U.K., U.S. at Odds Over Saudi Deal

[lem34]

ALSO.
Those serving in these forces are Muslims... and to doubt..that given the call to defend their religion over..say an element within the monarchy that is acting against the interests of Islam.. is foolish.
Do not doubt the effectiveness of what is in their hearts...
These are Muslim Soldiers.. who under the right leadership will be Soldiers of Islam.

Very true Sir unfortunately the same can be said about the Iranian soldiers. So the worst for all of us Muslim vs Muslim

 

[Arabian Legend]

US actually has no problem with the purchase their problem is the paveway technology it is both laser guided and GPS guided and the most advanced in it's kind so tue US has a problem because it contains some US tech in it. The same problem they had with the ToT of the Typhoon but we got it anyways.

KSA wants to build a formidable defense industry utilizing TOT of the most advanced weapons ever created.

exactly look at the pics here shown the paveway iv on the KSA typhoon

 

[Mosamania]

exactly look at the pics here shown the paveway iv on the KSA typhoon

When have ever US objected on a simple sale?? They don't want to lose KSA as a customer it is funny really they are panicking and $hitting bricks of the thought of the amount of ToT we are getting from across the globe hell even Japan have agreed to transfer defense technologies to us in exchange of writing off debt they owe us same with south Korea.

Man I wish I have a time machine and travel 10 years into the future.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

+350 First blood + Double Kill + offended 

Loved that comment. Saudi pilots have 4-0 history of Air to Air. 2 Iraqi Mirages and 2 Iranian F-4s.

cool
tell us more or link if discussed already

 

[BLACKEAGLE]

cool
tell us more or link if discussed already

Hariri was in the House of King Fahd when he was told the outcome of the recent clash between the Saudi aircrafts and Iranian aircrafts that violated Saudi airspace and said:

«One day, during the Iraq war - Iranian aircraft violated Saudi airspace before being intercepted by Saudi aircrafts and two of Iranian jets were shot down and the third one was hit. We were with the King Fahd when he told of the incident. Wait a bit, then ordered to be announced for shooting down one aircraft. We asked him why, he replied: If we announced the hit of three aircraft we will be like someone who insults the Iranian army. We do not want a confrontation with Iran or a problem with it. If they publicly got humiliated, the Iranian army feels that his duty to respond. Iran's military knows what happened, so there is no need to take out the whole incident into the public domain ».

 

[Irfan Baloch]

When have ever US objected on a simple sale?? They don't want to lose KSA as a customer it is funny really they are panicking and $hitting bricks of the thought of the amount of ToT we are getting from across the globe hell even Japan have agreed to transfer defense technologies to us in exchange of writing off debt they owe us same with south Korea.

Man I wish I have a time machine and travel 10 years into the future.

sorry for the lack of word but this attitude of Americans is obnoxious. they got $30 billion deal secured then why cause nuisance over bombs? like I said, the worry for the sensitive tech is ill-placed because Saudis have not shared anything that is sold to them under certain conditions.

your last post about American reservations about European Typhoon's ToT are even more ridiculous. I get that they dont want to loose a good customer but ToT of one or two planes/ weapons is not going to make much difference unless there is an industrial base with a healthy pool of engineers, technicians and designers from the Saudi population.

maybe if going forward Saudis make a tentative start like the Chinese then that might raise some eyebrows but look at china which is still reliant on Russians for the jet engines and other top end military equipment.

I guess there is some Islamophobia is at play here. Americans are very good at turning away from their agreements whenever it suits them and they would leave a weaker party high and dry with legislation and amendments. case in point PAF being stung many times when our F-16s were not only denied but we were charged for their storage too. indeed Saudis cant be pushed like that because they control the black gold's flow to America but it doesnt stop them from doing what you said re Typhoons and now this.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Hariri was in the House of King Fahd when he was told the outcome of the recent clash between the Saudi aircrafts and Iranian aircrafts that violated Iranian airspace and said:

«One day, during the Iraq war - Iranian aircraft violated Saudi airspace before being intercepted by Saudi aircrafts and two of Iranian jets were shot down and the third one was hit. We were with the King Fahd when he told of the incident. Wait a bit, then ordered to be announced for shooting down one aircraft. We asked him why, he replied: If we announced the hit of three aircraft we will be like someone who insults the Iranian army. We do not want a confrontation with Iran or a problem with it. If they publicly got humiliated, the Iranian army feels that his duty to respond. Iran's military knows what happened is no need to take out the whole incident into the public domain ».

