The U.S. Senate moved to pass new restrictions on aid to Pakistan

[WarProfessor]

"And won't bother to work against the Russians when they threatened to nuke China."

Yup.

The good ol' PRC just ain't what it used to be though. With each passing day you've more to lose as we insidiously co-opt you into a mercantilist global economic trading system. You're getting softer with each new car you buy and/or sell.

Less barefoot doctors everyday.

I've tried to tell everybody when they go off on imperialist America that we've ONE global objective and that's the perpetuation and expansion of the global trading system...

...free and open markets for everybody means that balance of power discussions are replaced by balance of trade discussions. As example, CAR- yeah, we want their energy but not necessarily for ourselves. We get what we need from our enemy Venezuela, Canada, and Mexico. That which we don't provide for ourselves anyway.

We'd like those republics, though, to have market choices so that their energy isn't forcibly sold only to one customer. Wouldn't work for them at all if Russia, India, or you became their sole customer with a monopoly on their goods and services.

Therein Afghanistan begins to take on an importance beyond sheer revenge and, equally, requires stabilization to see that through. Having the ability to ship their LNG and oil south to Pakistani or Iranian ports for shipment throughout the world helps CAR...

...and Afghanistan too.

Our navy has one over-riding primary objective-keep sealanes open...

...for everybody.

When Iran threatens to shut down the straits of Hormuz it hurts us terribly-not because we're dependant upon that energy but because our primary trade partners like you, Japan, S. Korea and others are.

THAT hurts us when/if it hurts you.

We're happy to cut your throats...in straightforward economic competition-so long as it's transparent and aboveboard. When it is so it's been proven that today's losers are often tomorrow's winners by virtue of rolling up their sleeves and getting more competitive.

All of that is a good thing.

American foreign policy in a nutshell.

Thanks.

You are welcome to take this to them Arabs and Jew them into a Dubai. But, I'll pass.

 

[S-2]

"You are welcome to take this to them Arabs and Jew them into a Dubai. But, I'll pass."

Your business but my comments weren't really meant for you. The PRC has already been co-opted into the global trading system courtesy of Deng Xioping twenty-five years or so ago.

Y'all are well into the fold and there's no reversing this revolution.

Thanks.

 

[WarProfessor]

"You are welcome to take this to them Arabs and Jew them into a Dubai. But, I'll pass."

Your business but my comments weren't really meant for you. The PRC has already been co-opted into the global trading system courtesy of Deng Xioping twenty-five years or so ago.

Y'all are well into the fold and there's no reversing this revolution.

Thanks.

Now you are talking.

IMHO, you need to make that leap in faith even if over-powered, you still wouldn't attempt that big red button. The best defense for any country in the world is they are not afraid.
And if you are willing to play fair and square China can help you, that is, if China can, and you need.

 

[logic]

To hell with US.

Dual national ambassadors and GOP representatives should be banned from holding public offices like it is done in India.

Zardari Sharif Altaf and others like Mr Musharraf will leave us with all the blow back from the US and NATO atrocities in Afghanistan a nation that US has occupied for a decade now and live a life of luxury begging for dollars while our civilians and security personnel are paying the price in blood.

We need leaders that have a stake in Pakistan and not anywhere else.
Just look at Pak Ambassador to UN he looks and talks like a Churchal Era drunkard.

People of Pakistan Wake up before its too late.

Pakistan KA ALLAH HAFIZ.

 

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

I think we should take the aid . Spend the money to upgrade logistics and communication . Build some infrastructure Like cantonments and roads . Why to spend money on upgrading nukes when we already have the capability to deliver them when needed .
AID should be taken . then again contracts should be given to US companies . So that they could pay their gov some handsome amount of TAX .

 

[logic]

I think we should take the aid . Spend the money to upgrade logistics and communication . Build some infrastructure Like cantonments and roads . Why to spend money on upgrading nukes when we already have the capability to deliver them when needed .
AID should be taken . then again contracts should be given to US companies . So that they could pay their gov some handsome amount of TAX .

Dear that might reflect the Beggar Philosophy that our elite preaches with so much diligence.

We have to stand on our own two feet that is the only solution.
Beggars do not have Honor they just have needs.

