South China Sea Forum

[Martian2]

Imagery shows progress of Chinese land building across Spratlys - IHS Jane's 360

 

[Martian2]

Territorial claims in the Spratly and Paracel Islands | GlobalSecurity

"Chinese claims are based on a number of historical events, including the naval expeditions to the Spratly Islands by the Han Dynasty in 110 AD and the Ming Dynasty from 1403-1433 AD. Chinese fishermen and merchants have worked the region over time, and China is using archaeological evidence to bolster its claims of sovereignty." (See graphical citation below, second paragraph about "China")

 

[Rechoice]

You called me a liar and a fabricator regarding the Han Dynasty claim over the Spratly Islands. In reply to your baseless accusations, I gave GlobalSecurity as my citation for the Han Dynasty claim in 110 AD over the Spratly Islands.

Now, you write another bunch of garbage and expect me to take it seriously? Get real.
----------

If you want to make a claim, show me the treaty between China and Vietnam that purportedly supports your claim.

Also, name the Chinese dynasty and the government officials involved.

Finally, show me a reputable citation to put the whole package together.

If you can't meet this minimum criteria, spare all of us the endless rhetoric and crap that you constantly write.

GlobalSecurity is copied from china's fake historic claim. it is fabrication made by Chinese.

Here map of administration of KMT in China 1936. Islands Paracel and Spratly never considered as territory of China by Chinese before 1948.

 

[Nike]

Haha ridiculous, so we can justifying if Australia, Malaysia, Papua Newguinea and Southern Mindanao is part of Indonesia

 

[Rechoice]

Haha ridiculous, so we can justifying if Australia, Malaysia, Papua Newguinea and Southern Mindanao is part of Indonesia

China propaganda is talking about Han Dynasty. Apply Chinese logic Indonesia could claim Taiwan is part of territory of Indonesia, because Indonesian people who form the majority of the modern population, migrated to South East Asia from Taiwan. They arrived in Indonesia around 2000 BCE,

Indonesia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Nike]

China propaganda is talking about Han Dynasty. Apply Chinese logic Indonesia could claim Taiwan is part of territory of Indonesia, because Indonesian people who form the majority of the modern population, migrated to South East Asia from Taiwan. They arrived in Indonesia around 2000 BCE,

Indonesia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Majapahit Claimed lands is stretched as far as Madagascar, there is several Lingga and Yoni, and inscription in the stones left by Majapahit expedition found in Madagascar huahaha

And with the same logic, China must know if European and USA can start their claim over Asia again because the roots of Colonization history

 

[70U63]

Marco Polo has discovered China. so China is territory of White men from Europa.

When a country want to claim other territory, you also need to have hard power to support it.

Any weak country can say anything but no one give a shxt.
Just like what China back then, poor and weak, therefore no one give a fxxk.
Another case is Sultanate of Sulu / PH claim on Sabah (of Malaysia).

 

[Nike]

When a country want to claim other territory, you also need to have hard power to support it.

Any weak country can say anything but no one give a shxt.
Just like what China back then, poor and weak, therefore no one give a fxxk.
Another case is Sultanate of Sulu / PH claim on Sabah (of Malaysia).

so now everything came to hard power, very convenient is it

So what is the use of International Arbitrary Tribune at Den Haag

 

[Rechoice]

When a country want to claim other territory, you also need to have hard power to support it.

Any weak country can say anything but no one give a shxt.
Just like what China back then, poor and weak, therefore no one give a fxxk.
Another case is Sultanate of Sulu / PH claim on Sabah (of Malaysia).

base on your logic, Indonesia with 260 million people could take back Malaysia and Singapore with single military operation.

 

[70U63]

so now everything came to hard power, very convenient is it

So what is the use of International Arbitrary Tribune at Den Haag

Of course if certain country has the hard power, they got more cards to play with.
It doesn't mean you have to use the 'cards'.
For example, if Indonesia economy and military keep expanding in the future, they will have larger influence in the region.

base on your logic, Indonesia with 260 million people could take back Malaysia and Singapore with single military operation.

