This time, even China couldn't save Pakistan. Not when it came to Saeed

[SQ8]

The context is we are fighting our causes.

Causes are either a product of society or economics or either/or.

A close mentor of mine who is from India asked me why are only Muslims going crazy.. I said Hindu extremists exist as well as the Godhra riots showed- to which he replied that was poverty and political exploitation.. but many educated religious Muslims also go crazy.. to which I replied “Ashok uncle mein bhi tu Khara hun aap ke saamne”(I am here too in front of you- I am fairly religious and practicing ).. and he said “Kyunke tumhare maan baap ne tarbiat achi ki hai tumhara Khandan acha hai”(your parents raised you well and you come from a good family)

To which I pointed that he had his answer.

 

[Dash]

Causes are either a product of society or economics or either/or.

A close mentor of mine who is from India asked me why are only Muslims going crazy.. I said Hindu extremists exist as well as the Godhra riots showed- to which he replied that was poverty and political exploitation.. but many educated religious Muslims also go crazy.. to which I replied “Ashok uncle mein bhi tu Khara hun aap ke saamne”(I am here too in front of you- I am fairly religious and practicing ).. and he said “Kyunke tumhare maan baap ne tarbiat achi ki hai tumhara Khandan acha hai”(your parents raised you well and you come from a good family)

To which I pointed that he had his answer.

You can draw the same example for blacks you know and I feel it is relevant.

A person having a good background passes on good things and a person deprived of that passes misery hatred and so on.

We can talk about it and if I’m wrong in interpreting it then pls let me know.

Godhra is something that got the attention of the world, no one talks about Sikhs of 84 or even Pandits post 75.

Everyone has their share of agony.

You know when I try to explain people about positives I have to find an alternative narrative but looking at what they read and how they perceive the whole situation? I can only run away from the class.

Cuz the community itself has axed it toe .

 

[SQ8]

You can draw the same example for blacks you know and I feel it is relevant.

A person having a good background passes on good things and a person deprived of that passes misery hatred and so on.

We can talk about it and if I’m wrong in interpreting it then pls let me know.

Godhra is something that got the attention of the world, no one talks about Sikhs of 84 or even Pandits post 75.

Everyone has their share of agony.

You know when I try to explain people about positives I have to find an alternative narrative but looking at what they read and how they perceive the whole situation? I can only run away from the class.

Cuz the community itself has axed it toe .

Godhra was a relevant example because it was recent, but the issue is still socio economics.

Hafiz Saeed attracts who he attracts due to socio economics. Try putting him in an affluent Swiss town and even with a free hand he wont be able to get a single recruit.

That does mean brainwashing techniques or simply nutjobs or other motivations do not exist. I too am motivated by the human disaster that is in Kashmir from a Muslim,Pakistani and human perspective. I am also motivated for Kashmir because it represents a vital high strategic ground and key control routes for water sources that feed my countrymen- but, I would espouse a different approach to dealing with it even if it involved proxies or militancy. It would still be measured and focused on what ideals are used and so on.

But the murkier you go the more you leave room for mud on your own hands.

 

[MultaniGuy]

Its an Indian source. I have yet to see an Pakistani source claim that Hafiz Saeed has been declared an international terrorist.

Not even Al Jazeera or BBC has made such a comment unless someone can correct me.

 

[Dash]

Godhra was a relevant example because it was recent, but the issue is still socio economics.

Hafiz Saeed attracts who he attracts due to socio economics. Try putting him in an affluent Swiss town and even with a free hand he wont be able to get a single recruit.

I won’t agree cuz literature plays an important role in our life AND we hardly have time to actually be persuasive of someone to the stature of Hafiz Saeed as long as some poet writes a patriotic song. We actually have seen examples that some of the most literate countries producing jihadi John.

So that remains irrelevant.

On the contrary radicals are not interested in who is of what background but what can he offer. I see it as a political problem and it’s my firm belief that it can be solved politically.

We must engage politically with them but the time is not ripe(which is another Pandora’s box)

I am also motivated for Kashmir because it represents a vital high strategic ground and key control routes for water sources that feed my countrymen- but, I would espouse a different approach to dealing with it even if it involved proxies or militancy.

I completely agree here that it’s all about controlling resources.

But it makes it so easier if we just accept the fact and explain the population about it. I believe neither India nor Pakistan can take the first step alone. It has to be a joint effort but

Looking at the history not once the topic of relevance has been brought out once and we are fighting a silly war in the name of religion.

 

[Vapnope]

Whoever thought that having a poster boy is a good thing was an idiot. The likes of Saeed have done more damage to Pakistan than India.
We lack the sophisticated art of diplomacy and soft power projection and there seems to be nothing in place to work on those areas.

 

[I.R.A]

Its an ordinance and not an Act ............. I would wait and not jump to conclusions.

 

[Maarkhoor]

He is being targeted just because he show interest in Politics and Govt is afraid because he have massive support in masses because of his charity works.

