Tejas designers target world class technologies for Mark II fighter

[zaxcolix]

Here's another 50 cents for you poor soul. Go fetch it, boy.

50 cent propaganda army strikes again ....other Indians ...please dont feed the Trolls

 

[fast]

J-10 is 8th gen . Now get back to your coal mine...else the iron bowl will be taken back.

China defence lies in not fighting ... not because of "J-10".

That's why they don't feel safe and running for Su-35 etc.

It's laughable that the Chinese make you so nervous. I don't care what generation J-10 is in. I only know LCA is a practice target when it's up against other air forces.

 

[zaxcolix]

It's laughable that the Chinese make you so nervous. I don't care what generation J-10 is in. I only know LCA is a practice target when it's up against other air forces.

50 cent propaganda army strikes again ....other Indians ...please dont feed the Trolls

 

[fast]

50 cent propaganda army strikes again ....other Indians ...please dont feed the Trolls

You are so hungry for 50 cent.

 

[Hellraiser007]

What Indian conditions? The corrupted nature?

Off topic rant.
India needs an interceptor which can defend its skies and it should be light weight,stealth and agile and LCA meets these conditions.

LCA marl 2 is a 4.5 generation fighter jet.

 

[sancho]

....guess some Indians want ADA to make '0' mistakes for making an Fighter Aircraft. Justice Katju ...where are you

Everybody makes mistakes and nobody has expected them to offer a fighter with the same quality and capability as western counterparts, but many of the mistakes in the LCA project could have been avoided by a simpler and more rational project management. But that is not what they wanted, because they wanted to show off with their capabilities instead of oaffering our pilots a reliable and cost-effective of the Mig 21s.
The outcome is, several dead pilots, the nations air security is in trouble because we have to phase out fighters without adding similar numbers again, increased costs, because of the long delays, alternative engines, techs and MMRCAs that had to be procured.
Be honest, is this justifiable and if not, why was nobody taken responsible for this mismanagement and some of the failures these scientists produced?

Indigenous AESA radars for Tejas Mark-2 : Saraswat

He is one of the most unreliable sources at all and constantly talks BS and it's funny to see the ADA chief to counter the claims of the DRDO chief:

“Whether or not AESA radar is developed in time for the first Tejas Mark II, this radar will be retrofitted onto these fighters as soon as it is certified,” says the ADA chief.

But how many countries are making an LCA kind of an aircraft?

Why are there so less countries making own fighters? Because it is very difficult and you need credible knowledge and experience to do it! That's why it was simply stupid, to develop the fighter without foreign partners, with an Indian engine and Indian radar, which itself are highly difficult projects. That's the key problem of the LCA project as a whole and not that it was the first fighter project and that we started from Zero. That are just excusess for those who messed it up!!!

1) LCA MK1 developed with licence produced Elta 2032 radar and Snecma M53-2 or RD93 engines would be in opterational service today!

2) An LCA MK2 version aimed on fixing the problems only (new engine, Elta 2032, weight reduction) and not adding many other new things (additional fuel tanks for IN, new radar, cockpit displays, or avionics), could be inducted way earlier than the end of the decade!

3) N-LCA navalised by Mikoyan or Dassault, would not face the weight and structural issues, because they have experience with navalising fighters, unlike EADS our current choice!

4) Since LCA MK2 and MMRCA are meant to jointly replace the Mig 21 fleet and we have to produce certain parts under licence anyway, makes using RBE 2 AESA radar for both types a LOGICAL choice. While indigenous AESAs could be added for later LCA versions or AMCA in a ready and mature stage of our own AESA developments!

5) If this project would be done like the Dhruv project, it would be a success today!

 

[Captain Spark]

By the time LCA 2 will arrive it will be a turkey shoot practice for most 4.5 or 5th gen planes though there will be some space for it fighting the jf17s......LCA 1 & 2 will c max 10-15 years of service b4 it will need upgradation.

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

By the time LCA 2 will arrive it will be a turkey shoot practice for most 4.5 or 5th gen planes though there will be some space for it fighting the jf17s......LCA 1 & 2 will c max 10-15 years of service b4 it will need upgradation.

all fighters go through small and big upgrades, even before 10 years period..nothing unusual.

 

[MilSpec]

By the time LCA 2 will arrive it will be a turkey shoot practice for most 4.5 or 5th gen planes though there will be some space for it fighting the jf17s......LCA 1 & 2 will c max 10-15 years of service b4 it will need upgradation.

Explain how please?

