T-84 oplot M fails testing what now for the army, in terms of tanks?

[Beta-Fighter]

I also heard in a TV program that Oplot M is very good for cold condition but it will be failure in hot conditions as it is not built for those conditions

During Ukraine crisis some western media was talking about engagement of Ukrainian Oplot-M equipped units Vs Russian Armor and it was said that earlier one got beaten in battle due to unknown reasons, is it true??

I don't think so , Both tank is based on T -72 platforms. T-90MS and T-84 M.

The difference is who will make the better Armour. Most of Western Media is a part of information warfare.

The irony is that the AK-1 performed better than the OPLOT M and MBT 3000 in almost all comparative trials. They need something better than that but there seems nothing in sight. I tell u the 90MS will fail so miserably its not even funny. It has serious flaws in engine transmission and FCS system is pretty average at best. It even lacks a proper hunter killer system.

T-90 initially was failed but later modified to meet Indian hot condition requirement, San A/c it heated up the equipment in hot conditions , but after A/c was fitted it working perfectly.

the reason Arjun defeated the T-90 /T84 M / T-72 etc, T-series cant shoot the target while on the moving , Arjun is designed to destroyed the moving target while on the high speed also.

As already posted by me, IMO only reason could be the price.

Understand Al-Khalid II would cost about $5-million. If we can get T-84 Oplot M for about $3.5-million per unit with similar capability; an Armoured Div with about 300 tanks results in saving out about $450-million. Lot of bucks for a cash starved country. I can't come up with any other logical explanation.

But what the use , IA said 50 T Arjun is too heavy for equipment's to carry and for plains and channels across Punjab field.

that's why they field Arjun only in Raj sector, why PAK is going to 50 + ton tank then?

 

[Tipu7]

The irony is that the AK-1 performed better than the OPLOT M and MBT 3000 in almost all comparative trials. They need something better than that but there seems nothing in sight. I tell u the 90MS will fail so miserably its not even funny. It has serious flaws in engine transmission and FCS system is pretty average at best. It even lacks a proper hunter killer system.

Hence it can be deduced that no NEW tank is coming as it will fail to meet our future requirement. But surprisingly India is continuously producing T90S, and now ready to go for T90MS.......... are Pakistani tank criteria so high that a top Russian machine fail to give appropriate results?
320 T80UD, almost 600 AK1 by 2017 ........... its not a handsome score ........... we need to gear up our production capabilities if NO more tank is coming. AK2 project must not suffer from slow production just like AK1 suffered.....
By the way, if we are retiring all old Type59,69,85 then it means there is room for almost 1000 tanks........... can we fill it up by AK series alone???

 

[Signalian]

^^

I say bring in more T-80 from Russian reserves. Customize them to UD standards.

 

[In arduis fidelis]

What more are they exactly looking for?

My best guess!!

 

[Dazzler]

I don't think so , Both tank is based on T -72 platforms. T-90MS and T-84 M.

The difference is who will make the better Armour. Most of Western Media is a part of information warfare.


T-90MS initially was failed but later modified to meet Indian hot condition requirement, San A/c it heated up the equipment in hot conditions , but after A/c was fitted it working perfectly.

the reason Arjun defeated the T-90 /T84 M / T-72 etc, T-series cant shoot the target while on the moving , Arjun is designed to destroyed the moving target while on the high speed also.


But what the use , IA said 50 T Arjun is too heavy for equipment's to carry and for plains and channels across Punjab field.

that's why they field Arjun only in Raj sector, why PAK is going to 50 + ton tank then?

That's a good laugh..thanks mate

At least learn the difference and read a little you save yourself from embarrassment.

 

[Beta-Fighter]

That's a good laugh..thanks mate

At least learn the difference and read a little you save yourself from embarrassment.

In 2001 India bought T-90S and 2006 India bought T-90M. And their is another full length debate of modified T-90 M for India and its Hot conditions. Someone cant understand difference between S and modified M ver for Indian conditions. Which you are experiencing in Oplot now is something India already experienced in 2001 and that's why worked on it and get M versions.

please in simple terms which is superior? AK-1 or T84 OPLOT? If they fight with each other who will win ? don't try to give diplomatic answer. with if and buts , In India Arjun beat T-90 in desert conditions.

 

[Signalian]

^^

who will win depends upon many factors like strategy, operational execution, force multipliers, intelligence, support such as artillery and air cover, logistics and many other constraints. a one on one is very rare.

 

[Quwa]

The irony is that the AK-1 performed better than the OPLOT M and MBT 3000 in almost all comparative trials. They need something better than that but there seems nothing in sight. I tell u the 90MS will fail so miserably its not even funny. It has serious flaws in engine transmission and FCS system is pretty average at best. It even lacks a proper hunter killer system.

