The ADA LCA: Beloved Aircraft or a Lemon

[Georgeclark]

JF 17 - I remember full form was Joint Fighter

While all good self appeasement to say, one has to remember that the requirements and dynamics about Industry for India vs Pakistan are worlds apart. India is seeking self sufficiency.. Pakistan is seeking sanction proof sufficiency.
India HAS to build it at home for presitege, Pakistan only needs to get what it wants hook or by crook.

Any person who tries to compare their achievements is a total fool in my view. Both have different goals vis-a-vis their R&D industries. Yet, here is the Fact.. the Tejas program along with the Arjun were supposed to be India's own showpieces which regardless of their final somewhat satisfactory output are complete jokes in terms of project management. Neither delivered when they were really required to which in one case put the lives of pilots at risk and continues to do so. It also had a detrimental effect on the operational performance of an important arm of the military.
So regardless of whether Pakistan buys/copies or fakes it.. India suffered. And if people are blind to that simple fact.. well all I can say is that..
via Imgflip Meme Maker



And what standards is this clearance given on?

India suffered or not will be seen in Future, according to me India gained a lot. Never forget hook and crook do not work for long.

 

[NKVD]

And what is the definition of the FoC?

FOC Means Final operational Capability Which is the power to achieve a desired operational effect. Capability is much more than just the aircraft or training personnel to operate equipment. Capability describes the optimum combination of the organisation, its personnel, collective training, major systems, supplies, facilities and training areas, logistics, support, command and management required to deliver a sustained effect, at the right time, in the right way, for an extended period. In Other Words Aircraft is Combat Ready in All Platform A2A,A2G & others According to Its Requirement if Needed.

 

[Georgeclark]

And what standards is this clearance given on?

It includes weapon clearance, flight test, engine tests, advanced weapons clearance, altitude tests, temperature soaring tests, air-data computers, Hybrid Multi Mode Radar, new communication and navigation equipment and radar warning receiver etc are tested, Speed test. A lot of things which are required to make it a potent fighter. They do not want any mistakes in the future.

 

[NKVD]

It includes weapon clearance, flight test, engine tests, advanced weapons clearance, altitude tests, temperature soaring tests, air-data computers, Hybrid Multi Mode Radar, new communication and navigation equipment and radar warning receiver etc are tested, Speed test. A lot of things which are required to make it a potent fighter. They do not want any mistakes in the future.

In Other words Final Operational Capability is declared when the entire capability can be deployed on operations. FOC considers the personnel, training, major systems, supplies, facilities and training areas, logistics, support, command and management required to deliver the full capability required.

 

[Georgeclark]

In Other words Final Operational Capability is declared when the entire capability can be deployed on operations. FOC considers the personnel, training, major systems, supplies, facilities and training areas, logistics, support, command and management required to deliver the full capability required.

Thank you I didn't know much about it just what I read in news paper or many websites. what all tests it going through etc.

 

[Bratva]

FOC Means Final operational Capability Which is the power to achieve a desired operational effect. Capability is much more than just the aircraft or training personnel to operate equipment. Capability describes the optimum combination of the organisation, its personnel, collective training, major systems, supplies, facilities and training areas, logistics, support, command and management required to deliver a sustained effect, at the right time, in the right way, for an extended period. In Other Words Aircraft is Combat Ready in All Platform A2A,A2G & others According to Its Requirement if Needed.

And in what area do you think JF-17 is lagging ? Since I assume you have a complete knowledge of JF-17 program and you have read JF-17 project director interviews as well watched videos of JF-17 carrying all of the goodies of A-A config, A-G config and A-Sea config besides SEAD/DEAD weaponry and stand-off missiles.

 

[GORKHALI]

[QUOT

While all good self appeasement to say, one has to remember that the requirements and dynamics about Industry for India vs Pakistan are worlds apart. India is seeking self sufficiency.. Pakistan is seeking sanction proof sufficiency.
India HAS to build it at home for presitege, Pakistan only needs to get what it wants hook or by crook.

