Ukraine says Malaysian airliner shot down, 295 dead: agency

[ptldM3]

So by Your logic, if the Ukrainans shot down MH17, it would have been ignored by Western Media.
Since it is all over the news, this is proof, they did not do it!

(Failed Logic, but could not resist)

I do agree that accusations have to be backed up by documentation.

No if was shot down by the Ukrainians it would simply be blamed on Russia. Everything is blamed on Russia, heck the Odessa massacre was being blamed on Russia by some politicians.

The Ukrainians military has killed a lot more then 295 civilians, where is the outrage? I am not taking sides on who shot down the aircraft, for now it is a 50/50 split. Ukraine's checkered past of shooting down civilian airliners and denying it does not help their case, either does the fact that a Ukrainian Buk was photographed in the area.

Russia helping rebels to destroy evidence at MH17 crash site: Ukraine

Kiev: Ukraine on Saturday accused Russia of helping separatist insurgents they say shot down Malaysian airliner MH17 try to destroy evidence at the crash site

"The Ukrainian government officially announces: terrorists with the support of Russia are trying to destroy proof of this international crime," Ukraine's government said in a statement.

It adding that rebels had removed 38 bodies from the scene and were blocking Ukrainian investigators from accessing the site.

Rebels trying to destroy crash evidence `with Russian support`: Kiev

Oh god....the news coming out of Ukraine is comical, Russia is at fault for everything, Ukrainian "proof" has been nothing more then cheap propaganda with zero evidence and usually many claims made by Ukraine has been proven false.

 

[flamer84]

No if was shot down by the Ukrainians it would simply be blamed on Russia. Everything is blamed on Russia, heck the Odessa massacre was being blamed on Russia by some politicians.

The Ukrainians military has killed a lot more then 295 civilians, where is the outrage? I am not taking sides on who shot down the aircraft, for now it is a 50/50 split. Ukraine's checkered past of shooting down civilian airliners and denying it does not help their case either does the fact that a Ukrainian Buk was photographed in the area.




Oh god....the news coming out of Ukraine is comical, Russia is at fault for everything, Ukrainian "proof" has been nothing more then cheap propaganda with zero evidence and usually many claims made by Ukraine has been proven false.

It would be more humane if you would just express regrets for what Russia did and be done with it.295 people were murdered by the separatists (most likely by the Russian advisors manning the missile systems) and even in death their memory is tarnished by yours and others propaganda.All the evidences (radar location-sep areea,tweeter vkontakt messages,bragging of the seps,the previous downing of Ukr aircraft) point to one direction -Russians.You f-ed people,at least own to the horror you've created instead of digging your hole even deeper.You know it,I know it,all of the world knows it now,that's why one by one countries start to name the seps and Russia directly.No doubt that in the next few days more and more will accuse you of this crime.

 

[Hack-Hook]

It would be more humane if you would just express regrets for what Russia did and be done with it.295 people were murdered by the separatists (most likely by the Russian advisors manning the missile systems) and even in death their memory is tarnished by yours and others propaganda.All the evidences (radar location-sep areea,tweeter vkontakt messages,bragging of the seps,the previous downing of Ukr aircraft) point to one direction -Russians.You f-ed people,at least own to the horror you've created instead of digging your hole even deeper.You know it,I know it,all of the world knows it now,that's why one by one countries start to name the seps and Russia directly.No doubt that in the next few days more and more will accuse you of this crime.

Even Russian Advisor can't hit shit with that missile if they don't have radar

 

[flamer84]

Even Russian Advisor can hit shit with that missile if they don't have radar

They did ok with Ukr planes up until now ,i doubt that a civilian air liner would be such a great undertaking.They have radars,rest assured,it was showed by the downing of Ukr planes before.They did it,they are guilty,all the water of the world can't wash them clean now anymore.

 

[Hack-Hook]

They did ok with Ukr planes up until now ,i doubt that a civilian air liner would be such a great undertaking.They have radars,rest assured,it was showed by the downing of Ukr planes before.They did it,they are guilty,all the water of the world can't wash them clean now anymore.

they used man-pads and hit them at the altitude of less than 6 km not at more than 10km

Russia helping rebels to destroy evidence at MH17 crash site: Ukraine

Kiev: Ukraine on Saturday accused Russia of helping separatist insurgents they say shot down Malaysian airliner MH17 try to destroy evidence at the crash site

"The Ukrainian government officially announces: terrorists with the support of Russia are trying to destroy proof of this international crime," Ukraine's government said in a statement.

It adding that rebels had removed 38 bodies from the scene and were blocking Ukrainian investigators from accessing the site.

Rebels trying to destroy crash evidence `with Russian support`: Kiev

oh I get it they must let the Animals remove the bodies , not removing the remain themselves and then Identifying them and hand them back to the families ?

 

[ptldM3]

It would be more humane if you would just express regrets for what Russia did and be done with it.295 people were murdered by the separatists (most likely by the Russian advisors manning the missile systems) and even in death their memory is tarnished by yours and others propaganda.All the evidences (radar location-sep areea,tweeter vkontakt messages,bragging of the seps,the previous downing of Ukr aircraft) point to one direction -Russians.You f-ed people,at least own to the horror you've created instead of digging your hole even deeper.You know it,I know it,all of the world knows it now,that's why one by one countries start to name the seps and Russia directly.No doubt that in the next few days more and more will accuse you of this crime.

Of course it is tragic what happened but so far there is no solid evidence. Some supposed Ukrainian voice recording is equates to toilet paper. Anyone can fabricate a recording, if Ukraine was so great at intercepting rebel leaders conversations then those rebels would have been killed long ago and the military operation would not have been a disaster.

