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Talks for Su-35, Mi-35 sales to Pakistan are underway: Russian Deputy FM

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1.russian FGFA prototypes are already in last leg of fininshing there flight testings and sonn wepons intigration phase will commence and the first FGFA are sheduled to be in RSAF by 2018 while 2020 for IAF

2.no russian su-35s are coming for PAF as PAF is in no position to buy them off the shelf let alone pay for there maintainence and spares

as for F-35 well USA has already made a formal offer to sell F-35 to india and is already in talks for that along with o wants them for its IAC-2 EMALS, AAG and E2D/E for indian navy and indian navy also

have some patience :cheers:


OK TT sir whatever you say is right im wrong happy now .... cheers mate :D
Usa offering F-35 , WHEN post a link pls & off course a USA link ?
How soon you will be inducting the PAK FA in Indian air force , pls give a official statement about it ?
 
9614222cd83d7a47a14c69cdbd134d6a.jpg
but you forgot that it was hindoos who floated and still beleve in karma (sansrit=your deeds) and bieng evil short dark yaindoos we know what we are doing so dont worry stay tuned as it was not india that was the agressor ... but lets not go there or we will go of topic .... thread is about Su-35 and fact is pakistan is gettiong none ... but no harm in dreaming :cheers:

I know that SU-30 and MIG-29 are in the world best fighter, simply I was answering to Neoru post
cant say about anyone else but as per current statndards both indian versions of Mig29s/fulcrums and MKI/flankers are considerred to be the best and most leathel of there kind owtside russia :cheers:
 
I can see and smell an immense thick mushroom cloud of smoke across our Eastern borders. :taz::rofl::rofl::rofl:
 
Analysts Skeptical Over Pakistan-Russia Su-35 Negotiations

ISLAMABAD — Analysts are generally skeptical at present of reports Pakistan and Russia are engaged in negotiations for the delivery of a number of Su-35 Flanker E fighter aircraft, though there is a potential requirement for such a heavy fighter.

The reports, first published in Russian media, cited Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov as saying both sides were negotiating for the delivery of an unspecified number of Su-35 jets alongside the Mi-35M "Hind E" helicopter gunships that have recently been agreed upon.

However, no word on any such negotiations was received from the Ministry of Defence Production in Pakistan when asked for comment on the issue. The agency also handles acquisition.

Experts are generally skeptical of any Su-35 being acquired by Pakistan.

Author, analyst and former Australian defense attache to Islamabad, Brian Cloughley, said he "would be most surprised if there were to be any arrangement for provision of Su-35s."

"The Indians would be extremely upset, to the point of a major diplomatic rift," Cloughley said.

Though India is actively seeking to diversify its source of equipment from reliance on Russia, and the latter is seeking a new customer that includes limited defense sales to Pakistan, the Indo-Russian relationship is still very strong as evidenced by the co-development of the next generation PAK-FA stealth aircraft.

Analyst, author and former Pakistani Air Force pilot Kaiser Tufail is also unconvinced at present that negotiations for the Su-35 are actually underway.

"To me it seems more like an offer by the Russians, more than anything else," he said.

Many analysts have considered the current Pakistani plan to carry on investing in the JF-17 Thunder program, and acquire further new or surplus F-16s if possible, to be the optimal way of modernizing its air power as well as reducing combat types. A role for such a heavy fighter as the Su-35 has not generally been envisioned.

However, Tufail says there is a possible need for something in this class on two accounts: diversification and to support naval operations.

The Su-35 "being a twin-engined aircraft with vast range (and endurance), it would help us to have a significant and potent presence in the Arabian Sea, something that the puny, aging Mirage squadron is ill-suited for (as is the JF-17 from the range point of view)," he said. "Given the changing geo-politics and the Chinese investment whose trade terminus is Gwadar, there is definitely going to be a need for a long-range fighter. So essentially, I see it as a guarantor of maritime security as far as the airspace is concerned."

Pakistan has never operated a twin-engine fighter aircraft, but Tufail says this has been a shortcoming.

"This has been a yawning gap in [the air force's] capabilities. These fighters would also allow unhindered patrolling by the naval [long range maritime patrol aircraft], as well as providing top cover to our fleet at sea," he said.

He does not see this as a departure from the established defense posture, but recognition of an existing shortcoming.

"All of this may sound like a sudden switch from continental strategy to a maritime one, but it is high time that we paid serious attention to this aspect in the fast changing geopolitical scenario."

Pakistan's air power over the Arabian Sea already received a boost this month when No. 2 'Minhas' Squadron based in Karachi was re-equipped September 6 with the JF-17 Block II after surrendering its Chengdu F-7P fighters.

Speaking at the time, Tufail said this was overdue: "The re-equipment of [No. 2 'Minhas' Squadron] was due as they had the oldest lot of F-7s. The JF-17 was the obvious replacement."

