Switzerland sells more arms to Pakistan

[Gryphon]

What Pakistan purchased from them?

What are we buying from Switzerland??

we've bought 12‘500 artillery rounds in the value of 10 Million Euro.
and 200 GDF-005 AAG. 21 anti-aircraft defence missiles worth ($120 million).

Assault rifles,Sky Guards,Ammo maybe.

Pakistan is a devotee of Swiss AA guns. And I guess more are coming.

2006 - 09

2012 - 13

2013 -14

2014 - 15

 

[niaz]

Off Topic: Isnt it ironic that likes of Switzerland and Sweden with almost no enemy are amongst the largest arms exproters? This what is called earning from anything U can sell.Like as per 2013 statistics:

http://www.pri.org/stories/2014-05-...and-are-among-top-arms-exporters-capita-world

Simply impressive.

Hon Shah 1398,

It may be off topic but very good point for introspection. Both the Switzerland & Sweden may be small in population & size but both the countries are fiercely independent. Since I have lived & worked in Geneva for one year in 1981, I know a little more about Swiss than about the Swedes.

Swiss are not a “Peace” loving nation by nature. People of this area have been employed as mercenaries since the 11th Century. Papal Swiss guards date back to 1506 when 150 Swiss soldiers from the Canton Uri led by Capt. Silenen were first employed by the Pope Julius II

Even though Switzerland as ‘Helvetic ‘Confederacy existed from 815 onwards, the country we know today was formed as a federal unit in 1848 consisting of 26 Cantons. Last occupation of Switzerland by any foreign power was by Napoleon in 1803. Ever since 1815 Vienna Conference following the defeat of Napoleon, Swiss confederation has vowed to remain neutral in all European conflicts.

Switzerland has population of about 8-million. 60% of Switzerland being mountainous, Swiss exploit the natural defences of the terrain and have always kept sufficient forces to make occupation by any foreign power much too onerous. There is a national service for the 19- 21 year old males followed by 3 weeks refresher courses up to the age of 30. Women are not conscripted but can volunteer.

Active personnel are only 20,800 but with active reserve force of 148,250 and a Civil Defence force of 72, 2900, there would be some 200,000 trained personnel to guard Swiss independence.

Swiss armament industry is a pigmy compared to other Swiss industrial enterprises. Even if one excludes the Swiss Banks and the Watches; just 3 Swiss companies, Nestle ( Annual revenue SF 91- billion),Novartis International (Revenue SF 42-billion) & Hoffman La Roche (Revenue SF32-billion) generate income of SF 166-billion ( $170-billion). Whereas Pakistan with a population of 200-million has total GDP of about $275-billion.

Switzerland is one the most advance countries in the whole world with per capita GDP of about $85K. Therefore citing Swiss example vis a vis Pakistan (GDP per capita of $1.5K) may be unrealistic but certainly food for thought..

If we must, we should endeavour to focus on Swiss economic success. This means very strong emphasis on education and merit and improving human development index with everyone observing rules & regulations of the State.

Switzerland emerged out of the sectarian conflict under John Calvin in 1541. Whereas in Pakistan LEJ is still actively killing Shias, Ismailis , Christians, including Sufi following Sunnis like Amjad Sabri. Saudi funded Wahhabis and Iran funded Shias fighting a proxy war in Pakistan. This makes Pakistan is about 500 years behind Switzerland.

Many Muslim zealots including a section of Pakistanis couldn’t care less about industry and economic progress; instead they are hell bent on re-creating a 7th Century Khilafat. Until we come out of this time warp and learn to live in 21st Century world as good Muslims; Pakistan will continue to be centuries behind the countries like Switzerland.

 

[shah1398]

Hon Shah 1398,

It may be off topic but very good point for introspection. Both the Switzerland & Sweden may be small in population & size but both the countries are fiercely independent. Since I have lived & worked in Geneva for one year in 1981, I know a little more about Swiss than about the Swedes.

