US objects to China-Pakistan nuclear deal

[M8R]

If we were to talk about past deeds then Germany and Japan should not have been allowed to exist after World War 2 and Pakistan has not done something like that.

 

[Ruag]

What would you have said if the US objected to a reactor deal between India and Russia? (hypothetically and assume the year is 2002).

I just want to say this... NSG was created specifically in response to India's Smiling Buddha nuclear tests in 1976. The United States had played a pivotal role in denying India right to access global nuclear fuel and technology for more than three decades. It was of the opinion that by using such pressure mechanisms, it will be able to persuade India to give up its nuclear ambitions.

If today the United States is willing to accept a nuclear India, it is because it knows India is not going to give up its "minimum credible deterrence" doctrine. The United States realized that a better way to live with nuclear India is by bringing it into the mainstream.

The same applies to Pakistan. Does the United States expect Pakistan to give up its nuclear weapons? No. Should the United States bring another country which already has nuclear weapons and will not give them up at any cost also into the nuclear mainstream? Why not?

The United States is keen to win hearts in Pakistan and what better way to do that by sponsoring a NSG waiver for Pakistan? So, what is holding US back? Uhm... Pakistan's past record?

 

[deckingraj]

If we were to talk about past deeds then Germany and Japan should not have been allowed to exist after World War 2 and Pakistan has not done something like that.

Please don't take it as an offense however are you as important as Germany and Japan??? Here we are talking about countries having 3 and 4 largest GDP....Where do you stand??? Do you want me to tell you where do you stand in this list????

Yes the world is full of hypocracy...who is challenging it?? Aren't we hypocrite as well??? We curse US, UK for double standards and what not but come first chance and we want to run to these countries to have a better life.....There is only one rule "There is no free lunch here"....You need something you got to give something....India got the NSG waiver because she had a very lucrative market to offer....Strategically she can be used as a counter to ever rising China....In other words both economically and strategically we had something to offer....Apart from WOT what can pakistan offer to anybody at this stage???


Just look at your history whenever you had/have something to offer you have got goodies from US....Just compare your nuclear program and the fuss around nuclear program by Iran and you will understand what i am talking about....

In short what is India to US is what Pakistan to China minus lucrative market....Make yourself worth(which i know Pak will) and people will come for your support with their tails in their legs.....There were times when Pak was clocking more growth rate then India....That is the time that you need to bring back and civilian nuclear deal will be a matter of time....

 

[M8R]

Please don't take it as an offense however are you as important as Germany and Japan??? Here we are talking about countries having 3 and 4 largest GDP....Where do you stand??? Do you want me to tell you where do you stand in this list????Nails in their legs.....

and how you assume Pakistan won't be as big as Japan one day?Just because of your anti-Pakistani Hatred.China was a poor country just 3 decades ago and today it's world 2nd largest economy.

 

[deckingraj]

and how you assume Pakistan won't be as big as Japan one day?Just because of your anti-Pakistani Hatred.China was a poor country just 3 decades ago and today it's world 2nd largest economy.

I don't want to ask your age but the kind of response i was expecting is not there.....You might have missed it so let me repost...

In short what is India to US is what Pakistan to China minus lucrative market....Make yourself worth(which i know Pak will) and people will come for your support with their tails in their legs.....There were times when Pak was clocking more growth rate then India....That is the time that you need to bring back and civilian nuclear deal will be a matter of time....

B/W when you will reach where Japan and Germany are you will not need any civilian nuclear deal....

 

[Nahraf]

They are just objecting for Public Relations and to keep few lobbies happy. They actually support this deal since it gives Pakistan much needed electric generation capacity. These two reacters at Chashma are 325 MW each. Now the negotiations must start on much delayed two 1000 MW each nuclear plants at Karachi.

 

[deckingraj]

They are just objecting for Public Relations and to keep few lobbies happy. They actually support this deal since it gives Pakistan much needed electric generation capacity. These two reacters at Chashma are 325 MW each. Now the negotiations must start on much delayed two 1000 MW each nuclear plants at Karachi.

