The Indian Rafale: Why Pakistan Should Celebrate! -Opinion (ALL Rafale posts here please)

[Bilal Khan 777]

Today marks the official signing of the long awaited, discussed, contested contract of Rafale aircraft for Indian Air Force. Enter the first western designed fifth generation multi-role fighter aircraft, most suitable for Indian desire of airspace domination over the sub-continent.

However, I find today as the real reason for celebration across many circles, including Pakistan's military community. Why, you may reckon? The procurement of 36 Rafales is exactly where India should not be.

Here is my opinion!

A) The selection of Rafale, after many painstaking years was to replace the Migs of India, which are in hundreds. Out of 120 aircraft, only 36 are being procured, which defeats the purpose of the induction.

B) The French Dassault are notoriously expensive. The "cost through life" of their bird is 6 times any of its contemporary, ensuring that budget will always be short, and always be tight.

C) Till the time the aircraft capabilities are fully realized, it would already be fully neutralized by competitive procurements in the region.

D) Once Indian pilots fly the Rafale, the interest in TEJAS will diminish further, creating an internal battle of buying foreign versus building local, hence jeopardizing both programs.

E) The Rafale aircraft purchase kills the "make in india" dream of the Modi government, which shows that this decision is a panic decision to stop gap fill the entirely low serviceability rates of IAF, combined with shrinking squadron numbers and lack of pilots.

F) The Rafale deal essentially closes the door in Indian Air Force for BAE Systems Eurofighter Typhoon, and BAE Systems ES products. This will re-open the opportunity of other countries to access the platform/avionics from these sources.

G) Rafale program is essentially a lame duck political approach, which exemplifies the military policy of the state being run by civilians, never coming up to the expectation of uniformed professionals.

H) Rafale deal is highly suspected of big bribes from the French to all levels within the Indian administration, MOD, and IAF, which will eventually come out and further derail any future procurement plans of IAF to meet the existing and future requirements.

 

[Sipahi]

Sir, I think they deliberately bought 36 aircrafts to make sure tejas program remain in picture.

 

[HttpError]

Above all it will certainly piss off Russians. So that is another goodie.

 

[Rupeshkumar]

An article full of errors...

Point A - Its to replace Mig27. Not Mig21.

Point B - FALSE Claim. Which aircraft of equal capability is 6 times cheaper?

Point G - Our Military wanted this aircraft, that too in 100s. Its civil leadership which restricted it to 36 (for the time being at least )..

Point H - Any aircraft deal from a foreign country will be suspected. Nothing specific to Rafael.

 

[Mustang06]

Today marks the official signing of the long awaited, discussed, contested contract of Rafale aircraft for Indian Air Force. Enter the first western designed fifth generation multi-role fighter aircraft, most suitable for Indian desire of airspace domination over the sub-continent.

However, I find today as the real reason for celebration across many circles, including Pakistan's military community. Why, you may reckon? The procurement of 36 Rafales is exactly where India should not be.

Here is why I think why!

A) The selection of Rafale, after many painstaking years was to replace the Mig-21s of India, which are in hundreds. Out of 120 aircraft, only 36 are being procured, which defeats the purpose of the induction.

B) The French Dassault are notoriously expensive. The cost through life of their bird is 6 times any of its contemporary, ensuring that budget will always be short, and always be tight.

C) Till the time the aircraft capabilities are fully realized, it would already be fully neutralized by competitive procurements in the region.

D) Once Indian pilots fly the Rafale, the interest in TEJAS will diminish further, creating an internal battle of buying foreign versus building local, hence jeopardizing both programs.

E) The Rafale aircraft purchase kills the "make in india" dream of the Modi government, which shows that this decision is a panic decision to stop gap fill the entirely low serviceability rates of IAF, combined with shrinking squadron numbers and lack of pilots.

F) The Rafale deal essentially closes the door in Indian Air Force for BAE Systems Eurofighter Typhoon, and BAE Systems ES products. This will re-open the opportunity of other countries to access the platform/avionics from these sources.

G) Rafale program is essentially a lame duck political approach, which exemplifies the military policy of the state being run by civilians, never coming up to the expectation of uniformed professionals.

H) Rafale deal is highly suspected of big bribes from the French to all levels within the Indian administration, MOD, and IAF, which will eventually come out and further derail any future procurement plans of IAF to meet the existing and future requirements.

With all due respect Sir Rafale was never intended to replace MiG 21. It is a replacement for MiG27/Jaguars strike aircrafts. Tejas will replace MiG 21 gradually no matter how much anyone disagrees.
(2) IAF seems pretty happy with performance of Mirage 2000 and is even spending significant amount on upgrading them. Plus I am pretty confident IAF must have taken in account cost of operating/upgrading the aircraft into consideration before signing it.
Other knowledgeable members would be happy to clarify your other points.

