There have been at least 19 deadly mass shootings in the US so far in 2019

[VCheng]

I asked you first- why do you worship the US?

That is not the topic of this thread but you can make another thread for it in Member's Club if you are allowed to do so by PDF Rules.

Now, again, what issue in US society do you think your OP intends to highlight?

 

[Omar Al-Deek]

That is not the topic of this thread but you can make another thread for it in Member's Club if you are allowed to do so by PDF Rules.

Now, again, what issue in US society do you think your OP intends to highlight?

Why do you worship the US? I asked you first.

 

[VCheng]

The Quran is, for Muslims, the literal and direct word of God. Therefore the only being that has the authority to change the wording is God himself. Even if there were certain parts of the text which certain people found no longer appropriate or relevant, no one has the authority to change it without putting themselves outside the fold of Islam. It is in effect an all or nothing situation.

In this all or nothing situation that you describe, where do the religious beliefs of other humans on the plant stand, in your view? The reason I ask is because that would be analogous to USA have its laws for its own use, just as every other country is entitled to do the same, in the context of the purported topic of this thread.

 

[iLION12345_1]

It is He who has sent His Messenger with guidance and the religion of truth to manifest it over all religion, although they who associate others with Allah dislike it.

-Surah At-Tawbah

I don't know what you mean by Islam having a place in governance not politics but "separation of church and state" is a concept completely alien to Islam, which comes from Thomas Jefferson not Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) and which no Muslim should care about. Islam's authority comes from God.

Islam does not have a place in politics. It is a religion and politics is a business. Governance and politics are 2 very different things. When you put a religion in politics you are using it as a tool of power. Like everyone does these days. The prophet PBUH and many of his followers were Khalifas and “kings”. Of course they followed the teachings of Islam in their governance. Which are pretty identical for all abrahamic religions. But to mix Islam with the idea of modern politics, which didn’t exist back then, is wrong and has created the false Islam we see today. Especially in the sub continent with all these “mullahs”.
A persons “Islam” is between him and god. A rulers Islam is also between him and god. Both a worker and a ruler do their jobs in accordance with the teachings of Islam.
Imo a good example of this has been Turkey, ever wonder why they’ve done so much better than many other Muslim countries while still having a majority Muslim population.

 

[Omar Al-Deek]

Islam does not have a place in politics. It is a religion and politics is a business. Governance and politics are 2 very different things. When you put a religion in politics you are using it as a tool of power. Like everyone does these days. The prophet PBUH and many of his followers were Khalifas and “kings”. Of course they followed the teachings of Islam in their governance. Which are pretty identical for all abrahamic religions. But to mix Islam with the idea of modern politics, which didn’t exist back then, is wrong and has created the false Islam we see today. Especially in the sub continent with all these “mullahs”.
A persons “Islam” is between him and god. A rulers Islam is also between him and god. Both a worker and a ruler do their jobs in accordance with the teachings of Islam.
Imo a good example of this has been Turkey, ever wonder why they’ve done so much better than many other Muslim countries while still having a majority Muslim population.

I think governance and politics are basically the same thing.

gov·ern·ance
/ˈɡəvərnəns/

noun

1. the action or manner of governing.

politics
noun, plural in form but singular or plural in construction
pol·i·tics | \ ˈpä-lə-ˌtiks \
Definition of politics

1a: the art or science of government
b: the art or science concerned with guiding or influencing governmental policy
c: the art or science concerned with winning and holding control over a government

The only definition of "politics" that I think is really different from "governance" is the third definition.

I'm happy to discuss but I don't understand what you mean by these terms. From a dictionary standpoint, these terms basically mean the same thing.

What you do mean by governance versus politics?

As far as Islam and the state- the state should enforce Sharia. These ideas that Islam is a purely personal thing- such ideas come from European "Enlightenment" philosophy, not Islam.

If you think Islam supports secularism (which actually comes from European "Enlightenment" philosophy), I think it we should turn to Quran and Sunnah and go with what Quran and Sunnah say. If Quran and Sunnah say society should be governed by Islamic law, we should go with that. If we find European "Enlightenment"-era secularist philosophy in the Quran and Sunnah then I'm willing to follow it but.... I don't think we're going to find such in the Quran and Sunnah. I think the sources for that would be sources such as John Locke and Thomas Jefferson, not Quran and Sunnah.

