The question of independent Pashtunistan —Musa Khan Jalalzai

[Ahmad]

Some Afghan leaders are of the opinion that the Durand Agreement had a life of 100 years, and, as such, lost its legal standing in 1993

Back home when I used to debate with people on the non issue of pasthunistan, they usually refered to the 100 years agreement, they couldnt provide a single proof when i asked them where they got their information from. I believe that they might have been inspired by the idea of Hong Kong which the treaty had 100 years life?

 

[Ahmad]

How about abolishing the D-line -- it leaves us with a full blown merger of both states -- sounds like a solution huh

ohhh both of us already got enough on our plates, dont make even worse and harder. Thanks but no thanks.

 

[Watani]

Tajiks have also been divided on the border between Afghanistan and Tajikistan, the same Amir gave away piece of our land to the then Russians-a water and mineral rich area. Why are they not talking about it and always point out to the non issue of pasthunistan? Hypocracy? ethnic interests?

Uhm, as far as I know, Abdur Rahman was only involved in the Durrand Line matter because present day Tajikistan was known as Turkistan back then. Right? So I doubt Abdur Rahman ever had control under present day Tajikistan, forget about 'selling' it. One thing is that if Abdur Rahman couldn't prove he had only signed a 100 year contract, samewise the British haven't got any papers with the Emir's signature/fingerprint.

Nonetheless he was a coward and incompetent dog who deserved a merciless death.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Verbal diarrhea. Nothing useful in the article to 'disprove' Afghanistan's claim.

Well, actually he does point out that the Durand agreement was neither coerced nor did it have an expiration date.

So it is in fact the Afghans who support the position that the Durand Agreement is invalid that have to substantiate their claim.

Just the fact that the Durand Agreement exists and is acknowledged by Afghans means that it is they who have to show that it is an invalid agreement.

 

[Watani]

^ And yet, strangely enough (or not) Pak government has tried to make the Afghan government recognize 'the border'. And am I the only one failing to understand why one would try to make someone recognize a fact which is referred as invalid by himself anyway?

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

LOL its funny to see how some of our Indian friends here are trying to butt in their noses when they do not have the slightest splinter of an idea of anything regards to the matter being discussed. Insecurities coupled with idiocy lets them think they are having fun while only wasting our time.

Look, while I may agree with you that Indians may not have a good idea about this issue, it serves no purpose to make comments such as the one above. If the argument made by any poster is one you disagree with, then the proper thing to do (in the interest of advancing constructive discussion on this forum) is to logically and factually refute the argument, and not simply insult the other poster and claim that he is 'uninformed'. You should show us WHY the poster is uninformed.

Thanks.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

^ And yet, strangely enough (or not) Pak government has tried to make the Afghan government recognize 'the border'. And am I the only one failing to understand why one would try to make someone recognize a fact which is referred as invalid by himself anyway?

Don't you think it is rather irritating (and a security threat) to have a neighbor that refuses to recognize your ownership over your property, and has tried in the past to occupy it through force?

Would you not want to convince that neighbor to accept and respect the agreement that was signed in the past regarding that property, so that you may live in peace without worrying about your neighbor plotting and scheming to occupy your land?

 

[Watani]

^ That's been our government's mistake which Amanullah Khan tried his level best to rectify, our stubbornness. Yes, both governments should have acted much more maturely instead of plotting how to destabilize eachother or how many people to arm against their neighbours, especially when one of the governments' is convinced that the border is VERY valid. Don't forget that mistakes happened from both sides, and also not forget that the matter has been going much more worse than it should have been. I don't know who to blame, or why to blame. All I know is that enough of stubbornness, and enough of interference. (You can take it as in both ways.)

Besides, Afghan government isn't the only government with border/land issues. A matter 'very close to you' counts equally much.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Hey, I am all in favor of officially making it an 'open border' (which it pretty much is in any case since undesirable elements take advantage of the rugged terrain to cross back and forth all the time). Each country continues to govern its side as is the case currently, but the movement of people and trade can be facilitated through creating multiple crossings and improving infrastructure and rationalizing/synchronizing tariffs and taxes on both sides.