Based on what you're saying, it sounds like the army would need to engage beyond China and Ukraine. And that's costlier. Altay will be $6-7mn per unit, K2 was apparently $8mn in 2009. The army's best bet would be to develop a new platform with the aim of striking the right balance between performance and cost. The days of <$5mn tanks are over, IMHO

 

[Dazzler]

Based on what you're saying, it sounds like the army would need to engage beyond China and Ukraine. And that's costlier. Altay will be $6-7mn per unit, K2 was apparently $8mn in 2009. The army's best bet would be to develop a new platform with the aim of striking the right balance between performance and cost. The days of <$5mn tanks are over, IMHO

Thar desert doesn't allow mbts over 55 tons. Altay is a long way to go. Its too expensive and is not fit for our deserts where most battle will take place. K2 will cost us an arm and leg to buy and both pairs in maintenance. At 9$ mill a pop, good lucj with that. Oplot is still an option if problems are addressed and a good deal is offered.
MBT 3000 was a disappointment as it brought nothing new to the table as I mentioned in my earlier posts. It was just a glorified mbt 2000 with digital interior and some minor improvements.

 

[Basel]

I don't think so , Both tank is based on T -72 platforms. T-90MS and T-84 M.

The difference is who will make the better Armour. Most of Western Media is a part of information warfare.


T-90 initially was failed but later modified to meet Indian hot condition requirement, San A/c it heated up the equipment in hot conditions , but after A/c was fitted it working perfectly.

the reason Arjun defeated the T-90 /T84 M / T-72 etc, T-series cant shoot the target while on the moving , Arjun is designed to destroyed the moving target while on the high speed also.


But what the use , IA said 50 T Arjun is too heavy for equipment's to carry and for plains and channels across Punjab field.

that's why they field Arjun only in Raj sector, why PAK is going to 50 + ton tank then?

T-84 Oplot-M is based on T-80 not T-72, both are different tanks.

 

[cabatli_53]

Thar desert doesn't allow mbts over 55 tons. Altay is a long way to go. Its too expensive and is not fit for our deserts where most battle will take place. K2 will cost us an arm and leg to buy and both pairs in maintenance. At 9$ mill a pop, good lucj with that. Oplot is still an option if problems are addressed and a good deal is offered.
MBT 3000 was a disappointment as it brought nothing new to the table as I mentioned in my earlier posts. It was just a glorified mbt 2000 with digital interior and some minor improvements.

I think It is correct time to take a long road to develop a superior ~55 tonnes Pakistani MBT based on Altay experiences of Turkish engineers. We benefit from S. Korean XK-2 experience and Same project model will be benefical for Pakistani future MBT+active protection system+missile launch capability+onboard 360 degree radar coverage sensors which is going to be way superior than anything rivals have.

 

[Basel]

I think It is correct time to take a long road to develop a superior ~55 tonnes Pakistani MBT based on Altay experiences of Turkish engineers. We benefit from S. Korean XK-2 experience and Same project model will be benefical for Pakistani future MBT+active protection system+missile launch capability+onboard 360 degree radar coverage sensors which is going to be way superior than Indian T-90's.

I agree with you that Pakistan should work with Turkey to make a new tank in class of 50 to 56 tons and if possible bring in tech where Turks are not master off or good at, and these countries can help China, S Korea, Ukraine, Europe etc.

 

[thrilainmanila]

Thar desert doesn't allow mbts over 55 tons. Altay is a long way to go. Its too expensive and is not fit for our deserts where most battle will take place. K2 will cost us an arm and leg to buy and both pairs in maintenance. At 9$ mill a pop, good lucj with that. Oplot is still an option if problems are addressed and a good deal is offered.
MBT 3000 was a disappointment as it brought nothing new to the table as I mentioned in my earlier posts. It was just a glorified mbt 2000 with digital interior and some minor improvements.

what about IFVs, why doesnt the army produce IFVs and replace AT systems like HJ-8 with more potent ones.

 

[Abdullah S.]

I think It is correct time to take a long road to develop a superior ~55 tonnes Pakistani MBT based on Altay experiences of Turkish engineers. We benefit from S. Korean XK-2 experience and Same project model will be benefical for Pakistani future MBT+active protection system+missile launch capability+onboard 360 degree radar coverage sensors which is going to be way superior than anything rivals have.

That is actually a very good idea. We now have ample experience of developing AK series of tanks. Pakistan seems to be in a unique position to develop a modern 55 ton MBT suited to its needs with the help of Turkey, China, Ukraine etc for subsystems if need be.