 

[Nomad]

Kerry Lugar Bill should be rejected no doubt - and just take a loan from China for 6 billion , they have 2500 billion dollar in reserves , what is a 6 billion to them , they buy american dollars every year to save US dollar.

The Kerry Lugar Bill is "Aid" not a "loan".

To get a loan you have to be credit worthy, there are terms to the loan, interest rates and it had to be paid back. A few months back you borrowed approx $11 billion from the IMF, one of their requirements was to spend less on the army. A lot of people howled on this forum on how the IMF was dictating terms to the GOP, and not to take the loan. Without the loan GOP would be broke and in default right now.

When we give "aid', which does not have to be repaid, we have the right to demand the terms on which the aid will be given. Who else will give you this kind of "aid". Big brother Saudi, maybe PRC, I don't think so.

Now if you want to reject our aid and go for a soft loan to PRC do you think you will get it ? If they even give it to you, do you think it will come with no terms. How many trips has Zardari and Gilani made to the PRC with bowl in hand, how much money have they received so far?

India has about $230 billion in reserves maybe you could hit them up for a $6 billion soft loan?

I mean Kerry Lugar bill is not good our nation's freedom -

What part of the Kerry Lugar bill is not good for your nation's freedom? I have asked this question before and no one in this forum can give me cognizant answer. Everyone spouts about how bad it is. Requiring good governance from your country in return for free money is bad for your freedom?

Its a like Indirect NPT signature , while India gets free nuclear technology , mean while we can't expand our nuclear capabilities
unless we give info to US.

India is getting nothing for free, it will be paying for everything it gets with its own money.

You can't expand your nuclear technology with our money. Generate your own money and spend it as you see fit.

Nuclear technology and our scientist worth 6 billion I don't think so ....

 

[Adios Amigo]

The Kerry Lugar Bill is "Aid" not a "loan".

To get a loan you have to be credit worthy, there are terms to the loan, interest rates and it had to be paid back. A few months back you borrowed approx $11 billion from the IMF, one of their requirements was to spend less on the army. A lot of people howled on this forum on how the IMF was dictating terms to the GOP, and not to take the loan. Without the loan GOP would be broke and in default right now.

thanks for showing so much concern for us,we wont default thats a misconception,we have an undocumented economy,so you never get the real figures

When we give "aid', which does not have to be repaid, we have the right to demand the terms on which the aid will be given. Who else will give you this kind of "aid". Big brother Saudi, maybe PRC, I don't think so.

thanks again, but no thanks as i said, this time we dont need your aid specially on such humiliating terms, that was ur part, now dont scrach your heads,and spill crap about saudis or chinese thats not your concern, we even dont need their aid. its the will of the people which will get out of miseries not your insulting aids, and if we cannot produce such a will then we will never get out of it,but i am sure we have the will now.

Now if you want to reject our aid and go for a soft loan to PRC do you think you will get it ? If they even give it to you, do you think it will come with no terms. How many trips has Zardari and Gilani made to the PRC with bowl in hand, how much money have they received so far?

thanks again for the bowl part, the corrupt government still loves and wants to keep it, the nation is not allowing it this time and thats the real concern for you. BTW its none of your concern.

India has about $230 billion in reserves maybe you could hit them up for a $6 billion soft loan?

good idea but why dont you people ask for few billions for bailouts,,, hummmmmmmm but wait a min you have better options, why not get it free from iraqi oil oil is it oil is it or blood doesnt matter its all the same to you

India is getting nothing for free, it will be paying for everything it gets with its own money.:

thats not our concern, good for them,and thanks again for the valuable info

 

[WarProfessor]

The Kerry Lugar Bill is "Aid" not a "loan".

To get a loan you have to be credit worthy, there are terms to the loan, interest rates and it had to be paid back. A few months back you borrowed approx $11 billion from the IMF, one of their requirements was to spend less on the army. A lot of people howled on this forum on how the IMF was dictating terms to the GOP, and not to take the loan. Without the loan GOP would be broke and in default right now.

When we give "aid', which does not have to be repaid, we have the right to demand the terms on which the aid will be given. Who else will give you this kind of "aid". Big brother Saudi, maybe PRC, I don't think so.