 

[chops3d]

ahmad, looks like you finally got your self a partner

 

[Watani]

@A.M.
Did our politicians have this thinking back then, none of us both would have been in this state today. There is a saying in Dari, "qatra qatra aab darya meshawad", mistakes after mistakes form destructions.

 

[Ahmad]

Uhm, as far as I know, Abdur Rahman was only involved in the Durrand Line matter because present day Tajikistan was known as Turkistan back then. Right? So I doubt Abdur Rahman ever had control under present day Tajikistan, forget about 'selling' it. One thing is that if Abdur Rahman couldn't prove he had only signed a 100 year contract, samewise the British haven't got any papers with the Emir's signature/fingerprint.

Nonetheless he was a coward and incompetent dog who deserved a merciless death.

Salam watani brother,

I would like to put 2 arguments in front of you, see which is acceptable to you:

1-I am sure you would agree with me that it was the British and Russians who determined and finalized the borders of Afghanistan, North or South alike. If we claim that once upon a time NWFP(KPK) was connected to present day Afghanistan, then India was also connected to that territory in different points of history, during Nadir Afshar, Mahmoud Ghaznavi, Ahmad Shah Abdali etc, lets not forget that central asia and Iran was also connected(and controlled) to Khorasan(Today Afghanistan) during the empires of Ghaznavis, Samanids, Sasanids, Safarids, Tahirids etc, Ariana and Bakhtar(Again, today Afghanistan) was part of Persian empire, if we put claim on NWFP(KPK) based on past territorial claims, then why should not we claim on Iran, Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan etc because those territories were part of our empires(I am sure paksitani members wont know nothing about Samanids, Safarids,Tahirids etc empires) and also why should not Iranians claim on our country because they ruled us for many centuries and our soil was part of their empire? People might say that the border between Pakistan and Afghanistan have divided tribes and same people from each other, i would argue that the Tajiks also have been divided by the border with Tajikistan, Samarqand, Bukhara and Iran, we are the same people we are all persians/tajiks and there shouldnt be any border. But that argument in this day and age is invalid and unreasonable.

2-If you don't agree with my above argument then i present a second argument on why we must never claim on KPK, hope you agree with me this time that Panjdeh and its surrounding areas including historical Merv was part of the territory which was controlled by Afghanistan as a matter of fact it was our natural part of the country for centuries, during an attack by the Russians those areas were taken from Afghanistan and became part of Russian controlled territory----and this happened during Abdul Rahman Khan. Abdul Rahman Khan lost Panjdeh and Merv to the Russians, and exactly the same Amir also lost NWFP(KPK) to the British, now, some of us(not all) and some of our leaders passionately claim on NWFP(KPK), but they have completely forgotten about Panjdeh and Merv, If NWFP was part of our country and so were Panjdeh and Merv-----why are they quiet about Panjdeh/Merv but very very loud about NWFP(KPK)? Is it a double standards? Is it hypocracy? or is it a desire based on ethnic dominance? I personally believe that the last one is correct---it is nothing but ethnic issue, otherwise why me as a tajik forcefully reject the idea of KPK to be separated from Pakistan. Afghanistan is sadly divided by ethnic lines and it has TOTALLY paralyzed the country, we are a super failed state like Somalia, there is no sense of patriotism, instead of claiming on other people's country we need to focus of our own soil and make it a better place for our children. For how long must we suffer? for how long we should kill each other? Off course the foreigners would want to use us like kitchen towel for their own purpose, but why should we listen to them? I strongly believe that this non issue of KPK will only ensure the prolongation of ethnic division in AFghanistan, Pashtuns want NWFP because they are pashton and we dont want them because we dont need more pashton in present day formula of AFghanistan. We shouldnt sacrifice Afghansitan for the sake of KPK!!! Despite all my criticizm of Pakistan, but in this specific issue I think it is hugely our fault(actually fault of those who raise this matter, not all of us) to claim on their country. Lets put an end to all this.

 

[Ahmad]

ahmad, looks like you finally got your self a partner

I think Watani has been here for awhile, and yes , it is nice to have my brother to give me support here.

 

[Mujeeb47]

Pukhtonistan is not more than a joke.

 

[Leader]

we hold the major pashtun area wise and population wise, so the part of Afghanistan should fall within us.