 

[Baby Leone]

hey indian, Pakistanis dont need any one's help to resolve our issues unlike indians we dont go to US to cry on their shoulders to give pressures to neighboring countries. Furthermore, when ever Pakistan feels any organization or individual a threat for Pakistan or its people we will take actions.

Indians should also learn from it.

 

[CriticalThought]

That is the point I was looking at. Essentially these pseudo religious feifdoms were becoming a headache and legacy of people like Gul&Durrani which we were stuck with.

The need for them was linked with the training and recruitment for Kashmir. That struggle has gone self sustaining thanks to the Indian government and people’s own belligerent attitude and stupidity and only needs basic financial assistance and the random AK thrown across. We no longer need to convince Kashmiris of the need for Jihad since the movement is now autonomous to a large degree.

The western front we’ve mostly washed our hands off from the snakes on that end and the Haqqanis and Taliban are self sustaining.. so why tolerate such menace to society types anyway who are more destructive than constructive?

Oh of course. People like Asma Jehangir MUST be tolerated, yet bearded molvi types are a burden to be thrown off our backs. For all the so called enlightenment, we are essentially slaves still.

Godhra was a relevant example because it was recent, but the issue is still socio economics.

Hafiz Saeed attracts who he attracts due to socio economics. Try putting him in an affluent Swiss town and even with a free hand he wont be able to get a single recruit.

That does mean brainwashing techniques or simply nutjobs or other motivations do not exist. I too am motivated by the human disaster that is in Kashmir from a Muslim,Pakistani and human perspective. I am also motivated for Kashmir because it represents a vital high strategic ground and key control routes for water sources that feed my countrymen- but, I would espouse a different approach to dealing with it even if it involved proxies or militancy. It would still be measured and focused on what ideals are used and so on.

But the murkier you go the more you leave room for mud on your own hands.

I can tell u many affluent Pakistanis will support him. And that's because his link to terrorism is merely an Indian allegation. They could make an allegation against you. Do you want your fellow Pakistanis to support you in this case?

 

[BABA AGHORI]

lollllz he better go pakistan dont care

it is not regarding the individual Imran Bhai, he is just a tool for International diplomacy to put more pressure, Pakistan has to defend all the statements and the stands that it took for this Individual. And the all-weather friend will have to think twice before putting all its weight on things like this in future.

hey indian, Pakistanis dont need any one's help to resolve our issues unlike indians we dont go to US to cry on their shoulders to give pressures to neighboring countries. Furthermore, when ever Pakistan feels any organization or individual a threat for Pakistan or its people we will take actions.

Indians should also learn from it.

Yes, I would have believed you if July 4, 1999 never happened.
https://tune.pk/video/1209981/july-4-1999-bill-clinton-nawaz-sharif-and-kargil-war

 

[Shani Ali]

Pakistan is a mature country, our institutes and people are stronger they take a good decision and in 2017 we can see the international and national issues of Pakistan get resolved and Pakistan Growing up. well here is only one Project which incorporates Pakistan and China together is CPEC.

 

[lastofthepatriots]

Look at the liberal cucks trying to sell out one of their own compatriots just because he is a philanthropist with huge support from the common man.

@Oscar

For you Hafez Saeed is expendable, but 'Ashok Uncle' is a mentor?

Wtf kind of peanut butter jelly shit is this? The reason the world doesn't respect Pakistanis is because a certain 'educated' segment of society will always sell out one of their own for a bone and pat on the head.

 

[MBT 3000]

nothing will happen, same UN that cant solve conflicts

 

[SQ8]

Look at the liberal cucks trying to sell out one of their own compatriots just because he is a philanthropist with huge support from the common man.

@Oscar

For you Hafez Saeed is expendable, but 'Ashok Uncle' is a mentor?

Wtf kind of peanut butter jelly shit is this? The reason the world doesn't respect Pakistanis is because a certain 'educated' segment of society will always sell out one of their own for a bone and pat on the head.

The sort of shit that involves brains and not just chest out insecure bravado.

Hafiz Saeed may be contributing to society in some way but the damages far outweigh the benefits.

The same way I am happy Asma Jahangir is dead, I would be happy if Saeed disappeared. Its not personal, its business that is good for the state in the long run.

Yes Ashok Uncle is a mentor, humans accept humans as mentors rather than just hate everyone who doesn’t look like them.. skin color, religion or otherwise.

Oh of course. People like Asma Jehangir MUST be tolerated, yet bearded molvi types are a burden to be thrown off our backs. For all the so called enlightenment, we are essentially slaves still.



I can tell u many affluent Pakistanis will support him. And that's because his link to terrorism is merely an Indian allegation. They could make an allegation against you. Do you want your fellow Pakistanis to support you in this case?

How did you assume that somehow contempt for Hafiz Saeed is love for Jahangir?
Again, reactionary.. and tainted viewpoints are what got us into this mess in the first place.

Pragmatism matters, not emotions.
I don’t care about fellow Pakistanis supporting me since I don’t put individual value to them- the state matters, 50 odd hotheads don’t.

If the the goals of strenthung the state and national integration 30 years from now require a genocide of 50 million.. sau bismillah.