 

[kaykay]

By the time LCA 2 will arrive it will be a turkey shoot practice for most 4.5 or 5th gen planes though there will be some space for it fighting the jf17s......LCA 1 & 2 will c max 10-15 years of service b4 it will need upgradation.

yeah yeah blah blah....anyway welcome to the PDF.

 

[selvan33]

Broadsword: Tejas designers target world class technologies for Mark II fighter


By Ajai Shukla
Aeronautical Development Agency, Bangalore
Business Standard, 10th Dec 12

The indigenous Tejas Mark II Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) will enter Indian Air Force (IAF) service by 2018 as a state-of-the-art fighter that is significantly more advanced than the current Tejas Mark I, says the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA), which runs the Rs 14,047 crore LCA programme.

ADA’s director, PS Subramanyam, divulged to Business Standard the improvements being made to the existing Tejas Mark I, which the IAF will begin flying next year. The Mark I is a capable fighter, says Subramanyam, but it incorporates many technologies of the preceding decade, some of which --- especially avionics --- would be outdated by 2018 when the IAF gets the Mark II.

The pipeline of improvements includes indigenous Active Electronically Scanned Array (AESA) radar; interfaces for mounting the world’s most advanced air-to-air missiles; a revolutionary onboard oxygen-generating system; an advanced Electronic Warfare (EW) suite to confuse enemy radars and sensors; greater fuel capacity to increase its range; a retractable mid-air refuelling system; and revolutionary actuators that only the most advanced US fighters currently have.

“Avionics technologies have a generation span of just 5-7 years. The Tejas currently incorporates technologies from 2005 and later. For the Tejas Mark II in 2018, we will have a generational leap to more futuristic electronics,” says Subramanyam.

The ADA chief says these systems will be developed and tested over the next five years, while ADA re-engineers the Tejas to accommodate the bulkier and heavier General Electric F-414 engine that will power the Tejas Mark II. Subramanyam reveals that ADA is choosing a foreign partner to advise in fitting the new engine.

“We will work with a foreign consultant in order to avoid the mistakes that other aerospace designers have earlier made. We are talking to Saab (of Sweden), to Cassidian (the European consortium) and to other vendors. We should have a decision by mid-2013,” says Subramanyam.

ADA is evaluating the new avionics on the first Tejas prototype, designated PV-1, which is now too old for the flight-trial programme and will be used hereafter to test new systems. First up is a new Electronic Warfare system, designed by the Defence R&D Organisation (DRDO) laboratory, Defence Avionics Research Establishment (DARE), which senses enemy radar signals and jams them effectively, making the Tejas hard to detect.

Next up for testing is a sophisticated on-board oxygen generating system, developed by the DRDO’s Defence Bioengineering and Electro-medical Laboratory (DEBEL), which continuously collects atmospheric oxygen and supplies it to the pilot. Today, the capacity of the oxygen bottles that contemporary fighters carry limit mission times; when oxygen runs low, the pilot heads back to base. Now, the on-board oxygen generating system, along with mid-air refuelling and the Tejas Mark II’s increased fuel load, will allow 3-4 hours of continuous flying, more than most fighters in the world.

During these lengthy combat missions, the Tejas Mark II pilot will benefit from a friendlier cockpit display. While the Mark I already has an all-glass cockpit (i.e. with digital TV-screen-type displays instead of the old analogue dials), the Mark II will have larger, user-friendly screens that reduce pilot fatigue.

Improved avionics will also include a sophisticated Inertial Navigation System (INS), developed by the DRDO’s Research Centre, Imarat (RCI). So far the Tejas has used an imported INS.

“This INS would be used in the navigation-attack system that is being tailor-made for the LCA,” says Subramanyam. A navigation-attack system navigates the fighter precisely to an enemy target, even in pitch darkness. The DRDO has earlier built a series of such systems for the IAF’s fleet of Jaguar strike aircraft.

The biggest game-changer, one that would make the Tejas a truly formidable multi-role fighter, could be the ongoing project to develop an Active Electronically Scanned Array (AESA) radar. This advanced radar, which only US companies have truly mastered, is being developed for the Tejas by the DRDO laboratory, Electronics Research & Development Establishment (LRDE).

“Whether or not AESA radar is developed in time for the first Tejas Mark II, this radar will be retrofitted onto these fighters as soon as it is certified,” says the ADA chief.

The Tejas Mark II is also being configured to fire any advanced weaponry that the IAF acquires, e.g. any long-range air-to-air missiles (LRAAMs) that may be acquired along with the ongoing purchase of 126 Dassault Rafale fighters. The DRDO is developing an indigenous air-to-air missile, the Astra, but that is some way off from completion.