Moreover, there is a Spanish flight controller that tweeted that there was Ukrainians fighters in the area of the downed aircraft and that he was threatened by Ukrainian military. Is it proof? Maybe but it is ironic how you chose to ignore the Spanish flight recorder but picked up other claims that are no more credible. Also what about Ukraine's checkered past of shooting down a Russian airliner and then denying it? What about Ukrainian Buk missiles being photographed in the area of the downed aircraft?

Being selective are we?

Also Russian military advisors would never shoot down an airliners, military advisors are usally the best trained and they would know the difference between a transponder from a civilian aircraft and a military one. Ukraine on the other hand has a very poorly trained military and has in the past mistakenly shot down a Russian airliner.

 

[kalu_miah]

Putin, the scumbag terrorist, has killed 300 innocent people, "blown them out of the sky". ICJ should confiscate Russian assets and pay compensation to the victims families. It will not bring back loved ones, but at least it will ease some of the pain.

 

[flamer84]

Of course it is tragic what happened but so far there is no solid evidence. Some supposed Ukrainian voice recording is equates to toilet paper. Anyone can fabricate a recording, if Ukraine was so great at intercepting rebel leaders conversations then those rebels would have been killed long ago and the military operation would not have been a disaster.

Moreover, there is a Spanish flight controller that tweeted that there was Ukrainians fighters in the area of the downed aircraft and that he was threatened by Ukrainian military. Is it proof? Maybe but it is ironic how you chose to ignore the Spanish flight recorder but picked up other claims that are no more credible. Also what about Ukraine's checkered past of shooting down a Russian airliner and then denying it? What about Ukrainian Buk missiles being photographed in the area of the downed aircraft?

Being selective are we?

Spanish flight controller was debunked as a myth,nobody heard of him,including Spanish authorities who even released a statement saying there is no such person.

 

[ptldM3]

Spanish flight controller was debunked as a myth,nobody heard of him,including Spanish authorities who even released a statement saying there is no such person.

I added more to my previous post. Like i said Russian military advisors would know the difference between a civilian airliner and a military one. Moreover the Ukrainian military had a Buk in the area of the downed aircraft and of course Ukraine has in the past shot down civilian airliners.


So why are you ignoring these actual facts?

Putin, the scumbag terrorist, has killed 300 innocent people, "blown them out of the sky". ICJ should confiscate Russian assets and pay compensation to the victims families. It will not bring back loved ones, but at least it will ease some of the pain.

Did he? Amazing how you know this, you must have been there right?

 

[flamer84]

I added more to my previous post. Like i said Russian military advisors would know the difference between a civilian airliner and a military one. Moreover the Ukrainian military had a Buk in the area of the downed aircraft and of course Ukraine has in the past shot down civilian airliners.


So why are you ignoring these actual facts?




Did he? Amazing how you know this, you must have been there right?

1.The seps admitted downing the plane,granted,they thought it was a Ukr plane.

2.NATO radars,AWACS pin pointed the location of the fired missile-Separatisty held territory.

3.Seps bragging of having Buk before.

4.Previous downing of Ukr planes.

This is an open and shut case.No doubt NATO will present their recordings in a short time,Russia hasn't said anything about their radars picking up the missile in Ukr territory,they know the guilty party as well.

 

[ptldM3]

1.The seps admitted downing the plane,granted,they thought it was a Ukr plane.

The rebels deny that they were the ones that targeted the aircraft. The amount of lies and misinformation that Ukraine has put out really hurts their credibility. Are tweets and recordings real? possible but it is very easy to fake, and Ukraine is know to fake.

2.NATO radars,AWACS pin pointed the location of the fired missile-Separatisty held territory.

The ukrainian military is fighting in rebel held territory, so this not proof of any kind.

3.Seps bragging of having Buk before.

Ukrainians actually have Buk.

4.Previous downing of Ukr planes.

Ukraine previously downing a Russian airliner.


You are also wrong, you follow to much western and Ukrainian news, Russia is calling for a full investigation.

 

[flamer84]

Russia is calling for a full investigation

Now you take us for retards.Even since yesterday armed separatists forbid access to investigators to the crash site.One word from Putin and investigators would be allowed.Russia doesn't want that because it knows that international investigators will only confirm the obvious truth:Russian backed separatists are guilty as charged.

Why don't the separatists allow investigators in ? From all countries,including Russia,a sort of international team.

 

[ptldM3]

Now you take us for retards.Even since yesterday armed separatists forbid access to investigators to the crash site.One word from Putin and investigators would be allowed.Russia doesn't want that because it knows that international investigators will only confirm the obvious truth:Russian backed separatists are guilty as charged.

Why don't the separatists allow investigators in ? From all countries,including Russia,a sort of international team.

BBC News - MH17 crash: OSCE investigators reach east ...

International investigators have arrived at the crash site of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17, after rebels in eastern Ukraine allowed them access.

This article was written almost a day ago, which means you are wrong.

 

[Bobshouse]

You are dismissed, some of the greatest defensive and offensive military strategies have come from the Soviet Union. Some of the largest military operations in history such as Kursk required required massive planning, concealment, reconnaissance, ect, The biggest strategy came in planing assaults, defenses, deciding how much reserves to use and when, deciding when to fall back, what devisions to use, ect, ect.

Like i said you are dismissed.

Thats seriously laughable

The battle where the soviets had overwhelming troop a machine numbers but still lost 3 men to very german 1?
The battle that the soviets were only able to wage due to their sheer numbers and the supply of equipment from the allies?
You mean the battle where they had lines of their own soldiers shooting their own front line troops that were retreating?

No solider you are dismissed, time to clean to latrine

 

[flamer84]

BBC News - MH17 crash: OSCE investigators reach east ...





This article was written almost a day ago, which means you are wrong.

No.They were denied access.The article is wrong.Corpses rott on that field while separatists loot the remains.