 

[aliyusuf]

One thing is for sure though ... trudging along with the game plan of just procuring JF-17s (its later block iterations) and used but upgraded F-16s isn't going to cut it any more. Pakistan needs to acquire some extra muscle from somewhere somehow ... or else an air conflict in the future may just turn into a turkey shoot in the adversaries favor.

I congratulate our Indian members on the signing of the Rafale deal. Even 36 of these platforms can reign havoc to our air, ground and strategic assets. Low RCS, advanced radar, very potent EW suite and long ranged accurate weapons ... nothing to be taken lightly.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[danger007]

Above all it will certainly piss off Russians. So that is another goodie.

There is Super upgrade programme and sub contract.

 

[Cherokee]

 

[Dash]

Today marks the official signing of the long awaited, discussed, contested contract of Rafale aircraft for Indian Air Force. Enter the first western designed fifth generation multi-role fighter aircraft, most suitable for Indian desire of airspace domination over the sub-continent.

However, I find today as the real reason for celebration across many circles, including Pakistan's military community. Why, you may reckon? The procurement of 36 Rafales is exactly where India should not be.

Here is my opinion!

A) The selection of Rafale, after many painstaking years was to replace the Mig-21s of India, which are in hundreds. Out of 120 aircraft, only 36 are being procured, which defeats the purpose of the induction.

B) The French Dassault are notoriously expensive. The "cost through life" of their bird is 6 times any of its contemporary, ensuring that budget will always be short, and always be tight.

C) Till the time the aircraft capabilities are fully realized, it would already be fully neutralized by competitive procurements in the region.

D) Once Indian pilots fly the Rafale, the interest in TEJAS will diminish further, creating an internal battle of buying foreign versus building local, hence jeopardizing both programs.

E) The Rafale aircraft purchase kills the "make in india" dream of the Modi government, which shows that this decision is a panic decision to stop gap fill the entirely low serviceability rates of IAF, combined with shrinking squadron numbers and lack of pilots.

F) The Rafale deal essentially closes the door in Indian Air Force for BAE Systems Eurofighter Typhoon, and BAE Systems ES products. This will re-open the opportunity of other countries to access the platform/avionics from these sources.

G) Rafale program is essentially a lame duck political approach, which exemplifies the military policy of the state being run by civilians, never coming up to the expectation of uniformed professionals.

H) Rafale deal is highly suspected of big bribes from the French to all levels within the Indian administration, MOD, and IAF, which will eventually come out and further derail any future procurement plans of IAF to meet the existing and future requirements.

Is he a "professional" ???

On a serious note, Rafale is not a game changer to India or the region. It's a game beginner. Pls keep this in mind.

 

[Green Ranger]

The only thing it does is pissing russian and nothing more

 

[graphican]

Induction of Rafael is not that bad as India already operate french platform, Mirage. But it is nevertheless a new platform which requires training of service-staff, pilots and then integration of armament, development of offensive / defensive strategies in collaboration with what India already has. 36 Jets also mean India can only keep them at one or two airbases only and its strategic scattering on multiple airports wouldn't be possible.

In my opinion, a war with India is due within next 2 years. My question here is that will India be able to absorb Rafael within this time-frame + would its pilots have developed skills to use this platform effectively?

 

[+4vsgorillas-Apebane]

Grapes growing on a tree. Also as a kid I always wondered why a fox would want to eat grapes.

 

[eddie01]

Above all it will certainly piss off Russians. So that is another goodie.

good luck with the first exercise lol i can see su35s cominggggggggggggggggg if ever hehe

 

[Tipu7]

A) The selection of Rafale, after many painstaking years was to replace the Mig-21s of India, which are in hundreds. Out of 120 aircraft, only 36 are being procured, which defeats the purpose of the induction

Sir,
Rafael was suppose to replace entire fleet of Mig27 (6squadrons). That is why they were looking for 126 digits (6 squadrons).
After 2022 4 squadrons of Mig27 might be awaiting if IAF failed to find adequate replacement. But 2 Rafael squadrons will be there too to pose threat which no other aircraft in IAF pose. And IAF minus Mig21/27 is still capable enough to take on entire PAF.

C) Till the time the aircraft capabilities are fully realized, it would already be fully neutralized by competitive procurements in the region

And what Competitive procurement will be? From PAF point of view?
More second hand F16 with MLU?

 

[Falcon26]

There's no treason for celebrations here. It should be taken as a cause of great concern for the PAF. There's no way to spin this. While PAF is fascinated with a 1970s era F-16s, India is undergoing 100-Billion+ modernization program almost creating a generational gaps between the capabilities of both air forces.