 

[YeBeWarned]

If you are talented there is no place in the world that can match America for Professional careers. Imagine all the companies and startups that took root in America that changed the world . No place is perfect . Despite its problems it continues to be the most sought after country where immigrants would like to settle.

yeah but how does that related with the Topic ?

How about I propose -- ban the Bible, the Quran, the Torah, and just about every 'holy' text in the US?

The allowance to have the gun is enshrined in the US Constitution, which is as 'holy' to Americans as the Bible is to Christians, the Quran to the Muslims, and the Torah to the Jews.

So if a Muslim objects to banning the Quran, then do not criticize US about the Second Amendment.

Interesting point , which is very valid .. both things can easily be fall into wrong hands who can misuse it for any violence . But What would say about the people who think having more Guns in Public place would be better ? like Arming Teachers ?

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

Still better than in Wild West times.

Even way before that...
Wild animals, wild natives, and wild people.

Gun ownership in the Americas was long before any present country was formed. Now try and take them away...

 

[Cthulhu]

 

[khansaheeb]

From what I understand that America don't have Mass shooting problem, America has a lot of different kinds of Problem For example .. America have Guns Problem , America has Mental health Issue Problem , America has Religious extremism Problem , America has Racial extremism Problem , America has Race Problem , America has a War problem , America has fear problem etc

Alot of people might be thinking if America has so many problems how it is still one of the best country in the world ? how they still keep things quite peaceful ? Well all those problems i mentioned are interconnected to one another in one way or another , For example Guns Problem combine with Mental health cause shootings , Religious extremism with Guns cause Terrorism , Race Problem with fear cause Black people getting shot and killed ..

So America has two images and people who lived in America or are currently living can confirm or deny it that there is one side of America which we see and which is portrayed things like American Dream , Land of Opportunity etc, but than there is another dark side where Racism dwells in the form of KKK and Neo NAZI , Where religious intolerance are rising , Where Police brutality are increasing , where more Guns in the hands of mentally sick people cause mass shootings .. So in the end one side is battling with another and they both will exists with each other for times to come .

Bring in poor and desperate people from all around the world , ones who make it want to keep their wealth and will all they can do to stay rich, ones who are poor will be stuck in a desperate hand to mouth cycle.

 

[YeBeWarned]

Bring in poor and desperate people from all around the world , ones who make it want to keep their wealth and will all they can do to stay rich, ones who are poor will be stuck in a desperate hand to mouth cycle.

This is one of the many Good things about America and I acknowledge it , I know some people think that I only mentioned bad things about America but I often talk about Admiration of America as well , Obviously there is a reason they are the only Super Power, of course they are doing something right in their country for decades which earn them their title, Russian have Nukes and Strong Military but they are not What America is to many People including Millions of immigrants who live and find a better life there .

The Topic of OP is mass shootings which is pretty much on the rise for various reasons in America , I wonder if that Trend will follow for next few years or there will be strong and powerful policy changes which can prevent such Mass shootings .

There is no proof for God, so this line of argument is moot.

True , there is no Scientific Proof for God .

Even way before that...
Wild animals, wild natives, and wild people.

Gun ownership in the Americas was long before any present country was formed. Now try and take them away...

It is not going to happen any time soon, America love guns they hold them dear , I saw people training kids young as 7-8 Guns .22 (I don't know what that means in terms of Bullet) . What I understand that American have this constant fear of something which makes them feel that they have keep Arms at hand, A lot of people think Govt want to take back their guns and its part of some sinister plan , but I think the root is still in the Constitution of America which gives them right to have Guns, and when someone says I am following my Constitutional Right there is not much to argue there .

 

[WarKa DaNG]

In KPK, there are too many guns legal and illegal as compared to the rest of Pakistan. In our village even the poor have some pistols like Tokarev but still didnt see and mass shooting like in the america

 

[Dubious]

Thread discussion religion more than topic

If there is so much freedom, why don't we see this proud news (I assume it is Americsn pride since no one wants to fix it...) being aired internationally?