Taliban restart secret talks with Afghanistan in Qatar: report

[Khan_21]

If that's your experience and how you view things, its fine we all have our own views. When your best friend doesn't give you money to buy drugs, it doesn't mean he is stingy (kanjoos) but he is just looking out for you because he knows you will harm yourself even though at the time we might see it as being a bad friend. Its all a matter of perspective.

I can't deny that there might be a sense of jealousy or better known in Pashto as "Turburwali". Jealousy is a destructive trait and negative energy which is bad for you but wanting to be as good as your brother in good things in life is healthy. Islam encourages competition in good deeds. If Pashtuns in Pakistan prosper due to more stability or whatever other reason, it should serve as motivation for Afghan pashtuns to better themselves. We can learn from each other.

I don't think there is much difference between an Urban pashtun from Afghanistan and Pakistan except a Pakistani Pashtun might use more urdu/english words and an Afghan Pashtun use more farsi/english words. Some differences are bound to appear due to living in different states and going through different schools systems and different sense of nationhood. A rural and uneducated pashtun from KPK will have much more in common with a rural and uneducated Pashtun from Afghanistan than with a fellow Urban Pakistani Pashtun. On the surface they might say Zindabad Afghanistan or Pakistan but their world view will be quite similar. The same goes for a religious Pashtun.

Durand LIne is all but accepted in name because as you say Afghans and Pakistanis will need visas to travel now and also Afghanistan is too weak to do anything about it. I think there should be a referrendum in Pashtun areas of Pakistan and Afghanistan and let's see what majority of Pashtuns have to say about it. I am certain Pakistani Pashtuns would vote to recognise Durand Line and the Afghan government should respect their wishes. It will also mean Afghanistan can't be blamed in the future by Pashtuns in Pakistan for accepting Durand if its done with their consent and free will.

Pashtuns on our side live mostly in urban areas and the largest pashtun speaking city in the world happens to be Karachi . So there are alot of differences. Pashtuns on our side have matured really fast . Elected the best available party to rule the province (something afghanistan needs to learn ) .Before PTI came to power KPK had little to boost. Now Peshawer is getting nominated for beatification awards , Police is the best in country , Literacy rate is rivaling Punjab , Health sector has improved alot , Building more dams than any province in the country , great tourism initiatives and countless projects to count. Afghan pashtuns have yet to come out of the warlord/tribal mentality. Given there are alot of those types in us too but that is changing very fast here .

Afghan pashtuns despite being the largest ethnicity are sidelined. Almost all your talk shows are in dari . Your president prefers to speak in dari rather than Pashto. Afghans are very naive. They are always used by other people for their own benefits and available for hire to to the highest bidder . Then there are people like A-team who are detached from reality and thinks US presence is a blessing for the country

 

[pakistani342]

If that's your experience and how you view things, its fine we all have our own views. When your best friend doesn't give you money to buy drugs, it doesn't mean he is stingy (kanjoos) but he is just looking out for you because he knows you will harm yourself even though at the time we might see it as being a bad friend. Its all a matter of perspective.

I can't deny that there might be a sense of jealousy or better known in Pashto as "Turburwali". Jealousy is a destructive trait and negative energy which is bad for you but wanting to be as good as your brother in good things in life is healthy. Islam encourages competition in good deeds. If Pashtuns in Pakistan prosper due to more stability or whatever other reason, it should serve as motivation for Afghan pashtuns to better themselves. We can learn from each other.

I don't think there is much difference between an Urban pashtun from Afghanistan and Pakistan except a Pakistani Pashtun might use more urdu/english words and an Afghan Pashtun use more farsi/english words. Some differences are bound to appear due to living in different states and going through different schools systems and different sense of nationhood. A rural and uneducated pashtun from KPK will have much more in common with a rural and uneducated Pashtun from Afghanistan than with a fellow Urban Pakistani Pashtun. On the surface they might say Zindabad Afghanistan or Pakistan but their world view will be quite similar. The same goes for a religious Pashtun.

Durand LIne is all but accepted in name because as you say Afghans and Pakistanis will need visas to travel now and also Afghanistan is too weak to do anything about it. I think there should be a referrendum in Pashtun areas of Pakistan and Afghanistan and let's see what majority of Pashtuns have to say about it. I am certain Pakistani Pashtuns would vote to recognise Durand Line and the Afghan government should respect their wishes. It will also mean Afghanistan can't be blamed in the future by Pashtuns in Pakistan for accepting Durand if its done with their consent and free will.

