Talks for Su-35, Mi-35 sales to Pakistan are underway: Russian Deputy FM

[illusion8]

Do me a favor, when you quote me ... don't cherry pick from part of 2 lined sentence with a 4 lined explanation ...



Lastly, if you went through my post it had an answer for your point .. so please review it again .. and if you have a point then please do contribute further ...

As I said..except for that single line statement - there's nothing else worthy to discuss - rest are just conjectures and extrapolations of that single line.

 

[abdulbarijan]

As I said..except for that single line statement - there's nothing else worthy to discuss - rest are just conjectures and extrapolations of that single line.

There is one thing though ... you completely glossed over ALL the points that I made regarding your hypothesis/theory whatever ...

But there is one thing though .. that you forgot when you were doing this analysis ... talks for delivery were on with which country ??? --- thats right .. It was Pakistan he was talking about ... The same DFM which you quoted and admitted that his is the only statement worthy to be discussed ... and then we had a PAF officer confirming the talks with Janes ..

So, Like I said before ... the extended use theory of yours, is not really even a theory because it has way too many loopholes as indicated in my previous posts... So while there is talk and analysis of Russia delivering through China ... the end customer in this case however ... is still the PAF ..

 

[Basel]

The capabilities of J11D's Aesa is also not published hence its capability is also not known... There are some news that PAF may be looking for a modified AESA developed for the J20....

Realistically speaking the Italians might also be interested in selling an upgraded version of their AESA. The one that is on offer is for the JF-17. If this is permitted then this would really boost the capabilities of PAF.

Martin baker seats that are being produced by Pakistan would definitely be part of the SU-35...

Why martin baker ejection seats? Russia don't have good ejection seats?

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

Why martin baker ejection seats? Russia don't have good ejection seats?

These seats are manufactured by Pakistan.... However if the Russian's provide some next generation stuff that has been proven then perhaps PAF might be interested.

Remember the F-7's were using the Chinese seats but PAF chose the martin baker ones in them. The same is the case with most of the aircraft today in PAF fleet.

 

[aliyusuf]

Martin baker seats that are being produced by Pakistan would definitely be part of the SU-35...

These seats are manufactured by Pakistan.... However if the Russian's provide some next generation stuff that has been proven then perhaps PAF might be interested.

Remember the F-7's were using the Chinese seats but PAF chose the martin baker ones in them. The same is the case with most of the aircraft today in PAF fleet.

The Russian Zvezda-36 series and newer model of ejection seats which have been installed on the Russian MiGs and Sukhois for the last couple of decades are considered (even by some of the most critical western experts) as being among the most reliable and safest in the world.

A dated link from Flightglobal : Zvezda ejection seat proves its worth - again

 

[illusion8]

There is one thing though ... you completely glossed over ALL the points that I made regarding your hypothesis/theory whatever ...

But there is one thing though .. that you forgot when you were doing this analysis ... talks for delivery were on with which country ??? --- thats right .. It was Pakistan he was talking about ... The same DFM which you quoted and admitted that his is the only statement worthy to be discussed ... and then we had a PAF officer confirming the talks with Janes ..

So, Like I said before ... the extended use theory of yours, is not really even a theory because it has way too many loopholes as indicated in my previous posts... So while there is talk and analysis of Russia delivering through China ... the end customer in this case however ... is still the PAF ..

Yeah..about the PAF officer? I just saw a tweet with no reference no name, I would assume that such a landmark deal if true would carry a wee bit more weight then some random reference.

Good to see that you are back to square one - that is what I was in discussion with oscar about - the "delivery" would have most likely meant russian longtime delivery news to the chinese..which would have been bundled together with posting of the jets in pakistan to guard chinese interests.

You and I and oscar very well know that there haven't been any kind of indication or movement towards pakistan getting some russian jets from both sides - and the DFM statements was out of the blue. One just has that singular statement to base their analysis on. We all are basing our opinions from that singular statement.

 

[VelocuR]

If PAF manages to succeed in acquiring Su-35 and inducts it, then our friends to the east will say, "but the pakis only got the least popular version. Su-30MKI Super Flanker is definitely the better fighter in every respect. I'd much rather be flying a MiG-21bis against a Su-35. Plus J-31 is based on JF-17, which is based on F-7, the worst MiG-21 variant."

Hilarious I second that, let them think that way, we move on.

 

[dave]

Why pakistan go for Su-35 try PAK-FA is more advance. If they offer Su-35 pakistan.
India not going for PAK-FA. India have choice like more Rafeal or F-35

 

[abdulbarijan]

Yeah..about the PAF officer? I just saw a tweet with no reference no name, I would assume that such a landmark deal if true would carry a wee bit more weight then some random reference.

