Tactical nuclear missiles not a very smart idea

[illusion8]

Islamic radicalism is due to 1. Afghan jihad and 2. American invasion of Afghanistan??.

No other reason for radical islam other than those two?. ...another below average author.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Prahaar (Strike in Sanskrit) India's Solid-Fuel Surface-to-Surface Guided Short-range Tactical Ballistic Missile

But first things first: I had bravely predicted that the Obama-Nawaz meeting would last for no more than thirty minutes. It went on for two hours…which means egg on my face and the cup of humility in my hands. Predicting timelines in advance is always a silly undertaking.

The major point remains. The US is a super-duper power. That is still no reason for Pakistani leaders to think that they become baptised in holy water when they go on a pilgrimage there. Easy does it. When will we learn this and when will we cut the hyperbole?

The problem is that we measure everything by an Indian yardstick. Any US-Indian understanding gives us the shivers. More than the US it is India that we should learn to take more calmly. The US feting an Indian prime minister should not mean the end of the world for us. India has its own trajectory to follow and we ours. Seeing everything through an Indian prism scarcely enhances our standing. Yet day in and day out our leaders, both civil and military, keep raising the bogey of an Indian threat.

One of the good things to come from the 1971 war – which we lost and which led to the severance of East Pakistan – was our turning towards the Arab and Muslim world under Zulfikar Ali Bhutto. For all the years that he was in power, India was off our radar screens. And we forgot about Kashmir, which was the subtle understanding at Simla. Indeed, for close to 16 years – right until the Kashmir uprising in 1989 – we never raised the subject anywhere.

It was India mismanaging its part of Kashmir, subverting the election process there and stoking the fires of resentment, which provoked the Kashmiris to rise against Indian rule. Had that revolt remained an indigenous affair it would have worked to the advantage of both the Kashmiri people and of Pakistan. But we – by which is meant the higher school of ideological policy, otherwise known as the ISI – had to step in where angels would have exercised greater caution.

It seemed a brilliant idea at the time, tying down umpteen Indian divisions in Indian-held Kashmir. But it has backfired since then, tarring Pakistan with the brush of cross-border terrorism.

What poisoned gifts have we not received from that wellspring of things unintended called the Afghan ‘jihad’? Misplaced triumphalism corrupted the thinking of an entire generation of our military men who, forgetting the American Stingers and the unending stream of dollars channelled through the good offices of the CIA and Saudi intelligence, were seduced by the thought that it was the power of Islam, the power of faith, which had driven the Soviets from the killing fields of Afghanistan.

Nor was that all…they chose to turn faith – or blind belief – into a defining principle of foreign and defence policy. From the cauldron of such thinking arose the doctrine of Kashmir ‘jihad’ – an idea whose time is over but whose vestiges or lingering traces remain in the patronage or indulgence still extended to non-state organisations ostensibly devoted to the liberation of Kashmir.

Kashmir cannot be liberated by arms. This is the overwhelming lesson of our accident-prone history. A strong and prosperous Pakistan, firmly set on the path of development, home to all that is good and uplifting in human thought and endeavour, can be as the North Star to Kashmiri hopes and aspirations. This is what we should aim at. The problem of Taiwan will not be settled overnight. We need to take a similar long-term view of Kashmir.

The lesson of Syria and Iraq, and that of Libya and Afghanistan, is that the meek or the defenceless do not inherit the earth. I recently attended a conference in Hong Kong and it was an eye-opening experience to see a delegate from Nepal and a few from Bangladesh openly and bitterly critical of Indian diktat and interference. With India yet to reach that level of maturity where it stops throwing its weight around vis-à-vis its neighbours, Pakistan cannot afford to lower its guard.

But this awareness is one thing. Paranoia is an altogether different commodity. Our army and air force, not to mention the navy, are enough to deter any notion of aggression – and this remains true even if a third of the army is now employed on the western marches in the war against so-called radical Islamism – an offshoot of: 1) the Afghan ‘jihad’; and 2) the American invasion of Afghanistan.

Without the Americans blundering into Afghanistan, especially the manner in which they went about it, we would still have had our extremism problem. The dragon’s teeth were scattered long ago. But the Americans made it infinitely worse.

I have gone off on a tangent. Despite all current preoccupations, including the military’s engagement along the Durand Line, Pakistan has strength enough to deter any aggression. And our nukes, what are they for? Aren’t they enough of a deterrent?

But if we say, as our generals do, that our strategic nuke capability is still not enough of a deterrent to deter an Indian conventional attack, then it either means that we are dealing with insanity or that our strategic nukes are so useless that they were best kept on a desert island.

This entire thesis rests on a frightening premise. It suggests, first, that India, despite our strategic nukes, can still launch a conventional attack and that to stop that we need smaller nukes – artillery batteries firing short-range nuclear-tipped missiles to stop Indian tanks from overwhelming our defences.