Any person who tries to compare their achievements is a total fool in my view. Both have different goals vis-a-vis their R&D industries. Yet, here is the Fact.. the Tejas program along with the Arjun were supposed to be India's own showpieces which regardless of their final somewhat satisfactory output are complete jokes in terms of project management. Neither delivered when they were really required to which in one case put the lives of pilots at risk and continues to do so. It also had a detrimental effect on the operational performance of an important arm of the military.
So regardless of whether Pakistan buys/copies or fakes it.. India suffered. And if people are blind to that simple fact.. well all I can say is that..
via Imgflip Meme Maker



And what standards is this clearance given on?

Activities completed towards FOC

• Integration of centre-line drop tank(2000ltrs)
• Gun integration & ground firing
• Integration of conventional & low drag bombs
• Integration of advanced LGB
•Hot & cold weather trials
•All weather certification
• Envelop expansion to higher angles of attack and load factor (g).
(Source: ADA)
Parameters to be completed during FOC phase
• Air-to-air refuelling
• Gun flight trials
• High speed low drag bomb with retarded tail unit
• Integration of supersonic drop tank
• Integration of BVR missile and Advanced Close Combat Missile
• Envelop expansion to higher angles of attack and load factor (g)
(Source ADA)

And in what area do you think JF-17 is lagging ? Since I assume you have a complete knowledge of JF-17 program

Better not to ask here,this is LCA thread mate.

 

[Windjammer]

Seriously its quite funny to see how Pakistan boasts about its JF 17, its not a thing made by you alone its with China, the name of plane is FC 1 Made by China/Pakistan not jsut Pakistan. Its like HAL says its made Sukhoi but no it just assembles them in India.

You sure you want to maintain this line, when i said something to same effect, many Indians turned instantly rabid.

 

[Bratva]

[QUOT

Activities completed towards FOC

• Integration of centre-line drop tank(2000ltrs)
• Gun integration & ground firing
• Integration of conventional & low drag bombs
• Integration of advanced LGB
•Hot & cold weather trials
•All weather certification
• Envelop expansion to higher angles of attack and load factor (g).
(Source: ADA)
Parameters to be completed during FOC phase
• Air-to-air refuelling
• Gun flight trials
• High speed low drag bomb with retarded tail unit
• Integration of supersonic drop tank
• Integration of BVR missile and Advanced Close Combat Missile
• Envelop expansion to higher angles of attack and load factor (g)
(Source ADA)


Better not to ask here,this is LCA thread mate.

JF-17 has done 99 percent of the mentioned activities sans A-A refueling and all weather certification.

 

[Georgeclark]

You sure you want to maintain this line, when i said something to same effect, many Indians turned instantly rabid.

I guess according to my knowledge HAL does manufacture Sukhoi 30 MKI under license from Sukhoi. Wait you are deviating it from the topic the topic was that JF 17 is not just a Pakistan creation lets stay at that

 

[GORKHALI]

JF-17 has done 99 percent of the mentioned activities sans A-A refueling and all weather certification.

look mate don't tempt me to put something which will derail the thread.
At Indian members please stick to the topic and which I guess nothing more to discuss as Prof himself contradicts to his own blog.@oscar @waz please close this one.

 

[Bratva]

look mate don't tempt me to put something which will derail the thread.
At Indian members please stick to the topic and which I guess nothing more to discuss as Prof himself contradicts to his own blog.@oscar @waz please close this one.

It's your ignorance about JF-17 if you are tempted to put some outdated info. Be my guest, I will have the last laugh on you.

 

[rajnikant]

Make lemonade.

Use jf sattrah as stirrer in that.

 

[GORKHALI]

It's your ignorance about JF-17 if you are tempted to put some outdated info. Be my guest, I will have the last laugh on you.

Make a thread and ask mods not to ban Indians when they start pounding with good source.

 

[NKVD]

And in what area do you think JF-17 is lagging ? Since I assume you have a complete knowledge of JF-17 program

Firstly It Has to Scale up its Production Rate of Per Year.Secondly there are Many Exaggeration Regarding JF-17 on Bvr Capabilities & others like IFR, New ECM/data link, infra-red search and track (IRST) system and new weapons integration Still to Be Verified. Lack of Certified Video Evidential Sources is Also Reason of It.I Can Carry on the List But its Not Proper Platform