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South China Sea Arbitration News & Discussion

What response, anything short of war and sanctions means less than nothing. China is a developing nation, we are communist in name, we are strong but not in the Western order like Japan. How much worse can this reputation get.

Isolating China is just a fantasy dreamed by random people. Even Iran and North Korea isn't totally isolated, but China can be? Certainly support may be too much to ask for, as the US is still the undisputed world power, but isolation seems unlikely to say the least.

Other than that, freedom of navigation, demonstrations, and what else is new? Even in 1996 America sailed her carrier to China's shores, so how is this any different. If anything, this is an improvement to 1996.

In terms of international organizations, like AIIB and all that, I'm quite sure feelings on China was set even then, so if there is to be any problems here, it would most than likely be based on performance than anything else.



China and the US were ideological enemies in the 70s, yet we became allies due to interests. As much as people like to play up this issue, it's no where near the cold war level of hostilities, and that was ended in an instant.

Philippines, Vietnam, and who else can shout whatever they want, but in the end we are no playing in the same league. What's Vietnam's end game, compete to be a world power? Doubtful. A far more likely goal is regional supremacy, and for that you need a global backer. In this the US already has a favorite, at the very least, it wouldn't be possible to have two.

This won't happen now or a year from now, just like US China relations deteriorated over time, eventually, Chinese perception will change. But it won't change for the better if China is not seen as capable to hold our own internationally.


I'm not saying China will do either, both seems unimportant, but perception isn't as long lasting as some seem to think and actions? The reason China haven't gone to war over this is the same reason no one else will do anything concrete.

It is nice to see Chinese members labouring to produce closely argued reasons why the world continues as normal. I doubt - personal opinion with no data points to back it - that even two days ago, this post would have felt necessary. One good effect already.
 
It is nice to see Chinese members labouring to produce closely argued reasons why the world continues as normal. I doubt - personal opinion with no data points to back it - that even two days ago, this post would have felt necessary. One good effect already.

We had this exact argument sometime back, I think it's you. I didn't continue because work got crazy, but this isn't a new view. I can find it for you if you like.
 
Haha....I don't make it a habit...but yes this and I have a bunch of cider left over from cottaging earlier + weddings I attended. Perfect weather and opportunity to enjoy it now. UNCLOS verdict is just a minor reason to be honest.

Have you ever tried Perry by the way (Pear Cider)?

Yes. There is, incidentally, a Swedish version, which I quaffed in larger quantities than was good for me, at a particular foreign station where I was posted.

We had this exact argument sometime back, I think it's you. I didn't continue because work got crazy, but this isn't a new view. I can find it for you if you like.

No, no, don't take the trouble. I believe you. We all believe you. And I won't doubt your claim by going back into the records and showing the number of times Chinese members (not you, necessarily) closed a discussion with a flat-out arrogant statement that said it all. Perhaps all that might change one millimetre - not an impossible target.

Perhaps.
 
What response, anything short of war and sanctions means less than nothing. China is a developing nation, we are communist in name, we are strong but not in the Western order like Japan. How much worse can this reputation get.

Isolating China is just a fantasy dreamed by random people. Even Iran and North Korea isn't totally isolated, but China can be? Certainly support may be too much to ask for, as the US is still the undisputed world power, but isolation seems unlikely to say the least.

Other than that, freedom of navigation, demonstrations, and what else is new? Even in 1996 America sailed her carrier to China's shores, so how is this any different. If anything, this is an improvement to 1996.

In terms of international organizations, like AIIB and all that, I'm quite sure feelings on China was set even then, so if there is to be any problems here, it would most than likely be based on performance than anything else.



China and the US were ideological enemies in the 70s, yet we became allies due to interests. As much as people like to play up this issue, it's no where near the cold war level of hostilities, and that was ended in an instant.

Philippines, Vietnam, and who else can shout whatever they want, but in the end we are no playing in the same league. What's Vietnam's end game, compete to be a world power? Doubtful. A far more likely goal is regional supremacy, and for that you need a global backer. In this the US already has a favorite, at the very least, it wouldn't be possible to have two.

This won't happen now or a year from now, just like US China relations deteriorated over time, eventually, Chinese perception will change. But it won't change for the better if China is not seen as capable to hold our own internationally.


I'm not saying China will do either, both seems unimportant, but perception isn't as long lasting as some seem to think and actions? The reason China haven't gone to war over this is the same reason no one else will do anything concrete.

I'm still waiting for China to sail near Hawaii like the Jap did. Until then, China has no real power. All talk.
 
No, no, don't take the trouble. I believe you. We all believe you. And I won't doubt your claim by going back into the records and showing the number of times Chinese members (not you, necessarily) closed a discussion with a flat-out arrogant statement that said it all. Perhaps all that might change one millimetre - not an impossible target.

Perhaps.

I don't have quite as many posts these days, so easy to find.
 
I don't have quite as many posts these days, so easy to find.

Please don't take the trouble. Nobody is doubting your word. There is no need to provide historical evidence. This is PDF, not UNCLOS.
 
If China incapable to challenge the US navy, those reclamation island would have been destroyed by the US navy and US wouldn't have to wait for the powerless tribunal court to rule on the SCS dispute, US wouldn't urge all parties on the dispute to honor the court ruling especially US ask China not to militarized the newly build island to enforced China claim of the SCS, remember in the 90's China military still weak, US didn't hesitate to bomb China embassy in Eastern Europe becuase China embassy in the possession part of the US downed stealth bomber. Now China military power can pack a serious punch against US navy, US not hastily ready to bomb China newly build island.

just because we order flags to be manufactured in China does not mean you can fly them yourself (unless ofcourse you are so fed up with Communist Party of China and want to give them the brooklyn salute, in which case I compliment your daring).

that said, you are absolutely right - we do not want to waste a single bullet or bomb on China. To speculate whether US can take on China or not is plain stupid. All we have to do is cancel a few orders and you are toast.
 
Here comes the protector of the innocent speech. You people probably lost count about how many Muslims you killed in order to maintain this facade of justice. The fact that you are trying so hard to make an issue out of non issue is hilarious. Rather than gloating about being champion of justice why dont you wait and see how much US can enforce. Under article 298 of UN forceful or one sided arbitration of any sea based dispute is not allowed so there is no basis for your argument in the first place. No offense but your argument was becoming incoherent with every passing comment so i guess i should stop this merry go round before your head explodes from anticipation of Chinese demise.

Oh dear.

Bade miya to bade miya........
 
Man,all the moneys jump up and down, celebrating like no tomorrow, about a useless paper... meanwhile, China continues building the island...
Diffidently gonna spent a summer vacation on the island in couple years...such a beautifully place..

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Get this. China's claim on SCS is based on some "ancient" map some fishmerman apparently "found". When the fisherman was questioned about the map by international news agency, he simply "threw" it away because it was old and broken. :rofl: nice try, commies.

No we're not trying, we're be there, done, achieved and write in our historical book, how about you Indians trying to reinforce the verdict, coward can just stand, watch and murmuring.
 
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