The Crucial Difference Between Mumbai 26/11 & Paris Attacks

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

That major difference between these two attacks in Mumbai and paris are like this.

In Paris---the state did not know about the attackers---, They might have known about certain threats but not to the extent that the terrorists were in Paris.

On the other hand----for Mumbai attacks---the Indian government was well informed at least 4 years ahead of time for imminent attacks---that is the larger picture----and thru the telephoto lens---the FBI informed indian govt of imminent attacks coming their way.

The conversation of the terrorists in the boat was captured live and relayed to the indian govt---a conspiracy against the indian state was created by their major intelligence agency---where it was assessed that if the attacks were allowed to happen---how much mileage could the indian state get out of it worldwide against pakistan.

The decision reached was to let the attacks happen---indian govt will play as a weak suck and helpless and blame everything on pakistan and it major intel agency.

So---the indian navy was instructed not to interfere with the coming boat and look the other way. Rest of the story is part of the history books---as the attack happened and progressed---the heavy death toll of innocent people----the Ajmal Kasab drama and what not---.

Indian public had been given many an information about the attack---but the indian public has not confronted its government and its main intel agency the RAW and forcefully asked the question---how were the terrorists able to come by boat into the mumbai harbor----travelling over or around 500 miles.

And as the indian public has not confronted the state about this issue---which means that they have also become a party to this treasonous calamity.

 

[Nilgiri]

The main difference is that Mumbai was clear state sponsored terrorism. Whereas I feel ISIS is not an official state per se, it has not been recognised by anyone else.

JuD was designated a terrorist outfit by the UN and sanctions were put into place and many world leaders after have called Pakistan an exporter of terrorism:

Cameron sparks diplomatic row with Pakistan after 'export of terror' remarks | Politics | The Guardian

Not to mention the difference of how the Pakistan terrorists came via the Sea to wage war on innocent people in a soft target (then). The french terrorists were mostly French citizens who had been cocooned and allowed to fester within certain French Islamofascist banlieues.

But of course Pakistanis like OP will live in denial compared to the rest of the world:

Pakistan intelligence services 'aided Mumbai terror attacks' | World news | The Guardian

Pakistan: State Sponsor of Terrorism?

I suppose its clear frustration at the World headlines comparing the two. Pakistan would prefer the world to forget the Mumbai Attacks (or at least accept the Pakistan version/claims regarding it)....not gonna happen. The World knows better.

So when jihadi Islamic extremists split into terror teams and commit mass carnage (outside of the regular bomb detonation), yes there will be comparisons.....and there will of course be similarities and differences contrasted depending on the source.

 

[cloud_digger]

Hi,

That major difference between these two attacks in Mumbai and paris are like this.

In Paris---the state did not know about the attackers---, They might have known about certain threats but not to the extent that the terrorists were in Paris.

On the other hand----for Mumbai attacks---the Indian government was well informed at least 4 years ahead of time for imminent attacks---that is the larger picture----and thru the telephoto lens---the FBI informed indian govt of imminent attacks coming their way.

The conversation of the terrorists in the boat was captured live and relayed to the indian govt---a conspiracy against the indian state was created by their major intelligence agency---where it was assessed that if the attacks were allowed to happen---how much mileage could the indian state get out of it worldwide against pakistan.

The decision reached was to let the attacks happen---indian govt will play as a weak suck and helpless and blame everything on pakistan and it major intel agency.

So---the indian navy was instructed not to interfere with the coming boat and look the other way. Rest of the story is part of the history books---as the attack happened and progressed---the heavy death toll of innocent people----the Ajmal Kasab drama and what not---.

Indian public had been given many an information about the attack---but the indian public has not confronted its government and its main intel agency the RAW and forcefully asked the question---how were the terrorists able to come by boat into the mumbai harbor----travelling over or around 500 miles.

And as the indian public has not confronted the state about this issue---which means that they have also become a party to this treasonous calamity.

How low can you stoop to? Every day you seem to wake up and say to yourself, "alright today I will stoop even lower than yesterday ". I mean, how can you come up with such ridiculous theories every single day? One of the most despicable acts of terror took place and instead of looking at the source of this terrorist act you weave a tale of incredible imagination and lay the blame on India. How is it that you knew all this? Were you in the control room or something?

 

[MastanKhan]

How low can you stoop to? Every day you seem to wake up and say to yourself, "alright today I will stoop even lower than yesterday ". I mean, how can you come up with such ridiculous theories every single day? One of the most despicable acts of terror took place and instead of looking at the source of this terrorist act you weave a tale of incredible imagination and lay the blame on India. How is it that you knew all this? Were you in the control room or something?

Hi,

No---it is not 'one' despicable act----actually there were two----the second one was the killing of innocent people---but the first one was more crucial in accomodating that act.