If i rephrase you statement to:
"base on your logic, China with 1.3 billion people could take Vietnam with single military operation"

Do you see how naive the statement is...

 

[Rechoice]

Of course if certain country has the hard power, they got more cards to play with.
It doesn't mean you have to use the 'cards'.
For example, if Indonesia economy and military keep expanding in the future, they will have larger influence in the region.



If i rephrase you statement to:
"base on your logic, China with 1.3 billion people could take Vietnam with single military operation"

Do you see how naive the statement is...

you said "When a country want to claim other territory, you also need to have hard power to support it."

It is your statement, not mine.

 

[ahojunk]

.
Seaplane Could Advance Chinese SCS Claims

Seaplane Could Advance Chinese SCS Claims
By Wendell Minnick 12:55 p.m. EDT March 28, 2015

TAIPEI — A new Chinese-built seaplane could help seal Beijing's control over its claims in the South China Sea (SCS), say military specialists on China.

The Jiaolong (Water Dragon) AG600, under construction by China Aviation Industry General Aircraft (CAIGA), will be China's largest operational seaplane. CAIGA did not respond to inquiries after the company's announcement on March 17 that it had completed the front fuselage assembly for the prototype.

According to brochures obtained at the 2014 Airshow China in Zhuhai, the aircraft is powered by four turboprop WJ-6 engines and has a range of 5,500 kilometers, which would provide substantial movement within the SCS. In the Spratly Islands, China is currently constructing artificial islands on Hughes Reef, Johnson South Reef and Gaven Reef.

Despite the lack of direct mainland access to Beijing's strategic claims in the SCS, the aircraft are seen as a boon to solidifying control of the area by China's military and maritime enforcement agencies for island hopping within the crowded clusters of the 750 reefs, islets, atolls and islands in the Spratly Islands archipelago.

"Amphibious planes like the AG600 would be perfect for resupplying the new artificial islands that the Chinese are building in the SCS," said Richard Bitzinger, coordinator of the Military Transformations Program at Singapore's S. Rajaratnam School of International Studies.

"At the same time, these islands would be excellent bases of operations for the AG600 to engage in maritime patrols of claimed territories."

The AG600 will also serve as political leverage, said Ching Chang, a research fellow at Taiwan's ROC Society for Strategic Studies.

"States need effective governance to support their territorial claim" and the AG600 will enhance China's capability in "law enforcement, fishery patrol, anti-poaching activity on coral reefs, pollution prevention, search and rescue, medical rescue transportation, meteorological and seismic survey, namely, all the government functions that may signify its substantial governance in the South China Sea."

This type of governance and control will serve China's argument that the islands are "inhabitable according to UNCLOS [United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea] requirements, which support the PRC [People's Republic of China] to claim an EEZ [exclusive economic zone] in the South China Sea."

CAIGA brochures indicate the AG600 can fulfill four missions: search and rescue (SAR), fire fighting, transport (up to 50 passengers), and maritime surveillance. These aircraft might also serve China's military in the roles of signal intelligence and electronic intelligence, said Sam Bateman, adviser, Maritime Security Programme, S. Rajaratnam School of International Studies, Singapore.

However, Bateman does not see these aircraft as a "game changer" in the SCS, though they could serve to "quickly resupply and reinforce the military outposts on islands without air strips."

CAIGA brochures make no mention of a military application, but history indicates that seaplanes have a relatively small commercial market. The existing producers of large amphibious aircraft, Japan and Russia, indicate that the market for fire fighting and SAR missions is small, said Vasiliy Kashin, a China military specialist at Moscow's Centre for Analysis of Strategies and Technologies. Both aircraft producers are legacies of the Cold War, he said, and in comparison China has created a new design and established a new production line for an aircraft that has a terrible commercial market history.

"Since the program can hardly be justified by the civilian demand, the likely explanation is that the program has a significant military importance," Kashin said.

The AG600 is not the only seaplane under development by CAIGA. At the 2014 Airshow China, the company displayed models of the twin-engine turboprop-engine powered H660 and H631, each with a similar payload and range. There was also a model of the four turbofan-engine powered H680 Sea Eagle.