What kind of alarmism is this? If tactical nuclear missiles are the only defence against an Indian tank advance then the first thing we should be doing is disbanding the 1st and 6th armoured divisions – for we are already implying that they won’t be enough to stop an Indian attack. And when we deploy those missiles wouldn’t the Indians follow suit? Then wouldn’t we need more missiles to pre-empt an Indian second nuclear attack, and a third and so on?

This is a slippery path and it has no end. During the cold war the Americans and the Russians tried to match each other bomb for bomb and missile for missile – until they reached the point where each side could destroy not just themselves but the entire planet ten times over. India and Pakistan currently have the capability to destroy each other completely. Once a nuclear exchange starts nothing will be left – not Karachi, Lahore and Islamabad, not Bombay, Calcutta and Delhi. So what are our warriors – from both sides – talking about?

Forget about what the Americans are saying or what their concerns are. We should have the sense to think this through ourselves. India and Pakistan are more than self-sufficient in poverty, people, open-air latrines – incidentally, the largest in the world – tanks and nuclear armaments. Just as they don’t need more poverty they for sure don’t need more nuke bombs and missiles, whatever the fancy doctrines fuelling such crazy notions.

Tailpiece: But all is not grim and dark. The made-to-order survey outfits – Pildat funded by American money and Gallup Pakistan funded by God knows who – can always be depended upon to lighten the public mood. Their surveys, as the initiated know all too well, are largely exercises in unrestrained comedy. The latest Pildat survey puts Nawaz Sharif’s and Shahbaz Sharif’s popularity at near Hosni Mubarak levels. No wonder it has excited laughter far and wide.

Tactical nuclear missiles not a very smart idea - Ayaz Amir

I guess the heat Pakistanis are really feeling the heat from the US for their own TNW chest-thumping and, as always, the immediate response it "but look, evil India has the same".

Prahaar is being developed more with a tactical concept in mind to fill the gap between the 300KM Brahmos and 70km SMERCH/PINAKA MBRLS for the artillery regiment.

 

[Psychic]

Pakistani town of Kasur with population of 300,000 is just 2 kms from Indian border with just plain fields in between. Wont take India tanks 15 min to reach from Khem Karan. Once India captures this town can Pakistan use tactical nuclear weapon on this town.

Indian planners thought of the same in 65 and lost Khem Karan.
Bhai sahab your enemy is not toothless. PA planners have already decided to take the war into India and they may attempt a pre-emptive attack in case of a war. The problem with you people is that you never think about a possible Pakistani offensive before giving verdicts about sucess of future Indian offensives.
Besides attacking Punjab is of low significance as compared to attacking Thar which practically cuts Pakistan into two....That is what your strike corps trained for in various war games and exercises and that is where Indian forces enjoy superiority over Pakistani forces - in desert areas.

 

[Spectre]

Indian planners thought of the same in 65 and lost Khem Karan.
Bhai sahab your enemy is not toothless. PA planners have already decided to take the war into India and they may attempt a pre-emptive attack in case of a war. The problem with you people is that you never think about a possible Pakistani offensive before giving verdicts about sucess of future Indian offensives.
Besides attacking Punjab is of low significance as compared to attacking Thar which practically cuts Pakistan into two....That is what your strike corps trained for in various war games and exercises and that is where Indian forces enjoy superiority over Pakistani forces - in desert areas.

General rule of the thumb is that the weakness is not weakness if everyone is aware of that weakness.

The Gap in Thar is so obvious an invitation that it has to be a trap. I am sure IA has discounted this.

 

[Maarkhoor]

India has modified its strategy of Cold Start. Instead of capturing territory in Thar desert, India will attack Pakistan in populated areas of Punjab. This way if Pakistan uses tactical nuclear weapons they will kill more Pakistanis than Indians.

And you are the policy maker for Indian army, even u don't have basic knowledge of tactical nuclear weapons. A sub kiloton or .5 kt nuclear devise radios will be under one square KM means blast radios is much lower and in Punjab Lahore and Sialkot borders have enough distance from population that these weapons would nit effect civilians and even these weapons are clean nuclear devices producing very less nuclear fallout.

 

[Maarkhoor]

Forget 1965. India has become far more powerful as compared to Pakistan. Most of Indian corps are based in Punjab.


Town is just 2 kms from border. And tanks will be spread out. There will be no way Pakistan can target Indian tanks without killing its own citizens.

Who told u we just wait n watch as soon as we spoted with respect where Nasr strike either in Pakistan or In India we will roast divisions of your army.

 

[Psychic]

India has become far more powerful as compared to Pakistan. Most of Indian corps are based in Punjab.

Did you even read my entire post?
It's not entirely about being "powerful ". Egyptians thought the same in 67.

