Time for peace?

[El Sidd]

@Kaptaan

Goodbye.

I just read somewhere you are leaving. So let me just say goodbye to you.

Wish you all the best in all your personal endeavours.

 

[Śakra]

I just wish that there should be peace between pakistan and india like in western countries but it's not possible considering the sacrifice from both end gave in time of independence and then follow up with several wars. It's too much to ignore and let it go.

Kashmir Issue is another main issue between pakistan and india that neither going to step down. India can not go of kashmir even they want to because it will divide india in to many countries considering khalistan and all that. They will raise their voice for independence.
Pakistan can not go of Kashmir even if Pakistan wants to because there will be people on roads for our kashmiri brother which Army or govt wouldn't be able to handle.

So in nutshell, I don't see any peace between Pakistan and India in my life.

Progress happens as the Old die off. There will come a time when their hatred has become extinct and we will be better off

 

[Mangus Ortus Novem]

@Kaptaan what giveth my Pak Brother?

Obviously we all wish for permanent peace. Both India and Pak have been trying to hurt each other since inception.

The troubles in Kashmir can end in a win-win and lasting solution. For that both states need to have a change in emotional paradigm.

The key for Peace is Acceptance though.

I, as always, consider religion to be the opium for the masses. It offers cheap control tools. What is truly amazing is the reverse dynamics in two states. Pak People are choosing modernity and forwardness. But the other state's political momentum is towards dogma and mythology.

In this backdrop lasting Peace is slipping the region once more. Karma?

Hate is a symptom of helplessness or lack of acceptance/understanding. Besides Compassion is far better implement of intellectual and emotional advancement than hate.

Why go away when now you have chosen a higher intellectual and emotional vantage? Wouldn't it be better to help both sides SEE a better perspective with your new insights?

I say...stay and don't make PDF a boring place!

Please, also consider in your Calculus of Peace the exploded populations of both states. There is no divident in this explotion...only more misery.

In one of our discussion last year I did say that Pak has to pass the law with immediate effect to limit child birth to two per couple. I called it Pak Population Act.

So yeah... Peace must Pervail. However, the foundational conditions for Peace need to be established first and far most.

Religion is just a smoke screen and keep the masses sedated.

There is no Two Nations Theory. Only Two Civilisations Fact.

When this Fact is accepted by both sides... one of the fundamental foundational condition is met. And then upon it Peace can be found. It could turn out to be a lasting solution.

Autumn is here. The Winter is Coming!


As ever,

Mangus

 

[lastofthepatriots]

Baccha you’re a well known hotheaded guy who lashes out at everyone here (except bgnladshers). Your words mean nothing to anyone here

Lmao. I'm a veteran on this forum. Watch who you talkin to boy.

 

[El Sidd]

Peace between India and Pakistan can and will be achieved. Peace between India and bngdsh will NEVER happen tho.

Pakistan and India can solve and look beyond peace much like the founding fathers who envisioned a USA-Canada relationship between the two countries.

Bongladesh is our nightmare and India's morning after.

May hilsa swim peacefully forever.

 

[SorryNotSorry]

Have you ever had a argumant with someone and it just escalated until you loose track of why your even fighting that person? Animosity sort of just takes over and just feeds itself until there is no end. Hate just begets more hate.

Is that the case between India and Pakistan 70 years on? Time for peace? Thoughts ladies and gents.

Yes please, let's have peace.
It's would be beautiful.

But will it actually materialize the way we mutually want it to? By the looks of things- probably not.

 

[Bharat Muslim]

Spot on. Small is better. Better to have small country. All your citizens are well fed, well housed, well educated and live full safe lives. Human life is all about right to be free and pursuit of happiness. Not freakin idealogies, big crap ideals that just give the elite right and excuse to ride the poor masses.

Yeah but extremely vulnerable to foreign invasions.

 

[American Pakistani]

Y'all obsessed with Kashmir. Your only issue with India is Kashmir, give up on it & we can all live in peace. Open border, open trade. I suggest make LOC international border and put an end to this meaningless enmity.

It is actually your kind who is obsessed with Kashmir. It is india's stubbornness and egoistic attitude which is a hurdle between resolving of matters. Ball is in India's court, held refrendum and let the people decide, once Kashmir is solved, Indo-Pak border might become like US-Canada border.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

what giveth my Pak Brother?

This is thread where "peace" can be explored. Where convergence might be found. It does not mean I think it is possible.

consider religion to be the opium for the masses.

It is. Not everything Karl Marx said was true but not everything he said was a wrong either.

Religion is just a smoke screen and keep the masses sedated.

It is indeed and Pakistan is classic example of misuse of religion. The ruling elite profiteer from religion. The elite live a very secular, elevated and segregated life in their gated communties. Their children study abroad in the West. They dance and flirt abroad. This elite does absolutely nothing for the masses. The masses have no accesss to justice, health or proper housing. They live a wretched life where death is all too often a release from suffering.

What does the elite provide. A empty promise of Islamic bliss. A corrupt state that screws the poor at every turn is made more digestible by being called "Islamic". By latching on to some tangible aspects of Islam it gives them excuse to rape the poor. The sad part is Islam is being maliged. What exactly is "Islamic" about the Pakistani state? Nothing. It is as fabrication as labelling a club where vice, corruption are rampant as abode of Islam.