The company also builds two light passenger seaplanes, the 208B and HO300, both with a range of roughly 1,000-1,500 kilometers.

 

[cirr]

.
Seaplane Could Advance Chinese SCS Claims

Seaplane Could Advance Chinese SCS Claims
By Wendell Minnick 12:55 p.m. EDT March 28, 2015

View attachment 210970

TAIPEI — A new Chinese-built seaplane could help seal Beijing's control over its claims in the South China Sea (SCS), say military specialists on China.

The Jiaolong (Water Dragon) AG600, under construction by China Aviation Industry General Aircraft (CAIGA), will be China's largest operational seaplane. CAIGA did not respond to inquiries after the company's announcement on March 17 that it had completed the front fuselage assembly for the prototype.

According to brochures obtained at the 2014 Airshow China in Zhuhai, the aircraft is powered by four turboprop WJ-6 engines and has a range of 5,500 kilometers, which would provide substantial movement within the SCS. In the Spratly Islands, China is currently constructing artificial islands on Hughes Reef, Johnson South Reef and Gaven Reef.

Despite the lack of direct mainland access to Beijing's strategic claims in the SCS, the aircraft are seen as a boon to solidifying control of the area by China's military and maritime enforcement agencies for island hopping within the crowded clusters of the 750 reefs, islets, atolls and islands in the Spratly Islands archipelago.

"Amphibious planes like the AG600 would be perfect for resupplying the new artificial islands that the Chinese are building in the SCS," said Richard Bitzinger, coordinator of the Military Transformations Program at Singapore's S. Rajaratnam School of International Studies.

"At the same time, these islands would be excellent bases of operations for the AG600 to engage in maritime patrols of claimed territories."

The AG600 will also serve as political leverage, said Ching Chang, a research fellow at Taiwan's ROC Society for Strategic Studies.

"States need effective governance to support their territorial claim" and the AG600 will enhance China's capability in "law enforcement, fishery patrol, anti-poaching activity on coral reefs, pollution prevention, search and rescue, medical rescue transportation, meteorological and seismic survey, namely, all the government functions that may signify its substantial governance in the South China Sea."

This type of governance and control will serve China's argument that the islands are "inhabitable according to UNCLOS [United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea] requirements, which support the PRC [People's Republic of China] to claim an EEZ [exclusive economic zone] in the South China Sea."

CAIGA brochures indicate the AG600 can fulfill four missions: search and rescue (SAR), fire fighting, transport (up to 50 passengers), and maritime surveillance. These aircraft might also serve China's military in the roles of signal intelligence and electronic intelligence, said Sam Bateman, adviser, Maritime Security Programme, S. Rajaratnam School of International Studies, Singapore.

However, Bateman does not see these aircraft as a "game changer" in the SCS, though they could serve to "quickly resupply and reinforce the military outposts on islands without air strips."

CAIGA brochures make no mention of a military application, but history indicates that seaplanes have a relatively small commercial market. The existing producers of large amphibious aircraft, Japan and Russia, indicate that the market for fire fighting and SAR missions is small, said Vasiliy Kashin, a China military specialist at Moscow's Centre for Analysis of Strategies and Technologies. Both aircraft producers are legacies of the Cold War, he said, and in comparison China has created a new design and established a new production line for an aircraft that has a terrible commercial market history.

"Since the program can hardly be justified by the civilian demand, the likely explanation is that the program has a significant military importance," Kashin said.

The AG600 is not the only seaplane under development by CAIGA. At the 2014 Airshow China, the company displayed models of the twin-engine turboprop-engine powered H660 and H631, each with a similar payload and range. There was also a model of the four turbofan-engine powered H680 Sea Eagle.

The company also builds two light passenger seaplanes, the 208B and HO300, both with a range of roughly 1,000-1,500 kilometers.

Subi Island Phase One 03.04.2015 The island now has its own 4G mobile base station。

Yongshudao(Fiery Cross Island)

The runways are shaping up nicely.

 

[yusheng]

 

[terranMarine]

ah yes the Kra canal, any progress made?