't? My opinion is still valid regarding how VCP is operating very ineffectively and inefficiently and you know it. I've done many organizational work and I understand how companies are run. Not all are effective and efficient. I pointed out to you the reasons for that inefficiency and ineffectiveness. Not all datas are leaked into the public for someone like yourself to read. The best data I got is my own experience. You can't compare me to some articles you read online. We are all human beings, and the more people you're exposed to, then the more you understand them. You should have ask me and those Vietnamese why we said those things to VCP. But again, I'm not VCP nor are those people who criticize the VCP. In the end, all we can do is voice it out. It is up to the VCP to make that happen.

Why didn't the VCP realize it sooner? because they didn't know that China would turn their backs on them. Which open up their eyes and mind to USA. They know they cannot depend on the Russian alone because the Russian are in their own best interest, not VIETNAM.

 

[Carlosa]

My guess is a smart country would want technology so they engineer nuance to their particular region of operations. Besides Vietnam has the ultimate trump card China doesn't want ever happening, give Cam Ranh port to foreign power - maybe even a north port or THAAD! Vietnam doesn't want this but its a possibility nonetheless.
"Annam borders on China; her security concerns us. China's protection of that country should have no difference from that of Chinese provinces." - Marquis Zeng Jize 1881

@Viet @Carlosa - this is wishful thinking here but with the Spartly Island of Vietnam how I wish they would turn those islands into a tourist destination. Firstly we get international funding for the project (I know this is hard sell), international funding means any attack on those islands will automatically attack the nation of funds 'Hedging'. Also warfare is not just about bombs and bullets, this modern warfare involves information and public opinions, hence an enemy would dare not attack a place of international tourism (they could intimidate though). And who wouldn't want to holiday in the beautiful spartly islands where one can chillax while neighboring islands perform military drills.
Check out these floating island we could link small island to island creating a chain. Because of tourist maybe we could secure region of fishing EEZ? Hire foreign as well as local coast guard as 'Hedging'.
Floating & maneuverable

You only need to think about all the noise that Russia is doing because of the AEGIS Ashore bases in Rumania and Poland as well as all the noise from China and Russia about the THAADS in South Korea.
Just imagines American intelligence outposts in the chinese vietnamese border. That's a nightmare scenario for China.

If China pushes too far, there will be a reaction and it will not be in China's interest to do that.

There is already some low level tourism activities in the Spratlys. Vietnam will have to do things in steps; the islands are very small, land reclamation first, then can see what can realistically be done and don't forget that it takes quite a bit of money to develop tourist facilities like that. The reclamation already takes quite a bit of money already.