The production of 20 Tejas Mark I fighters ordered by the IAF is under way in HAL. This will be followed by another order for 20 more Tejas Mark I, once the fighter obtains final operational clearance, expected in 2015. While HAL is running well behind its objective of building 8 Tejas per year, the target for completion of these 40 fighters remains 2017. After that, the production of Tejas Mark II will begin, subject to successful flight-testing.

Dear Mr.PS Subramanyam, i dont want the moon any more. i just need a cup of coffee to kill my yawnings after hearing the majestic word(in paper only) TEJAAAAASSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS.

 

[arbit]

If I am not wrong he was making the first BULB in the world and not in his country. He was inventing something that wasn't there. By this example do you want to say same thing about LCA ???

Nobody here is saying ADA/HAL/DRDO should not make a mistake. The mear tone is avoid the the mistakes which they can. It's not a pride but the profession that makes the success in time.
Nobody here is against LCA but surely many of us don't like the way this project is/was being handled.

If you go through the LCA sticky thread you will find all there suggestions years before today. Plus be specific when you want to rant on somebody. Disscussion can make points clear not the ranting.

If you are developing something from scratch, which did not exist before in your country or industrial base and you are going about it all alone then its as good as reinventing the wheel and one will have to go through all the mistakes / rigours which one's predecessors went through. So lets look at this error trajectory as a learning curve.

However In this case HAL and ADA are to blame for inept project handling and not taking outside help on time, but the process they have gone through will bear fruits later which are not so obvious right now.

 

[Paan Singh]

Off topic rant.
India needs an interceptor which can defend its skies and it should be light weight,stealth and agile and LCA meets these conditions.

LCA marl 2 is a 4.5 generation fighter jet.

He is pakistani with american flags

 

[Sergi]

Incorrect.

If you are developing something from scratch, which did not exist before in your country or industrial base and you are going about it all alone then one can berate you for being stupid and not taking outside help 'cos its as good as reinventing the wheel and one will have to go through all the mistakes / rigours which one's predecessors went through.
In this case HAL and ADA are to blame for inept project handling and not taking outside help on time, but the process they have gone through will bear fruits later which are not so obvious right now.

What is incorrect ??? LCA is delayed ??? LCA is wrongly managed ??? LCA handlers over assumed their capacities ???
Why not read Sancho's post and reply to him ??? He can answer better than me.

 

[zaxcolix]

....blah....Be honest, is this justifiable and if not, why was nobody taken responsible for this mismanagement and some of the failures these scientists produced?

Ensuring National security is job of MoD and safety of pilots is responsibility of IAF. Looks like they failed in their duty as per you.

ADA responsibility is to try and make an fighter aircraft within stipulated time ...it not ...to continue doing research till they get right. The only failure is to give up ...and so far they haven't given up.

Why are there so less countries making own fighters? Because it is very difficult and you need credible knowledge and experience to do it! That's why it was simply stupid, to develop the fighter without foreign partners, with an Indian engine and Indian radar, which itself are highly difficult projects. That's the key problem of the LCA project as a whole and not that it was the first fighter project and that we started from Zero. That are just excusess for those who messed it up!!!

Your words of 'wisdom' notwithstanding, I would choose the wisdom of Indian's scientific Adviser for choosing to develop an Indian fighter. Please excuse me for not having much faith in you but choosing to have faith in DRDO. Hope you don't take it personally.

1) LCA MK1 developed with licence produced Elta 2032 radar and Snecma M53-2 or RD93 engines would be in opterational service today!

..and if Nehru had rejected socialism we would have a developed India today ! .....if someone had killed Hitler there would have been no WW2

2) An LCA MK2 version aimed on fixing the problems only (new engine, Elta 2032, weight reduction) and not adding many other new things (additional fuel tanks for IN, new radar, cockpit displays, or avionics), could be inducted way earlier than the end of the decade!

....and LCA MK2 version aimed only on changing the aircraft colour would be inducted even faster !

3) N-LCA navalised by Mikoyan or Dassault, would not face the weight and structural issues, because they have experience with navalising fighters, unlike EADS our current choice!

....ok....if you say so. I will request ADA to take you on-board as an expert Adviser.

4) Since LCA MK2 and MMRCA are meant to jointly replace the Mig 21 fleet and we have to produce certain parts under licence anyway, makes using RBE 2 AESA radar for both types a LOGICAL choice. While indigenous AESAs could be added for later LCA versions or AMCA in a ready and mature stage of our own AESA developments!

Logistics is not ADA responsibility. That is IAF role....looks like IAF failed yet again as per you.