Swiss are not a “Peace” loving nation by nature. People of this area have been employed as mercenaries since the 11th Century. Papal Swiss guards date back to 1506 when 150 Swiss soldiers from the Canton Uri led by Capt. Silenen were first employed by the Pope Julius II

Even though Switzerland as ‘Helvetic ‘Confederacy existed from 815 onwards, the country we know today was formed as a federal unit in 1848 consisting of 26 Cantons. Last occupation of Switzerland occupied by any foreign power was by Napoleon in 1803. Ever since 815 Vienna Conference following the defeat of Napoleon, Swiss confederation has vowed to remain neutral in all European conflicts.

Switzerland has population of about 8-million. 60% of Switzerland being mountainous, Swiss exploit the natural defences of the terrain and have always kept sufficient forces to make occupation by any foreign power much too onerous. There is a national service for the 19- 21 year old males followed by 3 weeks refresher courses up to the age of 30. Women are not conscripted but can volunteer.

Active personnel are only 20,800 but with active reserve force of 148,250 and a Civil Defence force of 72, 2900, there would be some 200,000 trained personnel to guard Swiss independence.

Swiss armament industry is a pigmy compared to other Swiss industrial enterprises. Even if one excludes the Swiss Banks and the Watches; just 3 Swiss companies, Nestle ( Annual revenue SF 91- billion),Novartis International (Revenue SF 42-billion) & Hoffman La Roche (Revenue 32-billion) generate income of SF 166-billion ( $170-bilioon). Whereas Pakistan with a population of 200-milion has total GDP of about $275-billion.

Switzerland is one the most advance countries in the whole world with per capita GDP of about $85K. Therefore citing Swiss example vis a vis Pakistan (GDP per capita of $1.5K) is may be unrealistic but certainly food for thought..

If we must, we should endeavour to focus on Swiss economic success. This means very strong emphasis on education and merit and improving human development index with everyone observing rules & regulations of State.

Switzerland emerged out of the sectarian conflict under John Calvin in 1541. Whereas in Pakistan LEJ is still actively killing Shias, Ismailis , Christians, including Sufi following Sunnis like Amjad Sabri. Saudi funded Wahhabis and Iran funded Shias fighting a proxy war in Pakistan. This makes Pakistan is about 500 years behind Switzerland.

Many Muslim zealots including a section of Pakistanis couldn’t care less about industry and economic progress; instead they are hell bent on re-creating a 7th Century Khilafat. Until we come out of this time warp and learn to a 21st Century world as good Muslims; Pakistan will continue to be centuries years behind the countries like Switzerland.

Thank U Sir for such an indepth analysis. The way Switzerland has come out of crises, it can surely me a role model for us as the problems it faced back then, many of them are faced by us right now as U pointed. It takes juts one step in right direction but problem in our case is that if at all anyone wants to take that one step, not only faces damn high resistance but is labeled as a traitor, kafir etc etc. Just Like Allama Iqbal depicted this state as below:

 

[DJ_Viper]

Why artillery rounds? What's special it offer?

Price and Western technology, highly durable. Works in heat, rain and snow

 

[Djinn]

India will soon go for deals with Switzerland, mark my words .

 

[Hurshid Celebi]

Don't trust Swiss too much.
Later they could stop support.

http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/sw...erland-ends-arms-embargo-on-turkey-2005-04-18

Even 1974 after Turkey liberated Cyprus Turks,

Sweden never embargoed Turkey.

 

[Muhammad Omar]

Pakistan is a devotee of Swiss AA guns. And I guess more are coming.

2006 - 09

2012 - 13

2013 -14

2014 - 15

Hmm we are buying many Skyguard Radars so are we buying Missiles too??

Skyguard Sparrow Missile

 

[Hurshid Celebi]

buying Missiles too??

Sparrow is an US missile and you could be trapped.

 

[A.P. Richelieu]

The weapons are sold as per choice of the government to a country of their own choice. That is the bottom line.
All categorizations are put in place to make themselves appear as a responsible and ethical entity, while in reality it all is based on politics. There is no ethics in essence in selling killing machines let alone in making it, if it was so much about putting restrictions based on intended usage

Yes, and we choose not to sell offensive weapons to countries which has a questionable past,
with military coups or dictatorships.