@Khan_21

I can't speak too much for the elites but the Pakhtun middle and lower classes in Pakistan and Afghanistan in my personal experience have diverged. I'll speak on one subject that I've studied. If you look at any top US school: you will find a proportional representation of Pakistani Pashtuns studying hard sciences, computer science mathematics and engineering subjects -- Afghans, even the ones from the Diaspora are missing at least in the US. Afghans seem to focus on subjects such as Law, history, International Relations, etc.

My hypothesis is that the Pakistani Pakhtuns have taken up Pakistaniyat which values the study of hard sciences over softer subjects. This also may explain the absence of any Engineering, Hard Science schools of note in Afghanistan and the seeming lack of priority to build them.

.

 

[Khan_21]

@Khan_21

I can't speak too much for the elites but the Pakhtun middle and lower classes in Pakistan and Afghanistan in my personal experience have diverged. I'll speak on one subject that I've studied. If you look at any top US school: you will find a proportional representation of Pakistani Pashtuns studying hard sciences, computer science mathematics and engineering subjects -- Afghans, even the ones from the Diaspora are missing at least in the US. Afghans seem to focus on subjects such as Law, history, International Relations, etc.

My hypothesis is that the Pakistani Pakhtuns have taken up Pakistaniyat which values the study of hard sciences over softer subjects. This also may explain the absence of any Engineering, Hard Science schools of note in Afghanistan and the seeming lack of priority to build them.

.

There are several reasons for that . One of them is presence of great engineering schools like you mentioned .

- UET Peshawer and Taxila
- Comsats
- GIK

These are QS top 700 ranked universities present in Khyber Pukhtunkwah . Outside of KP then there are Schools like NUST whose engineering is ranked in top 200 worldwide has a sizeable Pashtun population . Then There are alot of Pashtuns in PIEAS which is one of the best places if you want to study nuclear engineering .

Pakistani parents usually want their child to go into Engineering , Math , Physics , Architecture , IT .

In my class in Malaysia (MBA in investment Banking ) there are no afghans . But found alot of afghans studying for subjects which are relatively easier like Sociology , Law . Alot of them are in Hospitality and tourism . So the trends differ alot .

I get called Fake Pashtun by Afghan friends because I have to speak in Urdu with my urdu speaking friends and dress up quite differently to them . Another thing i noticed in them is they bitch and moan alot. They rant alot about living in Kuala lumpur or Singapore and how the weather is mild here and cold in Kabul or how everything is boring here and amazing back in Afghanistan .

 

[MomandKhan]

All have own experiences, but as far as my experiences goes for Afghans two careers matters. Doctor or Engeener. Everyone want's to be doctor or engeener - Afghanistan or outside.

 

[Shapur]

Afghan pashtuns despite being the largest ethnicity are sidelined. Almost all your talk shows are in dari . Your president prefers to speak in dari rather than Pashto. Afghans are very naive. They are always used by other people for their own benefits and available for hire to to the highest bidder . Then there are people like A-team who are detached from reality and thinks US presence is a blessing for the country

I don't think you are familiar with Afghan society because When you see Dari speakers it doesn't mean automatically they are non Pashtuns. Many pashtuns are bilingual in Dari and Pashto and some have pashtuns can only speak Dari due to living among Dari speakers but they still identify as Afghan/Pashtun and would always have the interests of Pashtuns at heart. So whenever you see someone speaking Dari from Afghanistan, don't assume them to be farsiwan/Tajik. They could be Baloch, Pashtun, Nuristani, Uzbek, Pashai etc. There are millions of Dari speaking Pashtuns in Afghanistan especially in Kabul city, Herat and all over western and northern Afghanistan. The president speaks in both languages and depending on audience, he will speak Dari or pashto.

Dari serves as the lingua franca of Afghanistan due to to historical reasons. Even Pakistan was using Farsi till 70s I believe and Farsi was considered as the national language of Pakistan but Urdu was chosen because most Pakistanis are Indics so it would be easier for their to transition to an Indic language like Urdu. Things are slowly changing though as Pashtuns of Afghanistan become more urbanized and literacy rate increases. Afghanistan's schools curriculum is already in Pashto in Pashtun majority areas. Our national anthem is in Pashto, our bank notes have Pashto written on them, all major national symbols are in Pashto.

