Upgrade of Pakistans Bell AH-1F Cobra helicopters

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

The major operators of Apache (Israel, Egypt, Japan, England) have about 50.

For Pakistan, covering our vast Western borders, we need somewhere around 150-200 Gunships to effectively have air cover and provide fire support.

USA operates 741 Apache, the most that Pakistan can except is roughly 18-24 Apache Gunships.

I don't think that's enough to cover the entire region.

The Super Cobra has sophisticated sensors so that should be the interm option.

In the mean time, we should collaborate with Turkey and China to build Gunships locally.

India is already well on its way on producing indigenous gunships. We are making our own missiles, ships, submarines, tanks, air crafts, so why not Gunships.

Thats the option we should go for.

I think if any sound person , would sit down on a debate table , and make a case, I mean what good is an APAChe for Japan ?? They don't have a problem with any one for 50 years.....

Surely , Pakistan who are in middle of the hurricane's eye need the 80 apache helicoptors to help support US troops in Afghanistan other wise these rouge elemenst will keep getting away in pickup trucks or stolen cars , or humvees

With a sphisticated helicopter these rougue terrorist can be brought to justice , and we can also cross check any , terrorist planning fast attacks (in and out type from Afghan territories)

Its just plain and simple logic , I don't understand which part of that ppl in congress do not understand - if we send in our soldiers on just foot or patrol cars they are sitting ducks for ambush attacks so we need cover with Apache - helicopters in Pakistan Army's possesion to give a lethal blow to terrorist from air -

If Egypt can get Apache , and they have no problem , in their country surely we can qualify for Apache , considering we have had a history of joint cooperation with US in all fields of life

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Apache are cost prohibitive. Our needs for ground attack and troops support is not so needy. All we require is an effective, reliable, battle-proven, and durable system which can be operated in most demanding, hostile environments day & night.

The recent upgradations of 07/08 bore much fruit. As i said before, we need these choppers on priority basis. We cannot rely only on the Air Force for ground attack missions.



in the medium to long run, we can talk about other acquisitions & prospects. For now, we need to be rational. These are still very capable helicopters, in service and the Super Cobras to be inducted.


AH-1W Super Cobra Helicopter

The AH-1W is a twin-engined upgraded and improved AH-1 flown by the United States Marine Corps (USMC). Super Cobras are also in service the Tawainese and Turkish militaries. The AH-1 'Whiskey Cobra' has enhanced avionics and can carry a wider range of weapons than the standard AH-1.

The AH-1W has been in service with the USMC since 1985. 4 Squadrons of Super Cobras accompianed the USMC's push into Kuwait during the 1991 Gulf War where they proved highly effective in the anti-armor role. 1 sortie alone resulted in 60 iraqi tanks destroyed.

It's projected that the Super Cobra helicopter will stay in service for another 10 years until it is completely replaced by the AH-1Z (a further set of upgrades to the AH-1, including 5-blade rotors, advanced sensors and countermeasures)

AH-1W SUPER COBRA FEATURES

•20mm M197 cannon turret with 110 degree field of fire
•wire-cutting blades postion around the cockpit to deal with the threat of high-tension wires - a real problem at low altitude
•aluminium bodywork
•twin engines (a must for operations over water)
•2-blade steel/aluminium tail rotors
•night vision & electronic sensors allow for all-time / all-weather operations


AH-1W Super Cobra Specifications

Crew: 2 - With Pilot seated above and behind Gunner
Engines: 2 1212-kW General Electric T700-GE-401 turboshafts
(1,625hp each)

Dimensions
L - 58 ft
W (wingspan) - 10ft 7inches
H - 14ft 2 inches

Weights
4627 kg (empty)
6691 kg (max loudout)

Max Speed: 352 kph
Range: 395 km

Armament
M197 three barrel 20 mm cannon (750 rounds) @ 650 rounds per minute
TOW wire guided missiles
Hellfire laser-guided anti-tank missiles
FFAR rockets
Sidewinder air-to-air missiles
Avionics Night Targeting System (NTS) (FLIR, laser-designator)
AN/APR-39(V)2 Radar Warning Receiver
AN/ALE-39 chaff and flare dispensor



The AH-1W's chin houses the Night Targeting System, Laser Designator and the Forward-Looking InfraRed (FLIR) sensor. The gunner uses this sensor suite to aim and fire the host of anti-tank missiles, rockets and 20mm cannon in a typical AH-1W loadout.

Helicopter Photos - AH-1W

p.s. old article.....worth reading. I'm sure many of the issues HAVE been corrected; but just to get an idea of what kind of problems the Apaches faced

Apaches Are Ailing Warriors

 

[Mercenary]

I think if any sound person , would sit down on a debate table , and make a case, I mean what good is an APAChe for Japan ?? They don't have a problem with any one for 50 years.....