However, he did not believe it would take over the anti-shipping strike role from the Mirage 5, which he flew during his air force career, even though the JF-17 can carry the C-802A/CSS-N-8 Saccade or the supersonic CM-400AKG.

"This, however, does not necessarily imply that it will immediately take over the maritime attack role. The Mirage-5PA2/3 is still a capable aircraft, though long in the tooth by now. Most likely, the replacement of these Mirages would have a maritime role, so it could be a couple of years before we see a newer capability," he said.

Whether that replacement is the Su-35, however, remains to be seen.
 
but you forgot that it was hindoos who floated and still beleve in karma (sansrit=your deeds) and bieng evil short dark yaindoos we know what we are doing so dont worry stay tuned as it was not india that was the agressor ... but lets not go there or we will go of topic .... thread is about Su-35 and fact is pakistan is gettiong none ... but no harm in dreaming :cheers:


cant say about anyone else but as per current statndards both indian versions of Mig29s/fulcrums and MKI/flankers are considerred to be the best and most leathel of there kind owtside russia :cheers:

I post it in your language of understanding because you don't have telent to understand others. And about the word Karma is from Sanskrit and i don't think Indian owns it.

In many threads i remind you to stick with the topics but your old habit of trolling stopping you. Any way lets back to topic
 
Analysts Skeptical Over Pakistan-Russia Su-35 Negotiations

ISLAMABAD — Analysts are generally skeptical at present of reports Pakistan and Russia are engaged in negotiations for the delivery of a number of Su-35 Flanker E fighter aircraft, though there is a potential requirement for such a heavy fighter.

The reports, first published in Russian media, cited Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov as saying both sides were negotiating for the delivery of an unspecified number of Su-35 jets alongside the Mi-35M "Hind E" helicopter gunships that have recently been agreed upon.

However, no word on any such negotiations was received from the Ministry of Defence Production in Pakistan when asked for comment on the issue. The agency also handles acquisition.

Experts are generally skeptical of any Su-35 being acquired by Pakistan.

Author, analyst and former Australian defense attache to Islamabad, Brian Cloughley, said he "would be most surprised if there were to be any arrangement for provision of Su-35s."

"The Indians would be extremely upset, to the point of a major diplomatic rift," Cloughley said.

Though India is actively seeking to diversify its source of equipment from reliance on Russia, and the latter is seeking a new customer that includes limited defense sales to Pakistan, the Indo-Russian relationship is still very strong as evidenced by the co-development of the next generation PAK-FA stealth aircraft.

Analyst, author and former Pakistani Air Force pilot Kaiser Tufail is also unconvinced at present that negotiations for the Su-35 are actually underway.

"To me it seems more like an offer by the Russians, more than anything else," he said.

Many analysts have considered the current Pakistani plan to carry on investing in the JF-17 Thunder program, and acquire further new or surplus F-16s if possible, to be the optimal way of modernizing its air power as well as reducing combat types. A role for such a heavy fighter as the Su-35 has not generally been envisioned.

However, Tufail says there is a possible need for something in this class on two accounts: diversification and to support naval operations.

The Su-35 "being a twin-engined aircraft with vast range (and endurance), it would help us to have a significant and potent presence in the Arabian Sea, something that the puny, aging Mirage squadron is ill-suited for (as is the JF-17 from the range point of view)," he said. "Given the changing geo-politics and the Chinese investment whose trade terminus is Gwadar, there is definitely going to be a need for a long-range fighter. So essentially, I see it as a guarantor of maritime security as far as the airspace is concerned."

Pakistan has never operated a twin-engine fighter aircraft, but Tufail says this has been a shortcoming.

"This has been a yawning gap in [the air force's] capabilities. These fighters would also allow unhindered patrolling by the naval [long range maritime patrol aircraft], as well as providing top cover to our fleet at sea," he said.

He does not see this as a departure from the established defense posture, but recognition of an existing shortcoming.

"All of this may sound like a sudden switch from continental strategy to a maritime one, but it is high time that we paid serious attention to this aspect in the fast changing geopolitical scenario."

Pakistan's air power over the Arabian Sea already received a boost this month when No. 2 'Minhas' Squadron based in Karachi was re-equipped September 6 with the JF-17 Block II after surrendering its Chengdu F-7P fighters.

Speaking at the time, Tufail said this was overdue: "The re-equipment of [No. 2 'Minhas' Squadron] was due as they had the oldest lot of F-7s. The JF-17 was the obvious replacement."

However, he did not believe it would take over the anti-shipping strike role from the Mirage 5, which he flew during his air force career, even though the JF-17 can carry the C-802A/CSS-N-8 Saccade or the supersonic CM-400AKG.

"This, however, does not necessarily imply that it will immediately take over the maritime attack role. The Mirage-5PA2/3 is still a capable aircraft, though long in the tooth by now. Most likely, the replacement of these Mirages would have a maritime role, so it could be a couple of years before we see a newer capability," he said.