WTF? Which type of sensitivity is that? Any weapon can kill civilians. Might as well stop all weapon production and sale, that way there will be zero chance of civilians getting hurt.

Yes, but EriEye and RBS 70 are not really the weapons of choice vs an angry crowd of demonstrators.

 

[Hurshid Celebi]

not to sell offensive weapons

Oha, we got PENGUIN Anti-ship Missiles during USA Embargo.

http://arsiv.sabah.com.tr/2000/05/29/p06.html

Kongsberg is a multinational consortium including Sweden.

 

[A.P. Richelieu]

Oha, we got PENGUIN Anti-ship Missiles during USA Embargo.

http://arsiv.sabah.com.tr/2000/05/29/p06.html

Kongsberg is a multinational consortium including Sweden.

The Penguin Missile is designed by Kongsberg in Norway, and we have no influence over their exports.
Anyway, an anti-ship missile would probably not be blocked by Sweden in the first place.
Have no clue what Turkey is buying from Sweden, so I cannot comment on that.

The rules are of course twisted from time to time, like 1-2 years ago there was an "affair"
where some guys in a government agency started a private company to sell maintenance
of anti-tank missiles to KSA, and when it was discovered by journalists they were basically
roasted on spits, and an agreement on cooperation between the Swedish and KSA government was quickly terminated.
Swedish Law allows selling anti-tank missiles, but business with KSA is not really politically correct.

 

[Hurshid Celebi]

we have no influence over their exports

Straight and fair answer

reliable partners means deal

Penguin missile orders and deliveries
Kongsberg secured a NOK210m ($40.9m) contract in March 2008 to deliver Penguin missiles for the Turkish Navy's new Sikorsky helicopters.

In service with the Turkish Navy (since 1972)

 

[A.P. Richelieu]

Hon Shah 1398,

It may be off topic but very good point for introspection. Both the Switzerland & Sweden may be small in population & size but both the countries are fiercely independent. Since I have lived & worked in Geneva for one year in 1981, I know a little more about Swiss than about the Swedes.

Swiss are not a “Peace” loving nation by nature. People of this area have been employed as mercenaries since the 11th Century. Papal Swiss guards date back to 1506 when 150 Swiss soldiers from the Canton Uri led by Capt. Silenen were first employed by the Pope Julius II

Even though Switzerland as ‘Helvetic ‘Confederacy existed from 815 onwards, the country we know today was formed as a federal unit in 1848 consisting of 26 Cantons. Last occupation of Switzerland by any foreign power was by Napoleon in 1803. Ever since 815 Vienna Conference following the defeat of Napoleon, Swiss confederation has vowed to remain neutral in all European conflicts.

It may not be obvious, but the Swiss are not neutral out of their own choice.
Their neutrality is a result of a decision by the major powers at the Vienna Congress.

Basically the Swiss were told that they were no longer allowed to participate in European Wars.

The history of Swiss mercenaries fighting in European wars thus ended.

 

[Daghalodi]

We used to buy Sig 226 from Switzerland. I wish they open a store here

Offtopic but sig p226 is an amazing weapon,but nowadays its all about lightweight and modern firearms i guess thats why US navy seals replaced p226 with g19

 

[TheNoob]

Sweden sold for $505M. That is just a handful of Gripen fighters.
A few orders more would bring Sweden to the top from rank 3 (per capita)
Orders on the new A-26 submarine would have a similar effect.

The article does not seem to understand Swedish Restrictions on Export.
There are different classes of material, each with its own restrictions.
Weapons which are defensive in its nature, anti-tank missiles, SAMs, EriEye
have much less restrictions compared to Gripen, AT-4, assault rifles and ammunition for same.
Generally the restrictions are on weapons that makes sense to use against civilians.

So you guys dont make weapons which are more suited for offensive capabilities?