I hope that Indian commanders underestimate us just like you, but I don't think they do.

Bye bye.

 

[silent hawk]

India has modified its strategy of Cold Start. Instead of capturing territory in Thar desert, India will attack Pakistan in populated areas of Punjab. This way if Pakistan uses tactical nuclear weapons they will kill more Pakistanis than Indians.

AoA
Very useful tactical weapons that are forcing India to make Strategic changes.
Regards

 

[ThaniOruvan]

Claiming PA is as powerful as IA is funny.
There is no parity at all, at any level.
Even with tactical nukes PA will be able to destroy 7-8 tanks per missile at a time.
Do you know the total count of tanks owned by IA ?
And, using nukes would invite retaliatory massive strikes from India, we have made the doctrine and policy clear.
Is Pakistan ready for that ? I don't think Pakistan planners will put the whole state to gamble for claiming a relatively
smaller piece of land. And for India, IA might attack only in case of terrorist attacks coordinated by Pakistanis.
Other than that India simply has no reason for war with Pakistan. Do you think India will launch strikes to take back Pakistan Occupied Kashmir ? No !
Another way of punishing any aggression is discrediting Indus Water Treaty. What can Pakistan do if India cut water flow ?
Again your leadership will start shouting with nukes which will initiate step 1 (as mentioned above) again.
Instead of being in a perpetual loop of hatred it is better that both parties use common sense.

 

[Daghalodi]

Claiming PA is as powerful as IA is funny.
There is no parity at all, at any level.
Even with tactical nukes PA will be able to destroy 7-8 tanks per missile at a time.
Do you know the total count of tanks owned by IA ?
And, using nukes would invite retaliatory massive strikes from India, we have made the doctrine and policy clear.
Is Pakistan ready for that ? I don't think Pakistan planners will put the whole state to gamble for claiming a relatively
smaller piece of land. And for India, IA might attack only in case of terrorist attacks coordinated by Pakistanis.
Other than that India simply has no reason for war with Pakistan. Do you think India will launch strikes to take back Pakistan Occupied Kashmir ? No !
Another way of punishing any aggression is discrediting Indus Water Treaty. What can Pakistan do if India cut water flow ?
Again your leadership will start shouting with nukes which will initiate step 1 (as mentioned above) again.
Instead of being in a perpetual loop of hatred it is better that both parties use common sense.

I don't think pakistani nukes are made to blast of indian tanks.Pakistan has made nukes to blow off indian cities and if Pakistan ever goes nuclear its going to empty its nuclear arsenal in India before it goes down. We know we will be wiped off but not before we blast bhartis back to stoneages.

 

[I M Sikander]

India has modified its strategy of Cold Start. Instead of capturing territory in Thar desert, India will attack Pakistan in populated areas of Punjab. This way if Pakistan uses tactical nuclear weapons they will kill more Pakistanis than Indians.

And you think Pakistan will sit idlr and let india bomb our major cities. Vow amazing dude.

 

[I M Sikander]

Claiming PA is as powerful as IA is funny.
There is no parity at all, at any level.
Even with tactical nukes PA will be able to destroy 7-8 tanks per missile at a time.
Do you know the total count of tanks owned by IA ?
And, using nukes would invite retaliatory massive strikes from India, we have made the doctrine and policy clear.
Is Pakistan ready for that ? I don't think Pakistan planners will put the whole state to gamble for claiming a relatively
smaller piece of land. And .

Which idiot told you that we will use TNW to destroy indian tanks.
We Have have gun ships and anti tank missiles for that.

And mind you dear, no one cares a damn about indian nuclear weapons in pakistan. No Pakistani is afraid of them, so stop giving the threats of nuclear retaliations, we know what you can do.and you should also be clear, what we are also capable of.

 

[Basel]

Kid when India goes for MAD do you think they won't take out your launching capabilities??? well yess not 100% but enough to let india Survive a nuke war... and please refrain from using "cowards" and so...

How you will find out 2nd strike launching capabilities??? Pakistanis are not stupid, when we say MAD assured it means we have taken all measures taking capabilities of enemy.

 

[I M Sikander]

Forget 1965. India has become far more powerful as compared to Pakistan. Most of Indian corps are based in Punjab.


Town is just 2 kms from border. And tanks will be spread out. There will be no way Pakistan can target Indian tanks without killing its own citizens.

Baita aap pogo daikho.

Military strategy isnt your area. Your post shows your mental immaturity.

 

[$@rJen]

How you will find out 2nd strike launching capabilities??? Pakistanis are not stupid, when we say MAD assured it means we have taken all measures taking capabilities of enemy.

You don't have a second strike capability.. And read my line carefully i clealy mentioned... not 100% will be destroyed but enough to let India survive a war