Surely , Pakistan who are in middle of the hurricane's eye need the 80 apache helicoptors to help support US troops in Afghanistan other wise these rouge elemenst will keep getting away in pickup trucks or stolen cars , or humvees

With a sphisticated helicopter these rougue terrorist can be brought to justice , and we can also cross check any , terrorist planning fast attacks (in and out type from Afghan territories)

Its just plain and simple logic , I don't understand which part of that ppl in congress do not understand - if we send in our soldiers on just foot or patrol cars they are sitting ducks for ambush attacks so we need cover with Apache - helicopters in Pakistan Army's possesion to give a lethal blow to terrorist from air -

If Egypt can get Apache , and they have no problem , in their country surely we can qualify for Apache , considering we have had a history of joint cooperation with US in all fields of life

Apache Gunships were designed in the 1980's for combat operations against Soviet Forces in European battlefields.

When they first got deployed to the Persian gulf, they faced numerous territorial related problems such as Dust getting in, engines over heating, etc.

Cobra were designed in the 1970's specifically for the Marines and their combat operations in Vietnam in the Central highlands and the DMZ.

Cobras are very rugged and performed superbly against the North Vietnamese Army and Viet Cong.

They are an ideal anti-insurgent platform.

Apaches are just too expensive and are mostly good for conventional battles and not guerrilla warfare.

Super-Cobra is the best option for Pakistan, getting about 50 of these Machines will give us the ideal air cover to conduct operations.

However, later, on we can get Apaches for deployment against India and its rapidly growing Tank forces.

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Apache Gunships were designed in the 1980's for combat operations against Soviet Forces in European battlefields.

When they first got deployed to the Persian gulf, they faced numerous territorial related problems such as Dust getting in, engines over heating, etc.

Cobra were designed in the 1970's specifically for the Marines and their combat operations in Vietnam in the Central highlands and the DMZ.

Cobras are very rugged and performed superbly against the North Vietnamese Army and Viet Cong.

They are an ideal anti-insurgent platform.

Apaches are just too expensive and are mostly good for conventional battles and not guerrilla warfare.

Super-Cobra is the best option for Pakistan, getting about 50 of these Machines will give us the ideal air cover to conduct operations.

However, later, on we can get Apaches for deployment against India and its rapidly growing Tank forces.

Very informative response - learned more on Apache

But I am suprised , as its still used by Middle eastern nations - they must have figured out to use a coolant to cool the engines , or better filters for dust filtrations -

Part of thing I don't like About our current fleet is that well first the US company does not makes Cobras anymore , so we need to get rid of these helicopters , or get them replaced when we can otherwise we will have dead machines in next 5-10 years time specially after all the missions we will do and work over load on these helicopters -

Its a great point of concern just like frigates are for Navy

 

[rotor]

Upgrading Cobra's is a bad a choice. Aircraft is nearly 30 years old. Funding more than likely to come from US and upgrading it will compromise any funding for a new attack platform.

I hear talk of the AH-1Z, again a bad choice primarily due to very poor hot high performance even worse than its predecessors AH-1W and AH-1F's. Its electronics are also too complicated as it first flew in 2001 and its 2010 and it still has not been fielded. Also it costs USD 75 Mil a piece which is more than the AH-64 and the new Battle Hawk. AH-64's run at about USD 60 Million and you can get a fully weaponized Battle Hawk (Hellfire, Rockets, Machine Guns,) for about USD 30 Million. Main thing is hot/high performance and price. AH-1Z mediocre, AH-64 a little better, the new Battle Hawk can conduct major operations at over 16,000 feet!!! and it costs half as much as any other Attack Platforms. UAE's bought it, Israel has bought it, and so has Columbia.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Upgrading Cobra's is a bad a choice. Aircraft is nearly 30 years old. Funding more than likely to come from US and upgrading it will compromise any funding for a new attack platform.
.

brother, what is your very short-term solution then? We have the choppers in Pakistan and are using them for ground support and attack missions.

We can think in long-run, but for NOW what do you propose

 

[Blackpearl]

Pakistan got 20 AH-1F in mid 80s. In 2007, 12 additional AH-1F were given by USA. These new helos were the same lot from 80s, however placed in storage. A Pakistan Army team went to USA in 2005/06, and selected those 12 helos out of hundreds, which are placed in storage. The selected airframes were refurbished-----> new wiring, overhauled engines, transmissions, and other major components. The refurbishment gave these helicopters a new life, and they are as potent as new helos.