Humiliated?
is it some kind of an insult match or late night slag fest? war is wart and shooting down planes is no joke. there is a winner and a looser.

found something

Saudi Arabia shot down an Iranian F-4 in June 1984. Privately, the Saudi government feared the downing of the Iranian fighter would lead to an escalation of Iranian attacks on Saudi shipping,

I think it must be made public to set the record straight. Israelis never tire about their total air domination and beating the whole Arab armies like plump. they dont call it humiliation of Arabs they call it defeat of the Arabs.
there was disparity in training and military hardware. what chance did the Mig-21s have against Israeli F-15s? but never mind lets leave it for another thread.

 

[BLACKEAGLE]

cool
tell us more or link if discussed already

Humiliated?
is it some kind of an insult match or late night slag fest? war is wart and shooting down planes is no joke. there is a winner and a looser.
I think it must be made public to set the record straight. Israelis never tire about their total air domination and beating the whole Arab armies like plump. they dont call it humiliation of Arabs they call it defeat of the Arabs.
there was disparity in training and military hardware. what chance did the Mig-21s have against Israeli F-15s? but never mind lets leave it for another thread.

You misunderstood king Fahd speech, he said that Iran would feel humiliated if we announce the shot down of two jets as well as the hit of the third one to the public. So, he didn't say that Iran got humiliated.

 

[BLACKEAGLE]

Humiliated?
is it some kind of an insult match or late night slag fest? war is wart and shooting down planes is no joke. there is a winner and a looser.

found something


I think it must be made public to set the record straight. Israelis never tire about their total air domination and beating the whole Arab armies like plump. they dont call it humiliation of Arabs they call it defeat of the Arabs.
there was disparity in training and military hardware. what chance did the Mig-21s have against Israeli F-15s? but never mind lets leave it for another thread.

The Iranian aircrafts that were shot down were F-4 not mig-21.

 

[Mosamania]

sorry for the lack of word but this attitude of Americans is obnoxious. they got $30 billion deal secured then why cause nuisance over bombs? like I said, the worry for the sensitive tech is ill-placed because Saudis have not shared anything that is sold to them under certain conditions.

your last post about American reservations about European Typhoon's ToT are even more ridiculous. I get that they dont want to loose a good customer but ToT of one or two planes/ weapons is not going to make much difference unless there is an industrial base with a healthy pool of engineers, technicians and designers from the Saudi population.

maybe if going forward Saudis make a tentative start like the Chinese then that might raise some eyebrows but look at china which is still reliant on Russians for the jet engines and other top end military equipment.

I guess there is some Islamophobia is at play here. Americans are very good at turning away from their agreements whenever it suits them and they would leave a weaker party high and dry with legislation and amendments. case in point PAF being stung many times when our F-16s were not only denied but we were charged for their storage too. indeed Saudis cant be pushed like that because they control the black gold's flow to America but it doesnt stop them from doing what you said re Typhoons and now this.

Because 5% of the Typhoon Tech is American Technology the US objected heavily on the full ToT of the Typhoon and creating classes and courses for graduate Saudi Engineers on Typhoon Assembly and Making "Part of the deal" here are pictures of these classes:

And this will transfer the know how of Fighter Jet Manufacturing to this generation of Saudi Engineers which is the main reason behind US objection and reviving the "Yamama" deal signed in the 80s corruption scandal to ruin this deal. However the deal went through and the Know How of Fighter Jet manufacturing is being transferred and the Industrial base is being built so it is only a matter of time before we make a fighter jet of our own.

Irfan Bhai you forget that 65% of the Saudi population is still in schools and in school age when those grow up there will be a huge pool of Engineers and designers released into the market and industry all at once so things won't remain the same.
Jet Engines all I can tell you is wait 5-7 years for good news regarding that

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Because 5% of the Typhoon Tech is American Technology the US objected heavily on the full ToT of the Typhoon and creating classes and courses for graduate Saudi Engineers on Typhoon Assembly and Making "Part of the deal" here are pictures of these classes:

And this will transfer the know how of Fighter Jet Manufacturing to this generation of Saudi Engineers which is the main reason behind US objection and reviving the "Yamama" deal signed in the 80s corruption scandal to ruin this deal. However the deal went through and the Know How of Fighter Jet manufacturing is being transferred and the Industrial base is being built so it is only a matter of time before we make a fighter jet of our own.