Good to see that you are back to square one - that is what I was in discussion with oscar about - the "delivery" would have most likely meant russian longtime delivery news to the chinese..which would have been bundled together with posting of the jets in pakistan to guard chinese interests.

You and I and oscar very well know that there haven't been any kind of indication or movement towards pakistan getting some russian jets from both sides - and the DFM statements was out of the blue. One just has that singular statement to base their analysis on. We all are basing our opinions from that singular statement.

No mate, the reference is of Janes and an official they quoted ..

Pakistani official confirms Su-35 talks - IHS Jane's 360

So, while talks have been confirmed ... nothing more has been released ... and for someone who has been observing our procurement patterns ... it will most likely get real quiet and they will let things simmer down before something is revealed ...

The fact however remains, that with CPEC and EEZ the need for a jet with longer legs and more payload is there ... and it has to be a 4/4+ gen fighter because of what the IN is fielding and if you look at the MKI with the range and with that the different options of attack the IAF is provided with ...

While India as we know will try to not let Pakistan have this jet and will lobby all that it can to not let this deal happen ... the influence as we know (of India over Russia) is decreasing as the "all weather friends" are not so all weather friends anymore since India is diversifying its suppliers .. On the other hand .. Russian's are also business men and know very well that the Indian market is more or less a cash cow now ... so they will try to milk away all they can ...

Then you have to consider that they are looking for customers of SU-35, and other weapons .. and Pakistan also happens to be a good potential market ... add in the advantages of cooperation the Russians can get being a part of CPEC ..

In the end, the logical conclusion at this point is that the Russians will try to have a win-win at all fronts ... be it the Pakistani, Indian or the Chinese ... so all one can do now is wait to see what unfolds in the future ...

 

[nadeemkhan110]

Why pakistan go for Su-35 try PAK-FA is more advance. If they offer Su-35 pakistan.
India not going for PAK-FA. India have choice like more Rafeal or F-35

India have invested 5 Billion $ in pak FA or T-50 project and Su-35 is almost 5th gen jet like su-35 technology is of 5th generation but not stealth that's why its 4++ gen jet.
and india now wants technology transfer of pak fa but Russia is not ready but Russia is going to create HAL AMCA 5th gen jet for india in india.

 

[majid mehmood]

guys many Indians are posting that this deal cannot complete
so here some points to make them think that this deal is very much possible

1 Indians that it would be rejected by Putin ?
but they forgot when one of prominent Putin aide told that they will sell su 35 to pak so it is easy to say that Putin can agree

2 India would pressure Russia ?
Russia knows that India is diversifying it market and in 10 years it is forecasted that India would imports of arm from Russia would remain 20-30%. one more thing was the case with rd93

3 many told that none senior paf officer chief met together in maks 2015?
of course they could not participate (as it was useless) due to arm embargo which was finished afterward but after removal of arm embargo many senior paf officer even pa chief Raheel went Russia and was presented guard of honor

4 Indians told that no news of confirm sale of mi 35?
news of of draft sending of purchased 4 heli and could be more is confirmed by many people so dont say "no confirm reports of mi 35 to pak"

btw guys u know there are many things but these are the main points to counter any Indian who neglects that SU 35 DEAL TO PAKISTAN
and pls dont take to much notice of my english

 

[VelocuR]

@That Guy @batmannow weird lolzz??

Can you both please stop fighting to avoid ruining this thread ?

 

[araz]

Everything I've said is on topic, and a reply to your extremely off topic remarks.

@batmannow and @That Guy.
Stop bickering like little children . Put the other party on your ignore list for a few days and move on. This has now gone beyond a joke so please stop it.
A

 

[airmarshal]

Unlike many countrymen of mine, I'm not inclined to dismiss the talk of Su35 sale to Pakistan as just hot air. Nor am I buying the argument that this is simply a way to get India to buy more Russian planes. If Russia needed to go down that route, there can be many ways apart from showing this red flag. That would be a clumsy way of doing things & the Russians are certainly not stupid. There is something that might be happening here that is not yet very clear and the surmising happening here does not quite cut it.

Regardless of whether such a sale takes place, I believe that the cold war positioning is now history. This is the clearest indication (the offer itself) of a state of flux that will likely exist for a substantial period of time. We live in interesting times.



F 15 is a heavier fighter, twin engined.

Thank you for a mature and substantial point of view. This is a very interesting time. Who could have thought such re alignment going on in the region only a decade ago!

 

[That Guy]

@batmannow and @That Guy.
Stop bickering like little children . Put the other party on your ignore list for a few days and move on. This has now gone beyond a joke so please stop it.
A

I was merely amusing myself. I apologize if it got out annoying.

@That Guy @batmannow weird lolzz??

Can you both please stop fighting to avoid ruining this thread ?

Again, I was replying out of entertainment, but apologize none the less.