However as you say this pattern cannot sustain itself for long. Increasing Chinese influence will introduce socialist and athiest ideas into society. I mean even a fool can see what citadel of Islam like Karachi looks and citadel of athiesim like Beijing looks.

There is no Two Nations Theory. Only Two Civilisations Fact.

There never was a 2NT. It was political genius of Jinnah that gave us a state. It was just means to a end. It was perfect employment of Machiavellian tactics. Jinnah the master politician must have pulled on his cigar and let out a haughty laugh. If only I could get a chance to laugh with him and congratule him in his brilliance.

The only real exposition of 2NT I can think of is Israel. It allow citizenship on the basis of being a Jew. This reflects on the wordview of that state of there being -

1. Jew
2. Other.

This leading to application of Two Nation Theory as Israel offers citizenship to Jews because it regards them as a "nation" and refuses others as it regards them as not being part of the nation. Does Pakistan do that? Does Pakistan offer a opportunity for any Muslim to land at Islamabad Airport and then prove they are Muslim? Once they have proven that they are Muslim a citizenship is granted.

Hoewever to be sure there never was One Nation Theory either. It was as fabricated as 2NT. While Muslim League can take credit for 2NT the 1NT has to be credited to British soldiers and officials. It was they who made British India into one unit by subjugating the native on the battlefield into one colony. And 1NT got a kicking in 1947 but in 1971 with Bangla not coalescing into India was the death of any illusions of 1NT.

I say...stay

I think I am pretty close to having said everything. It get's to a point where you become a "repeat machine". With over 6000 posts I think I am now paddling the same soundbytes. What is refreshing eventually becomes staid. I am near approaching "sell by date". Maybe one more post to "showcase" my ideas.

Autumn is here. The Winter is Coming!

It. And is not glorious. My room has huge windows on one side and French Conservatory doors on the other side. The autumn sun shears through my room. On both sides the fabulous English countryside is visible with trees in abandon now slowly turning golden. I love the cold and always have some windows open with heating switched off. The cold breeze and rustling sound of the leaves is a delight. My other always complains about my "fridge" of a room but I always say " cold room but for warm hearted person" hahahaha.

My room is signature of me. Light, airy, open, fresh, looking out at/open to the world, nestled in nature, simple, large led tv that goes as my workstation, entertainment. Old office network Hewlet Packard Laserjet printer. That despite it's age pumps out 1000s of copies at nominal price. Bit like me dated but still capable soldiering on. And of course piles of files chucked mostly pushed into the corner as not to scare visitors at my chaotic "cockpit".

And a whole collection of the most bright orange reading specs. I keep breaking those darned things and can never find them when I need them most. Then when you red without them it places strain on your eyes and you end with a darned migraine. So the other day I went to these Poundland store - full of Chinese goodies being flogged for £1. And I bought 10 of these neon orange reading specs. The sales lady began laughing at my "purchase". Now I have strewn these orange Chinese specs everywhere. In my pockets, in my car, in my room. Thus far I have broken or lost 3. So by next week I will be back in Poundland and the laughing sales lady.

 

[wiseone2]

Keep your BS to yourself. KPK is not going anywhere...
Most of your posts are mindless ramblings without any semblance of truth in them.

If KPK is not going anywhere why is Pakistani army backing the Taliban ?

 

[third eye]

For me the animosity between Pakistan has become aimlesss. It has no basis. It has no goal. It has become a ritual. I mean what is the fundamental issue between India and Pakistan? I don't think there is any. It has just become a ritual. You do it because you do it.

A pleasant surprise to read your post ,my complements on such thoughts. We need more of these.

Of course we need peace after all there is no substitute to it. More than a ritual animosity has become an industry on both sides.

Way too many mouths & pockets are fed on our animosity. It will take a lot more than sagacity & courage to break this nexus.

It will happen some day.

 

[mike2000 is back]

Spot on. Small is better. Better to have small country. All your citizens are well fed, well housed, well educated and live full safe lives. Human life is all about right to be free and pursuit of happiness. Not freakin idealogies, big crap ideals that just give the elite right and excuse to ride the poor masses.

Agree. You do make very good points . I would actually say you are the best Pakistani poster on here(well that's my point of view) and one of the least biased

Why are you leaving PDF bro? We need more members like you on here.

 

[El Sidd]

Agree. You do make very good points . I would actually say you are the best Pakistani poster on here(well that's my point of view) and one of the least biased

Why are you leaving PDF bro? We need more members like you on here.

Your avatar name suggests he will be back???

 

[Indus Pakistan]

Agree. You do make very good points . I would actually say you are the best Pakistani poster on here(well that's my point of view) and one of the least biased

Why are you leaving PDF bro? We need more members like you on here.

Thanks. To begin with I lose lot of "work time". I work from home and it is so easy to click "PDF" and then end up getting involved in some discussion. As lot of my work is online this is not good to have a distraction that is only one click away. Secondly I think I have said what I wanted to say. It has become repetitve now. I have to find some way to do a "harakiri". I am going to change the password and intentionally lose it. That should provide a hurdle that prevents me being side tracked here. Again.

 

[Chhatrapati]

Neither India nor Pakistan is going to give out an inch of land. Let the status quo remain and make LOC as the Border, both our countries can co-exist in a peaceful manner. Not surrounded by any American, Chinese or Russian arms and ammunition.

Both countries can prosper together with entire South Asia, we can throw the western influence over us.

South Asia could become next ASEAN block.