Irfan Bhai you forget that 65% of the Saudi population is still in schools and in school age when those grow up there will be a huge pool of Engineers and designers released into the market and industry all at once so things won't remain the same.
Jet Engines all I can tell you is wait 5-7 years for good news regarding that

power to your nation and all the best
I recall the talk among us whenever Saudi Air force was discussed which had a note of disappointment and some joke too that the pilots were not all Saudis and even the minor repair and maintenance was done in US resulting in huge payments by Saudi government and we used to say why dont they work of building own infrastructure or at least the facilities to overhaul and service the crafts locally.
it seems that stage is long past and very well done indeed.

And thanks for educating about the US element in the Typhoon. that explains why it is able to integrate with part American weapons too. maybe all NATO countries try to build compatible platforms and weapons so that they can share them together for the best mix.

good luck with these endeavors

 

[Mosamania]

power to your nation and all the best
I recall the talk among us whenever Saudi Air force was discussed which had a note of disappointment and some joke too that the pilots were not all Saudis and even the minor repair and maintenance was done in US resulting in huge payments by Saudi government and we used to say why dont they work of building own infrastructure or at least the facilities to overhaul and service the crafts locally.
it seems that stage is long past and very well done indeed.

And thanks for educating about the US element in the Typhoon. that explains why it is able to integrate with part American weapons too. maybe all NATO countries try to build compatible platforms and weapons so that they can share them together for the best mix.

good luck with these endeavors

This statement of yours is the only reason I joined PDF..... Mission Accomplished...

And thank you. And by the Irfan Bhai... It is both our nations not just mine. Each and every Muslim is welcome here with open arms.

 

[A1Kaid]

The country that usually hampers US arms deal to KSA is Israel. Their lobby here AIPAC places pressure on the US to not allow KSA to attain a qualitative edge over Israel, so US Defence deals with KSA must be done with Israel's interest in mind.
So Saudis have little choice to incorporate the technology that they import and begin to produce their own self-sufficient capability I suppose they already know this and are making progress in this field.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

This statement of yours is the only reason I joined PDF..... Mission Accomplished...

And thank you. And by the Irfan Bhai... It is both our nations not just mine. Each and every Muslim is welcome here with open arms.

mentioned that already that spent the best 2 years of my life in Saudia in Khamis , Riaz, Najran and Sharurah when father was part of Pakistan army contingent protecting Saudi airspace from Yemen side.

if your Universities are translating the study and research material in Arabic then that will bear fruit in the longer run because it will enable the aspiring engineers, doctors, scientists and technicians to think and theorize in their mother tongue.
if you have least barriers in language and communication then you are able to translate your creativity much more easily.

its a good foresight by the Saudi leadership towards self reliance hopefully the diplomacy will help Americans to see some sense.
we have missed the Israeli factor here as well and that cant be dismissed.

reminds me of Surah Al Anfal (may Allah protect and bring نصرة to the His believers Amen)

And to encounter them, provide whatever force and trained ever-ready horses you can afford whereby you may strike terror into the enemies of Allah and your enemies as well and others besides them whom you do not know but whom Allah knows. The reward of whatever you expend in the way of Allah shall be repaid to you in full, and you shall not be wronged in any way.

 

[Mosamania]

mentioned that already that spent the best 2 years of my life in Saudia in Khamis , Riaz, Najran and Sharurah when father was part of Pakistan army contingent protecting Saudi airspace from Yemen side.

if your Universities are translating the study and research material in Arabic then that will bear fruit in the longer run because it will enable the aspiring engineers, doctors, scientists and technicians to think and theorize in their mother tongue.
if you have least barriers in language and communication then you are able to translate your creativity much more easily.

its a good foresight by the Saudi leadership towards self reliance hopefully the diplomacy will help Americans to see some sense.
we have missed the Israeli factor here as well and that cant be dismissed.

reminds me of Surah Al Anfal (may Allah protect and bring نصرة to the His believers Amen)

And to encounter them, provide whatever force and trained ever-ready horses you can afford44 whereby you may strike terror into the enemies of Allah and your enemies as well and others besides them whom you do not know but whom Allah knows. The reward of whatever you expend in the way of Allah shall be repaid to you in full, and you shall not be wronged in any way.

I am feeling emotional here

I would hug you come here let me hug you: