Tesla No Longer Even A Growth Company; Going Bankrupt: Shortseller

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Just a Ponzy scheme , one night after market close these Bankers will all shake hands and pull their funds out
they get extra 1-2 hour every day to do their dirty dealings after hours while rest of every day folks can't buy

I like to Drive my own car

No shortage of fossil fuel enough to last +1,000 more years

 

[VCheng]

Right now the biggest advantage ICE cars have vs electric is the recharge time takes a bit long. The technology at the R&D level rn will make it to electric cars in the next decade...and ICE cars will be on the losing end.

As more and more charging stations become available, the main bottleneck to widespread adoption of electric cars will remain the charging time required. Until and unless a technological breakthrough reduces that to comparable times for refueling, ICE vehicles will remain dominant.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

Ppl get so hell bent on trying to disprove something that they ignore the obvious advantages of electric cars.

It's just going to be a natural progression of convenience.

The future will either be cheap power through nuclear fusion or super efficient solar panels.
Driving up to a gasoline station is going to be looked at as being as dumb as going out to buy a feed bag to put on a horse's face.

 

[VCheng]

It's just going to be a natural progression of convenience.

The future will either be cheap power through nuclear fusion or super efficient solar panels.
Driving up to a gasoline station is going to be looked at as being as dumb as going out to buy a feed bag to put on a horse's face.

Only if the recharging time (or battery exchange) is comparable to refueling time. (And cold weather performance.)

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

Only if the recharging time (or battery exchange) is comparable to refueling time. (And cold weather performance.)

We are at the start...it will only get better.

This didn't deter innovation

 

[Cookie Monster]

As more and more charging stations become available, the main bottleneck to widespread adoption of electric cars will remain the charging time required. Until and unless a technological breakthrough reduces that to comparable times for refueling, ICE vehicles will remain dominant.

Tesla demonstrated battery pack switching tech...which takes less time than filling a tank of gas to the max. However they haven't implemented it(perhaps the cost of such widescale deployment of this tech is high).

Other experimental tech being researched is supercapacitors...however IMO the real solution will come from extending the range further. Imagine if u could drive 600 miles on a single charge...for an average person...with the longest daily commutes...it would mean no need to stop and recharge. At the end of the day once the person has returned home...they can charge it again overnight. The only exceptions will be a long distance roadtrip.

This would be the lowest cost method that wouldn't require spending millions implementing technology on a large scale to change out batteries. If anything this could work in tandem with the battery pack switch tech. Tesla would only have to deploy this tech in select key locations like every 400 miles for example. So even for long trips...u could be on the go with a quick swap of the battery.

Keep in mind that 600mile range isn't too far off into the future. I expect these kind of ranges would be feasible within the next decade.

 

[Cookie Monster]

It's just going to be a natural progression of convenience.

The future will either be cheap power through nuclear fusion or super efficient solar panels.
Driving up to a gasoline station is going to be looked at as being as dumb as going out to buy a feed bag to put on a horse's face.

It's not even just the cost comparison of gasoline vs electricity...
...the overall cost of maintenance is lower for an EV vs an ICE car. From electrical current to the motor spinning...is the simplest form factor as it will ever get. Eliminating unnecessary moving parts(that can break) lowers maintenance cost over the lifetime of the vehicle. This combined with the rumored million mile battery...and u can potentially have a car that lasts longer than an ICE car and costs less in maintenance cost over its life.

 

[VCheng]

We are at the start...it will only get better.

View attachment 661958

This didn't deter innovation

Fair enough. Please keep in mind we are still waiting for the flying car.s and endless fusion power. Ok, I jest, but the point is that unless a fundamental breakthrough is achieved, the limitations remain getting the required KW-Hrs of energy onboard in a short time in ambient temperatures.

Tesla demonstrated battery pack switching tech...which takes less time than filling a tank of gas to the max. However they haven't implemented it(perhaps the cost of such widescale deployment of this tech is high).

Other experimental tech being researched is supercapacitors...however IMO the real solution will come from extending the range further. Imagine if u could drive 600 miles on a single charge...for an average person...with the longest daily commutes...it would mean no need to stop and recharge. At the end of the day once the person has returned home...they can charge it again overnight. The only exceptions will be a long distance roadtrip.

This would be the lowest cost method that wouldn't require spending millions implementing technology on a large scale to change out batteries. If anything this could work in tandem with the battery pack switch tech. Tesla would only have to deploy this tech in select key locations like every 400 miles for example. So even for long trips...u could be on the go with a quick swap of the battery.

Keep in mind that 600mile range isn't too far off into the future. I expect these kind of ranges would be feasible within the next decade.

As you indicate, having a supporting infrastructure will be key for the foreseeable future. Here the issue of compatibility will arise as companies jockey for market share, unless the government mandates universal compatibility. Imagine having a car that can be refueled only at Mobil or Sunoco.

 

[VCheng]

This combined with the rumored million mile battery...and u can potentially have a car that lasts longer

Key words: rumored and potentially.

Current batteries do not like deep discharge cycles and capacity falls off rapidly in the cold, specially when heated seats and other similar ancillaries (lights/wipers/defroster etc) are used the most.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

It's not even just the cost comparison of gasoline vs electricity...
...the overall cost of maintenance is lower for an EV vs an ICE car. From electrical current to the motor spinning...is the simplest form factor as it will ever get. Eliminating unnecessary moving parts(that can break) lowers maintenance cost over the lifetime of the vehicle. This combined with the rumored million mile battery...and u can potentially have a car that lasts longer than an ICE car and costs less in maintenance cost over its life.

Also gasoline companies are up there near the DMV in terms of consumer loathing.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

Fair enough. Please keep in mind we are still waiting for the flying car.s and endless fusion power. Ok, I jest, but the point is that unless a fundamental breakthrough is achieved, the limitations remain getting the required KW-Hrs of energy onboard in a short time in ambient temperatures.

If worse came to worst they can always subdivide the battery pack and make you plug in a 5 battery charging line.

 

[Cookie Monster]

Key words: rumored and potentially.

Current batteries do not like deep discharge cycles and capacity falls off rapidly in the cold, specially when heated seats and other similar ancillaries (lights/wipers/defroster etc) are used the most.

The "rumored" and "potentially" isn't just stuff of imagination...I've been keeping a close eye on the developments in battery tech around the world. Samsung just announced a solid state battery recently, Tesla's electrode less battery, etc. all these are real...though admittedly limited to the labs(as they are recent breakthroughs). This is why I said I'm expecting such things within the next decade...bcuz such things take time to reach mass production. Of course there's no way to be sure...but I don't think it's too ambitious to think that given another decade EVs will be overall better in every category compared to iCE cars(except perhaps the price...which I'm not sure how it will go).

 

[VCheng]

If worse came to worst they can always subdivide the battery pack and make you plug in a 5 battery charging line.

The most important aspect will likely not be the technology, which has many option, one of which you describe. The main issue will be whether the new technology can compete with the old based on cost without resorting to government subsidies or tilting the table with taxation breaks and incentives.

The "rumored" and "potentially" isn't just stuff of imagination...I've been keeping a close eye on the developments in battery tech around the world. Samsung just announced a solid state battery recently, Tesla's electrode less battery, etc. all these are real...though admittedly limited to the labs(as they are recent breakthroughs). This is why I said I'm expecting such things within the next decade...bcuz such things take time to reach mass production. Of course there's no way to be sure...but I don't think it's too ambitious to think that given another decade EVs will be overall better in every category compared to iCE cars(except perhaps the price...which I'm not sure how it will go).

I am not sure how it will go either. One thing is certain though. It will be an exciting decade for technological progress in this field.

 

[SgtGungHo]

The "rumored" and "potentially" isn't just stuff of imagination...I've been keeping a close eye on the developments in battery tech around the world. Samsung just announced a solid state battery recently, Tesla's electrode less battery, etc. all these are real...though admittedly limited to the labs(as they are recent breakthroughs). This is why I said I'm expecting such things within the next decade...bcuz such things take time to reach mass production. Of course there's no way to be sure...but I don't think it's too ambitious to think that given another decade EVs will be overall better in every category compared to iCE cars(except perhaps the price...which I'm not sure how it will go).

I know a friend who works at Samsung SDI and another guy at Panasonic NA. Both of my mates have told me that those 'new battery technologies' won't leave the labs anytime soon as they are all commerically unvialbe. Researchers at the lab are toying with all elements, especially alkali metals. I mean I don't deny that many teams around the world have made some progress with Sodium-ion and Potassium-ion battery, but they just are not competitive against Lithium-ion battery at the moment and it will remain that way for another 5 year. Then again, I could be wrong.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

I know a friend who works at Samsung SDI and another guy at Panasonic NA. Both of my mates have told me that those 'new battery technologies' won't leave the labs anytime soon as they are all commerically unvialbe. Researchers at the lab are toying with all elements, especially alkali metals. I mean I don't deny that many teams around the world have made some progress with Sodium-ion and Potassium-ion battery, but they just are not competitive against Lithium-ion battery at the moment and it will remain that way for another 5 year. Then again, I could be wrong.

The rumor is the big battery announcement has to do with a new production process to make lithium batteries...not switching out components. Apparently Maxwell stumbled upon a new process that is quicker, less expensive, and more robust so they have less loss after a large number of recharging cycles (ie million mile battery). After Maxwell made the announcement Tesla immediately bought Maxwell for $200 Million and basically put a gag order on any future news announcements.

Tesla will make money from licenses to world battery makers so they can use this process in not only cars but for things like phones and laptops. This is why their stock is skyrocketing.