You indians problem is that you have not talked about the FIRST one---because that would disclose the drama that your intel agency played on you. They allowed the boat to come thru unchecked even though the fbi was on the phone with raw and telling it----they are coming----.

Other than that---just keep your holier than thous indian sh-it to yourself-

 

[Nilgiri]

How low can you stoop to? Every day you seem to wake up and say to yourself, "alright today I will stoop even lower than yesterday ". I mean, how can you come up with such ridiculous theories every single day? One of the most despicable acts of terror took place and instead of looking at the source of this terrorist act you weave a tale of incredible imagination and lay the blame on India. How is it that you knew all this? Were you in the control room or something?

Conspiracy theories bro. Its a favourite Pakistani pastime these days, especially among the defence circles (real or virtual).

They cannot accept the reality....or at least the way it is portrayed worldwide now....as a matter of fact.

Before they were enjoying only when India was saying so, and finding little sympathy worldwide. They got used to that paradigm...and hoped eventually it would be enough to take Kashmir away and hopefully break India up as well (in revenge for you know what).

Instead it has spectacularly 180'ed ever since 9/11 under the larger aegis of anti-Islamic terror efforts worldwide. And now we have pew polls saying that only a small percentage of Pakistanis are actually coming out against ISIS and the like....which further reinforces world opinion of Pakistan.

World leaders, media reports, surveys, Drone attacks and the OBL raid...they are all reminders to Pakistan how it is perceived worldwide....and its equal/equal tactics of before simply do not carry weight anymore like it did in the 80s and 90s.

So their resort is to further dig into conspiracy webs regarding CIA/Mossad/RAW what have you. It is the blind "all in" sort of faith that first got them into conflict with India that is simply permeating more widely in their geo-political psyche as Pakistan becomes synonymous with some pretty nasty things worldwide.

 

[cloud_digger]

Hi,

No---it is not 'one' despicable act----actually there were two----the second one was the killing of innocent people---but the first one was more crucial in accomodating that act.

You indians problem is that you have not talked about the FIRST one---because that would disclose the drama that your intel agency played on you. They allowed the boat to come thru unchecked even though the fbi was on the phone with raw and telling it----they are coming----.

Other than that---just keep your holier than thous indian sh-it to yourself-

Really, Indians knew while they were coming? And FBI was the informant? How is it that I am hearing it for the first time? Are you the FBI director in disguise on PDF? And why is the FBI the one to know about a foreign terror plot on a foreign land and not the CIA? I mean the FBI is a domestic intelligence and if anything international I thought it would be the CIA that would be first to inform no? Again, what do I know, you are the one who seems to have informants in all the right places,

Are you sure you are a car salesman and not some intelligence king pin?

Oh and, I do keep my sh-it to myself, I don't spew it on Internet forums. In case you are wondering if I called your post sh-it, don't wonder, I am calling it sh-it.

 

[cloud_digger]

Conspiracy theories bro. Its a favourite Pakistani pastime these days, especially among the defence circles (real or virtual).

They cannot accept the reality....or at least the way it is portrayed worldwide now....as a matter of fact.

Before they were enjoying only when India was saying so, and finding little sympathy worldwide. They got used to that paradigm...and hoped eventually it would be enough to take Kashmir away and hopefully break India up as well (in revenge for you know what).

Instead it has spectacularly 180'ed ever since 9/11 under the larger aegis of anti-Islamic terror efforts worldwide. And now we have pew polls saying that only a small percentage of Pakistanis are actually coming out against ISIS and the like....which further reinforces world opinion of Pakistan.

World leaders, media reports, surveys, Drone attacks and the OBL raid...they are all reminders to Pakistan how it is perceived worldwide....and its equal/equal tactics of before simply do not carry weight anymore like it did in the 80s and 90s.

So their resort is to further dig into conspiracy webs regarding CIA/Mossad/RAW what have you. It is the blind "all in" sort of faith that first got them into conflict with India that is simply permeating more widely in their geo-political psyche as Pakistan becomes synonymous with some pretty nasty things worldwide.

True, seems to me a case of burying head in sand thinking the world cannot see them since they cannot see the world.

 

[war&peace]

But the disheartening thing is that most of Indians are in denial mode.

 

[Jacob Martin]

The main difference is that Mumbai was clear state sponsored terrorism. Whereas I feel ISIS is not an official state per se, it has not been recognised by anyone else.

JuD was designated a terrorist outfit by the UN and sanctions were put into place and many world leaders after have called Pakistan an exporter of terrorism:

Cameron sparks diplomatic row with Pakistan after 'export of terror' remarks | Politics | The Guardian

Not to mention the difference of how the Pakistan terrorists came via the Sea to wage war on innocent people in a soft target (then). The french terrorists were mostly French citizens who had been cocooned and allowed to fester within certain French Islamofascist banlieues.