Whether that replacement is the Su-35, however, remains to be seen.
Fake & feared anaalyists ?lolzz
 
Spectre.
On the contrary there is a very big opportunity of war coming up in the region.. It will be triggered by water and I would go out on a limb to say that it is entirely Pakistani stupidity and lack of development of storage facilities which will lead upto it.You can have all the safeguards in the world that you like but one little spark and with the lack of trust between the two countries will result in an exchange with disastrous outcome. This is precisely why it is imperative that the reasons for the mistrust are extinguished now and the stupidities of both neighbours interfering with each others internal matters should stop post haste.
You maybe right about the smoke and mirrors but the problem remains that this policy goes down the drain as soon as some money comes into the coffers of either state. The only reason why things have not gone out of hand is because pakistani economy is in such a dire state that it simply cannot afford to escalate its defence expenditure. As a matter of compromise we have started looking at internal development/ manufacturing/label changing of weapons systems to fulfil our needs . India on the other hand seems outwardly focused on the acquisition from outside.
The Rafale deal served its purpose in preventing access to EU for Pakistani imports. However, the Chinese factor is preventing the acquisition blockade which India wanted to strategically put around Pakistan. Russia is just trying to see whether it can kill 2 birds with one stone by either enticing India into placing an order or selling to pakistan and opening up the market there. The problem for india is that it has a genuine need to replace its Migs but cant find a suitable plane as Rafale, EFT and Gripen NG would all be expensive to acquire and maintain.

Yeah I admit Water is a big pacific sized hole in my argument, I am worried about the same but console myself with the fact that for Water to become condition for War would still require 3/4 decades of time and I would be happily dead.

What India is to Pakistan is China is to India in the upcoming water wars. I expect some sort of massive treaty or organization to take shape post 2020 to reassure downstream nations, AFAIK there is something already in place but it's enforceablity is a concern.

Anyway all stakeholders will have to sit on the table and work out the details if they don't want the shit to hit the fan. And I guess leaders would probably do that. We humans are inherently lazy, just need a kick on the butt to get get moving.

Regarding trust Issues - yeah the deficit over there is problamatic but again I don't know how much is for show and how much of that trust deficit is real. I expected 26/11 to get some reaction from Indians but that didn't happen - reason loads of forces working behind the scenes to ensure trust deficit does not become a Spark that blows the whole Keg of Nuclear Explosives. You might be right though - current govt is bit reactionary - ride it out yeah?

Regarding blocking of exports and woes facing IAF and PAF - Meh! These is just how the game is played. Indians numerical requirement is over-blown. 40+ squadrons aren't going to help us neither can we afford so many modern jets, if we are fighting against full strength China and Pakistan simultaneously might as well wave the white flag now or push the N - Button because no way in hell we are gonna come up one top without Uncle Sam and Ivan behind us. so 20/30/40/50 I believe are just arbitrary numbers intended to serve as deterrent.

If a poser like me could come up with above then I am sure Chinese and Pakistanis have arrived at a similar conclusion, deterrent works if the other sides believes it will work.

So a better job would be to downsize and modernize our Air Force which is exactly what is being done, LCA is meant for replacement to Migs and if it works I would break a coconut or two at my local temple if it doesn't no biggie.

For Pakistan the only concern should be Talibs and likes unless it wants to take a another pass at Kashmir, India is thoroughly shackled by Nuclear deterrent.

P.S. Again I would like to re-emphasize Water is the only issue in which throws all my arguments into bin if we don't arrive at a mutually beneficial or atleast satisfactory solution for down stream countries.
 
So you mean to say Pakistan have only 18 F16?. By the way our relationship with US is very deep and they always impose sanction on us and we always broke that:sarcastic:.



Read post # 628 again

Care to explain the Bold part
 
google what ??

"they always impose sanction on us and we always broke that"

Do you understand English

Do you?

They always restricted us in case of PAF and we always use our assets as we like to use. (I didn't know that Indian IQ is that much low to understand this history of PAF)
 
Do you?

They always restricted us in case of PAF and we always use our assets as we like to use. (I didn't know that Indian IQ is that much low to understand this history of PAF)

Read the line "they always impose sanction on us and we always broke that" Does it make any sense

"They always restricted us in case of PAF" Restrict us in case of PAF what does it means

"we always use our assets as we like to use." Now which assets ?? as we like to use OR whatever way we would like to use

IQ will come after but let me first let me understand you and your mind
 
Read the line "they always impose sanction on us and we always broke that" Does it make any sense

"They always restricted us in case of PAF" Restrict us in case of PAF what does it means

"we always use our assets as we like to use." Now which assets ?? as we like to use OR whatever way we would like to use

IQ will come after but let me first let me understand you and your mind
He is trying to say that usofa imposed sanctions on us but paf came back strongly with the jf 17 project
 
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