I don't know which channels you are watching but I can name at least 15 pashto TV channels from Afghanistan and their number is increasing day by day. Dari programmes will always have more viewers because many Pashtuns in bilingual in pashto and Dari and because other ethnicities such as uzbeks also use Dari as their second language.

 

[Cadillac]

Yes, no condemnation by the Afghans for meeting with the Mollahs this time either. I wonder why there is no condemnation of Qatar at allowing these Mollahs to travel unrestricted and stay in 5 star hotels?

There is no condemnation because ultimately there has to be a political solution and the Afghan government has been wanting to resolve the conflict through negotiations. Pakistan has been flatly denying that Taliban are sheltered on its soil and its long-standing collusion with Taliban by providing it material support and sanctuary to continue their insurgency. There is a difference. It has also allowed and manipulated the situation by seeking to continue blood-shed and instability. This an achievement to negotiate with Taliban where Pakistan's direct influence is significantly curtailed. Why condemnation? Why are you sarcastic when you know well the game Pakistan is playing.

 

[TMA]

Well these are Terrorists according to Afghanistan (now you know the US does not recognize the Taliban as terrorists strangely): so they should be arrested and handed over to Afghanistan right?

Why can Taliban travel feely to Iran, Dubai and Qatar -- OK Pakistan is Bad Bad Bad but how is it that Mollah Mansoor's family lives in Iran freely and there are no demands by Afghanistan on Iran to expel them.

Why is no noise raised by Afghanistan to arrest these guys when they visit the Gulf on fund raising trips or "dirty-pleasure-trips"?

I also wonder how many Afghans KSA, Qatar, Dubai have sheltered as refugees.

I have a hypothesis: there is inherent hared for Pakistanis in the Afghan psyche and hence the shrill cries.

You nailed it! I just hope other Pakistanis can see this and act accordingly.

If that's your experience and how you view things, its fine we all have our own views. When your best friend doesn't give you money to buy drugs, it doesn't mean he is stingy (kanjoos) but he is just looking out for you because he knows you will harm yourself even though at the time we might see it as being a bad friend. Its all a matter of perspective.

I can't deny that there might be a sense of jealousy or better known in Pashto as "Turburwali". Jealousy is a destructive trait and negative energy which is bad for you but wanting to be as good as your brother in good things in life is healthy. Islam encourages competition in good deeds. If Pashtuns in Pakistan prosper due to more stability or whatever other reason, it should serve as motivation for Afghan pashtuns to better themselves. We can learn from each other.

I don't think there is much difference between an Urban pashtun from Afghanistan and Pakistan except a Pakistani Pashtun might use more urdu/english words and an Afghan Pashtun use more farsi/english words. Some differences are bound to appear due to living in different states and going through different schools systems and different sense of nationhood. A rural and uneducated pashtun from KPK will have much more in common with a rural and uneducated Pashtun from Afghanistan than with a fellow Urban Pakistani Pashtun. On the surface they might say Zindabad Afghanistan or Pakistan but their world view will be quite similar. The same goes for a religious Pashtun.

Durand LIne is all but accepted in name because as you say Afghans and Pakistanis will need visas to travel now and also Afghanistan is too weak to do anything about it. I think there should be a referrendum in Pashtun areas of Pakistan and Afghanistan and let's see what majority of Pashtuns have to say about it. I am certain Pakistani Pashtuns would vote to recognise Durand Line and the Afghan government should respect their wishes. It will also mean Afghanistan can't be blamed in the future by Pashtuns in Pakistan for accepting Durand if its done with their consent and free will.

Referendum! Before one can even consider this, NATO must leave and Bharati machinations in Afghanistan must stop.

And even if the above does happen how will one ensure that only Pahstuns vote? Given Afghanistan's treachery in the past, what assurances does Pakistan have that Afghanistan will not fudge her votes?

Besides the vast majority of Pakistanis do not want referendum. They want COMPLETE and UTTER acceptance of Pakistan- this is non-negotiable! To even attempt to raise this issue is not acceptable and insulting.

Get over it please. Please swallow the visceral jealousy. (I am not speaking personally at you but to Afghanistan as a nation).