Cobras are aggressively used in COIN ops. A short term solution, to which USA would also agree, is that, Pakistan selects another 20-25 airframes, old AH-1F models, which are stored in USA. Refurbish them. Last years, there was a discussion in this forum, about upgrade of our cobras with Zulu model avionics. The same upgrade would be applied to these new airframes (re-Furb).

The whole process would take not more then a year. it may also prove cost effective as single airframe with overhauled engines, power train components, avionics would cost 1-2 M $. weapon package would remain the same, as F models cannot be configured to carry any other weapon other then 20 mm cannon, 70 mm rockets, and TOWs.

Additional cobras would be smoothly absorbed in Army, Our pilots know well how to handle it. technicians know how to maintain it, and now our forces on ground, also are well conversent with limitations and capabilities of this machine.

 

[Super Falcon]

The AH-1W Super Cobra is the US Marines' attack helicopter. It is supplied by Bell Helicopter Textron, and entered service in 1985. As well as the US Marine Corps, the Super Cobra is operational with the Turkish Land Forces and the armed forces of Taiwan. The AH-1W was deployed in support of Operation Iraqi Freedom in March 2003.

Super Cobra upgrade programme

A major upgrade of the Bell Super Cobra known as the H-1 programme is underway.

The programme calls for the remanufacture of the US Marine Corps fleet of 180 AH-1W Super Cobra and 100 UH-1N utility helicopters to an advanced four-bladed configuration.

The existing two-bladed semi-rigid, teetering rotor system is being replaced with a four-bladed, hingeless, bearingless rotor system. The improvement in flight characteristics provided by the four-bladed configuration has led to increases in flight envelope, maximum speed, vertical rate-of-climb, payload and rotor vibration level.

The USMC subsequently decided on new-build rather than remanufactured UH-1Y helicopters and, in February 2008, awarded Bell a contract for the new build of 40 of the proposed 180 AH-1Z helicopters. Four additional helicopters were ordered in September 2008. The new-build AH-1Z will be fitted with the uprated T700-401C engines, also fitted on the UH-1Y.

First flight of the AH-1Z took place in December 2000. The AH-1W entered low-rate initial production (LRIP) in October 2003. Five AH-1W helicopters were remanufactured to AH-1Z standard and took part in flight testing at NAS Patuxent River, Maryland. Sea trials in May 2005 included the first shipboard landing on USS Bataan, Wasp Class amphibious assault ship.

Developmental testing was completed in February 2006 and two test aircraft began operational evaluation (OPEVAL) with the USMC in May 2006. The first production AH-1Z helicopter was delivered to the USMC in January 2007. Phase II of OPEVAL began in February 2008. A full-rate production decision is expected in 2009. Initial operating capability is scheduled for July 2011.

The Turkish Army selected the AH-1Z King Cobra in July 2000 with a request for 50 out of a total requirement for 145 helicopters. In May 2004, it was announced that the acquisition was to be cancelled. The helicopters were to be built in Turkey by Tusas Aerospace Industries (TAI).

Cockpit
Northrop Grumman has developed the integrated avionics systems for the AH-1Z. The systems include two mission computers and an automatic flight control system with four-axis stability control augmentation system. Each crew station has two 8in×6in multifunction displays and one 4.2in×4.2in dual function display, based on active matrix liquid crystal colour technology.

The displays are supplied by L-3 Ruggedised Command and Control Solutions. Smiths Aerospace supplied the weapon stores control and data transfer system.

"The AH-1W Super Cobra helicopter was deployed in support of Operation Iraqi Freedom in March 2003."The communications suite combines the new US Navy RT-1824 integrated radio, UHF/VHF, COMSEC and modem in a single unit. The navigation suite includes an embedded GPS inertial (EGI), a low-airspeed air data subsystem, which allows weapons delivery when hovering and a digital map.

In June 2002, Thales Avionics' TopOwl helmet-mounted display system was chosen for the USMC AH-1Z. The first system was delivered in January 2003. TopOwl, also fitted on Tiger, NH90 and Rooivalk helicopters, has integrated Gen IV image intensifier and FLIR capability and provides transition from day to night use at the push of a button.

Weapons and missiles
The Super Cobra can carry both TOW and Hellfire anti-armour missiles and is being qualified to carry the Maverick missile. The Raytheon BGM-71 TOW missile has a range of more than 3km and semi-automatic command-to-line-of-sight guidance. The AGM-114 Hellfire missile is manufactured by Lockheed Martin. It is equipped with a semi-active laser seeker and has a range of 7km. The Super Cobra has fire-and-forget capability when firing the Hellfire missile in co-operative mode with laser target illumination.