I hope what you are saying is correct but may i ask how do you know??? secondly what public relations are you talking about??? Isn't the image in Pak is going to go downstream??? Secondly the lobbies that you are talking about are not naive that they don't know if US objects then nothing can pass in NSG....Don't you think so???

 

[M8R]

I don't want to ask your age but the kind of response i was expecting is not there.....You might have missed it so let me repost...



B/W when you will reach where Japan and Germany are you will not need any civilian nuclear deal....

So you mean a developing nuclear power should not be given new reactors for power generation?You do know how absurd this logic this.Then Developing counties would never develop.Canada supplied you reactor when you were poor country.So did Russia.This is not US supplying us.It is China who is happy with supplying us reactors but US is putting it's leg where it does not belong.

 

[Nahraf]

if US objects then nothing can pass in NSG....Don't you think so???

US will not object. Only time will prove this. This is all geopolitical game and US does not have much clout or will to fight on China-Pakistan deal. This is done deal and US knows that too.

 

[password]

US will not object. Only time will prove this. This is all geopolitical game and US does not have much clout or will to fight on China-Pakistan deal. This is done deal and US knows that too.

Ya surely they will not object .. obama and its administration made this statement in fully drunk position ????

 

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

I personally think that US isnt actually do much regarding the blockade its perhaps a move to appease NewDelhi. Are we forgetting how much the Chinese made noise abt the US selling arms to Taiwan. So China will evetually sell those Plants to Pakistan and all the US will get is, the max public whining against China as it did when US sold Arms to Taiwan.
However on the serious note if the US does pushes the matter to a greater height except for public whining then its true hypocrisy with the intention of debunking Pakistan once again..!
Frankly i don't put much faith in this act of US..!

 

[M8R]

^There is no doubt that Pakistan will get the reactors but this bitching attitude has to reciprocated by Pakistan's side.

 

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

^There is no doubt that Pakistan will get the reactors but this bitching attitude has to reciprocated by Pakistan's side.

yes i agree and youl see that happen in coming days in media reports and by alikes of JI leaders in talkshows and perhaps zaid hamid and Hamid Gul might also want to add a few thoughts..

 

[deckingraj]

So you mean a developing nuclear power should not be given new reactors for power generation?You do know how absurd this logic this.Then Developing counties would never develop.Canada supplied you reactor when you were poor country.So did Russia.This is not US supplying us.It is China who is happy with supplying us reactors but US is putting it's leg where it does not belong.

What post of mine gives you inclination that Pakistan should not get a civilian nuclear deal???? Again i am giving you benefit of doubt instead of calling you a kid...I only replaied to your comparison with Gernamy and Japan....As said earlier the world is hypocritical and unless you are worth to offer them something good in return you will not bag anything...

I hope you know that NSG was created only in 1976 in response to India's first nuclear test(when Pak was still learning the basic concepts of nukes) and she was EXCLUDED from the so called nuclear powers list....Do you see hypocracy there??? This ended only in 2004 and the reasons i have already given you....Your past records coupled with your present status is working against you even though i whole heartedly believe that all nations should get nuclear energy for peaceful means....B/W you know that by signing NPT you will get what you want...right????

 

[deckingraj]

I personally think that US isnt actually do much regarding the blockade its perhaps a move to appease NewDelhi. Are we forgetting how much the Chinese made noise abt the US selling arms to Taiwan. So China will evetually sell those Plants to Pakistan and all the US will get is, the max public whining against China as it did when US sold Arms to Taiwan.
However on the serious note if the US does pushes the matter to a greater height except for public whining then its true hypocrisy with the intention of debunking Pakistan once again..!
Frankly i don't put much faith in this act of US..!

I am sorry but i disagree....China hue and cry about selling weapons to Taiwan was a bilateral issue...US was not defaulting on any pact....If China suply of nuclear reactors to Pakistan is violation of NSG as alleged then this is a different ball game...

US will not say anything in public without will to carry it through...Reason is plane simple...Republicans will grill them if they(democrats) end up denting US image in any fashion...and you very well know how much work US had to do to get Japan and Australia on board as far as NSG approval for India is concerned...with US opposing deal is dead...unless CHina says Fukc you i am going ahead(which i doubt....)