Now if you want to reject our aid and go for a soft loan to PRC do you think you will get it ? If they even give it to you, do you think it will come with no terms. How many trips has Zardari and Gilani made to the PRC with bowl in hand, how much money have they received so far?

India has about $230 billion in reserves maybe you could hit them up for a $6 billion soft loan?






What part of the Kerry Lugar bill is not good for your nation's freedom? I have asked this question before and no one in this forum can give me cognizant answer. Everyone spouts about how bad it is. Requiring good governance from your country in return for free money is bad for your freedom?




India is getting nothing for free, it will be paying for everything it gets with its own money.

You can't expand your nuclear technology with our money. Generate your own money and spend it as you see fit.

Let me just ask you this one simple question: Would you take your aid back? Concentrate, and it's a simple yes/no question.

 

[Nomad]

Let me just ask you this one simple question: Would you take your aid back? Concentrate, and it's a simple yes/no question.

The aid was offered because both Zardari and Gilani asked (to put it mildly) for it. Now that the aid is offered, it is for the GOP to accept or reject it. If it is rejected there will be no aid (what are the chances of that happening). So there is nothing to concentrate on the ball is in GOP's court.

 

[HAIDER]

According to Richard H B , no restriction has been imposed except some additional reporting procedure to US defence officials.

 

[Nomad]

thanks for showing so much concern for us,we wont default thats a misconception,we have an undocumented economy,so you never get the real figures

I was replying to AZADPAKISTAN2009 comments, if you want to hijack my reply at least post something more than "by the way its none of your concern". It does not raise the level of intelligence in a discussion.
You do not even have a clue of your "undocumented economy", but if you think that is going to bail your country out...good luck.By the way if you want to by oil you need dollars, how much of that does your "undocumented economy" generate. Even for arms purchases and countless other things you need hard currencies which the undocumented economy does not generate

thanks again, but no thanks as i said, this time we dont need your aid specially on such humiliating terms, that was ur part, now dont scrach your heads,and spill crap about saudis or chinese thats not your concern, we even dont need their aid. its the will of the people which will get out of miseries not your insulting aids, and if we cannot produce such a will then we will never get out of it,but i am sure we have the will now.

i hope your leaders see it that way.

thanks again for the bowl part, the corrupt government still loves and wants to keep it, the nation is not allowing it this time and thats the real concern for you. BTW its none of your concern.

Who is going to say no, the GOP or the army.

good idea but why dont you people ask for few billions for bailouts,,, hummmmmmmm but wait a min you have better options, why not get it free from iraqi oil oil is it oil is it or blood doesnt matter its all the same to you

Can you show me one documented instance where we have received or taken one barrel of oil for free from Iraq.

thats not our concern, good for them,and thanks again for the valuable info

I was replying to a forum member who said we gave free nuclear technology to India. If its not your concern why bother answering?

 

[S-2]

Lovely work, sir.

The oil part is always fun. Like the taliban never having been involved with opium during their rule of Afghanistan, stolen oil from Iraq remains a heavily guarded sacred cow myth of virtually all these gentlemen and ladies.

Again, you've my admiration for your cogent responses...

 

[H2O3C4Nitrogen]

I think the milletery aid is given for the ongoing ops to root out Talibans from our country .
We could have setteled the issue through peace deals but it was US who sabotaged those deals in the past . And now when our Army finally pushes the offesive against the millitants the US gov attaches some lame conditions to it .

Frankly i take these attaching conditions with a pinch of salt . People in US know how this aid would be spent . Attaching conditions to it wont solve the problem . Maybe these conditions are to appease India on the other hand letting Pakistan to freely upgrade its conventional wepon system .
I dought that this package would be regected . Even if it is regected i hardly dought that American Gov would not shoot up another AID package .The equations would not balance .

In the end it all ends up that how Imp Pakistan can be to US interests(Long Term) in the reagion. Dare to not give us aid . People are waiting for you guys to pull your hands out of here . Just see how the winds blow against you once you do such a thing . People in washington cannot in any way afford to loose the minimum reagional support you enjoy to carry on with the so called WOT . Once you lost Pakistan be prepared to see your rivals in the middle-east .

 

[r3alist]

when was the last time the us did something good through war in recent post ww2 history...anyone?