But of course Pakistanis like OP will live in denial compared to the rest of the world:

Pakistan intelligence services 'aided Mumbai terror attacks' | World news | The Guardian

Pakistan: State Sponsor of Terrorism?

I suppose its clear frustration at the World headlines comparing the two. Pakistan would prefer the world to forget the Mumbai Attacks (or at least accept the Pakistan version/claims regarding it)....not gonna happen. The World knows better.

So when jihadi Islamic extremists split into terror teams and commit mass carnage (outside of the regular bomb detonation), yes there will be comparisons.....and there will of course be similarities and differences contrasted depending on the source.

I must commend you for even bothering to counter the sheer hypocrisy and double-standard of Pakistani members on PDF on the terrorism issue. Good-terrorist/bad-terrorist, militant/freedom fighter - too many caveats and escape clauses for the uninitiated to grapple with. No wonder more than half of Pakistanis in the recent Pew survey on ISIS are "undecided"!!!

 

[Nilgiri]

I must commend you for even bothering to counter the sheer hypocrisy and double-standard of Pakistani members on PDF on the terrorism issue. Good-terrorist/bad-terrorist, militant/freedom fighter - too many caveats and escape clauses for the uninitiated to grapple with. No wonder more than half of Pakistanis in the recent Pew survey on ISIS are "undecided"!!!

There are many decent Pakistani members here...and plenty of neutral observers...that's who my posts are mostly for.

I am not seeking to alter the viewpoints of the nutjobs/trolls etc....that is pointless.

 

[MastanKhan]

R

How is it that I am hearing it for the first time?

Are you sure you are a car salesman and not some intelligence king pin?

.

Sir,

You really believe that the world has to inform you.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/22/w...-spy-data-but-an-uncompleted-puzzle.html?_r=0

Source: U.S. warned India about possible Mumbai attack - CNN.com

The Hidden Intelligence Breakdowns Behind the Mumbai Attacks | American Terrorist | FRONTLINE | PBS

 

[Jacob Martin]

There are many decent Pakistani members here...and plenty of neutral observers...that's who my posts are mostly for.

I am not seeking to alter the viewpoints of the nutjobs/trolls etc....that is pointless.

True. Neutral observers and casual visitors are the key. Even if ten people in the vulnerable age group of 16-25 are able to get the real picture, it's a job well done.

 

[halupridol]

APS attack was done under supervision of ISI.the whole world agencies were notifying Pakistan about harbouring good terrorist n its implications....voila ISI came up wud a sinister plan to counter all the bad press aftr abbotabad/osama n ofcourse some gud old aid juice.so ISI n elements in Pak fauj orchestrated APS,,n rather conveniently all attackers were killed,not even one was apprehended alive,,,aftr getting the kids slaughtered they were sure to get public opinion against Taliban,,,ground for zazb e arab laid down,,,they issued eviction orders to gud Taliban n went on wid there gibaidplz op in tribal areas,for which US had been insisting on for some time.
this whole drama was gobbled up enthusiastically by Pak awam. The gullible lot never asked why not even one of the perpetrators wasn't alive for interogation or why wud ttp attack aps,a school, at a time when the was a consensus building going on for mil. Ops in tribal areas,,,if they wanted to make a statement,,it cud have been done better by mehran base like attacks.
-------
well i can go on,,,hows tht for a conspiracy theory

 

[Nilgiri]

Sir,

You really believe that the world has to inform you.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/22/w...-spy-data-but-an-uncompleted-puzzle.html?_r=0

Source: U.S. warned India about possible Mumbai attack - CNN.com

The Hidden Intelligence Breakdowns Behind the Mumbai Attacks | American Terrorist | FRONTLINE | PBS

None of your links back up this assertion of yours, worded the way you have done:

The conversation of the terrorists in the boat was captured live and relayed to the indian govt---a conspiracy against the indian state was created by their major intelligence agency---where it was assessed that if the attacks were allowed to happen---how much mileage could the indian state get out of it worldwide against pakistan.

^that is conspiracy nutjob territory. No media group that is worth its salt has published anything on the level you are claiming.

Your links are more like the warnings many countries (including India) gave the US about the 9/11 threat....which the US took into consideration but did not pursue vigorously after a certain time when nothing happened. Similar to from your own link:

Indian security forces have confirmed to CNN that not only did U.S. officials warn them of a water-borne attack in Mumbai -- they were told twice. The area entered a higher state of alert for a week, including tightened security measures at hotels, but those efforts were eventually reduced, Indian officials said.

Heightened security and alert costs money and resources to maintain which draws away from other security needs. Thats why there must be better intelligence gathering to begin with. Thats why India now is putting a much better coastal security apparatus all along its west coast given the threat from ISI units and also Somali pirates etc.

 

[Bang Galore]

On the other hand----for Mumbai attacks---the Indian government was well informed at least 4 years ahead of time for imminent attacks---.