The Super Cobra was the first attack helicopter to qualify both the Sidewinder air-to-air missile and the Sidearm anti-radiation missile. Both missiles can use the same LAU-7 rail launcher. Sidearm has a range of more than 15km. AIM-9L Sidewinder is an all-aspect, short-range, air-to-air missile produced by Lockheed Martin and Raytheon. The missile has a range of 15km.

The Super Cobra can fire the Hydra family of unguided 70mm rockets or the larger 127mm Zuni rocket bombs. From 2008, it will be armed with the advanced precision kill weapon system (APKWS), a guided version of the Hydra. The US Army re-opened the competition for the APKWS in September 2005 and a decision on contractor is expected in March 2006.

The Super Cobra carries a three-barrel, 20mm Gatling gun for close range (up to 2km) engagement and 750 rounds of ammunition. With the gun in a fixed forward position, the pilot can aim by manoeuvring the helicopter. Either crew member can slave the turret to the helmet-mounted sight and aim the gun by looking at the target.

"The Super Cobra carries a three-barrel, 20mm Gatling gun for close range engagement."The AH-1Z for the USMC will be armed with: 16 Hellfire missiles, six AIM-9 Sidewinder air-to-air missiles, 70mm rocket pods (7- and 19-shot), and a 20mm gun.

Sensors
Targeting for the AH-1W is provided by the night targeting system (NTS), jointly produced by Tamam Division of Israel Aircraft Industries Ltd and Kollsman.

NTS integrates a forward-looking infrared (FLIR) which provides automatic target tracking with a laser designator / rangefinder and video recorder.

Lockheed Martin has developed a longer range AN/AAQ-30 target sight system (TSS) for the AH-1Z to replace the NTS. TSS includes a third-generation four field-of-view FLIR based on a 3-5-micron staring array, CCD colour TV, Kollsman eyesafe laser rangefinder / designator and multi-target autotracker. L-3 Communications Wescam supplies the turret assembly. Lockheed Martin was awarded a contract to supply the first 16 systems to the USMC in March 2008.

Longbow International (a joint venture of Lockheed Martin and Northrop Grumman) is developing the Cobra Radar System for the AH-1Z, based on the Longbow millimetre wave radar on the AH-64D Apache. Cobra is a pod-based radar that can be mounted on a wingtip or in a stores position. Cobra can automatically search, detect, classify and prioritise multiple moving and stationary targets. It has a range of 8km against moving and 4km against stationary targets.

Countermeasures
The H1 Super Cobra upgrade includes provision of a new electronic warfare suite. A new radar warner, the AN/APR-39(XE2) from Lockheed Martin, replaces the Lockheed Martin AN/APR-39(V)2 pulse radar warner and the AEL Industries AN/APR-44 continuous-wave radar warner.

The ATK AN/AAR-47 missile warning system has been included in the upgrade suite. AN/AAR-47 uses infrared detectors to detect the missile plume. The Goodrich (formerly Raytheon) AN/AVR-2A laser warning receiver has also been added. The infrared countermeasures system is the AN/ALQ-144A developed by BAE Systems IEWS (formerly Sanders, a Lockheed Martin company).

"Super Cobra is armed with TOW missiles."The helicopter is also equipped with the AN/ALE-39 chaff and infrared flare dispenser manufactured by BAE Systems Integrated Defense Solutions (formerly Tracor) and Lockheed Martin Tactical Defense Systems.

Engines
Twin General Electric T700-GE-401 turboshaft engines provide a total of 2,410kW or 3,380shp.

In standard conditions, with an air-to-air ordnance load, the SuperCobra can take off and climb out at more than 4.1m/s on only one engine. It can hover out of ground effect (OGE) at 914m, with a load of four TOW and four Hellfire missiles, full turret ammunition and rockets

 

[Super Falcon]

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[Super Falcon]

i bellieve too that pakistan army should have gone for apaches ortiger helis rathar than upgrading it

 

[fatman17]

go for AH-1F standard with Hellfire AGMs. cheap, effective and potent. the issue with the PAA is the number of 'systems' operating which is a logistic nightmare for the ground staff. - french/russian/american. - what we require is a 'rationalization' here.

medlift - russian
SAR,recon & attack - american

adopt KISS mantra!

 

[asim.mian10]

now pakistan think about made its own attack helicopter -caz pak also achieve jf17 thunder

 

[zagahaga]

hmmm i have an idea...
iran has a super cobra plant yes?
how about we get the blue print for it.
then get tech from EU AND AMERICA
same like al khalid

 

[fatman17]

hmmm i have an idea...
iran has a super cobra plant yes?
how about we get the blue print for it.
then get tech from EU AND AMERICA
same like al khalid

 

[zagahaga]

very funny ... we cant its a illegal copy ... sigh...... guess we ghotta look at the yanks....
you do know that iran makes identical copies of super cobra yes?