Six supporters of hardline Indonesian cleric killed in shootout

[Menthol]

Crazy to fight for religion. President must be nuts. I wouldnt shed any blood for anyone who claim to be speak on behalf of God.

Religion are superstition.

Religion is not superstition.

It's just the human ability to understand it is very limited.

But the saddest thing is if we understand religion a little, but dare to do a great sin in the name of religion.


Even "believe" is not what most people think.

Believe is not just believe in the name only, but believe in the teaching and guidance, because you can prove it as true, you gained benefit as it said.

Believe is more like trust because you can prove the teaching and guidance, they make you and around you better, it's not a lie or fantasy, it's REAL!


A misconception is actually the thing that killed any religion.

Because of the misconception, the followers do bad things and then judged by other as well.

Slowly this religion will be abandoned by its own followers because they can't get the benefit, but instead, the opposite happened.

As well as others will stay away from it because everyone knows this is madness, dangerous, and extreme stupidity.

And then finally, the religion will be completely abandoned.


Just look at the bloody history of any religion.

No wonder if everyone prefers not to follow it anymore.

Everyone is scared about religion.

Although the truth, religious teaching is actually the opposite.

Religion never teaches people to kill and to hate (even forbid it strictly), how can there's a war under the name of religion happened, if it's not because of misconception.

Instead, religion teaches us about love, friendship, merciful, and peace.

What if the whole world practicing love, friendship, merciful, and peace? Isn't our world will be 1000x timed better than today? Will be much more prosperous and we all will be much happier?


I never dislike FPI, because it's one of the misconceptions.

They are full of selfishness and arrogancy that one day will lead to hatred and anger, and then finally lead to destruction, mass killing, and ruined so many people's life (plus family).


If you learn a religion, you start to develop arrogancy, hatred for something, anger to someone... realize it quickly, that you are practicing it wrong.

Try to read the Holy Book again.

You will find simplicity, love, compassion, merciful, humbleness, calm, peace, happiness, wiseness, etc are the things that actually you should have.


Despite you and your country call themselves secular and atheist...

You and your country are actually already practicing what God and Buddha teaching and guide.

That is why there's peace, great progress, and happiness.


The sad thing, many of the so-called religious countries fall into poverty, injustice, criminality, troubles, and problems.

What is wrong with them?

Definitely misconception!

They believe in the name only, but forget to believe the teaching and guidance of God and practicing it in the real life.

They believe in the name of God and formality only, but in practice, they prefer to believe/trust the way of the devil.

Selfish, corrupt, irresponsible, hatred, war, etc... no wonder bad things happened to them.

Yup, regarding mother highly is common within Indonesian Muslim community

This is for example during Armed Force officer graduation day

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Beside in Hadith, there is also Quran verses saying similar thing

QS; Lukman verse 14


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Hadith:

View attachment 698084


It was narrated from Mu'awiyah bin Jahimah As-Sulami, that Jahimah came to the Prophet (ﷺ) and said:
"O Messenger of Allah! I want to go out and fight (in Jihad) and I have come to ask your advice." He said: "Do you have a mother?" He said: "Yes." He said: "Then stay with her, for Paradise is beneath her feet."

أَخْبَرَنَا عَبْدُ الْوَهَّابِ بْنُ عَبْدِ الْحَكَمِ الْوَرَّاقُ، قَالَ حَدَّثَنَا حَجَّاجٌ، عَنِ ابْنِ جُرَيْجٍ، قَالَ أَخْبَرَنِي مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ طَلْحَةَ، - وَهُوَ ابْنُ عَبْدِ اللَّهِ بْنِ عَبْدِ الرَّحْمَنِ - عَنْ أَبِيهِ، طَلْحَةَ عَنْ مُعَاوِيَةَ بْنِ جَاهِمَةَ السُّلَمِيِّ، أَنَّ جَاهِمَةَ، جَاءَ إِلَى النَّبِيِّ صلى الله عليه وسلم فَقَالَ يَا رَسُولَ اللَّهِ أَرَدْتُ أَنْ أَغْزُوَ وَقَدْ جِئْتُ أَسْتَشِيرُكَ ‏.‏ فَقَالَ ‏"‏ هَلْ لَكَ مِنْ أُمٍّ ‏"‏ ‏.‏ قَالَ نَعَمْ ‏.‏ قَالَ ‏"‏ فَالْزَمْهَا فَإِنَّ الْجَنَّةَ تَحْتَ رِجْلَيْهَا ‏"‏ ‏.‏

Grade

: Sahih (Darussalam)

Reference	: Sunan an-Nasa'i 3104
In-book reference	: Book 25, Hadith 20
English translation	: Vol. 1, Book 25, Hadith 3106

Sunan an-Nasa'i 3104 - The Book of Jihad - Sunnah.com - Sayings and Teachings of Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه و سلم)

It was narrated from Mu'awiyah bin Jahimah As-Sulami, that Jahimah came to the Prophet (ﷺ) and said: "O Messenger of Allah! I want to go out and fight (in Jihad) and I have come to ask your advice." He said: "Do you have a mother?" He said: "Yes." He said: "Then stay with her, for Paradise is bene

sunnah.com

@dbc I think as a women you should know this as well......

Like Place of Space said above, you are a good person @Indos

 

[Indos]

Like Place of Space said above, you are a good person @Indos

Thank you bro for your kind words, really appreciate it.

 

[Whizzack]

What the heck...?? Why would a German diplomat need to make a visit to such a controversial and intolerant group that is clearly in opposition to the government...?? Are they trying to give international legitimacy to this group..? Or are they trying to pressure the Indonesian gov by openly recognizing / supporting this group..? Is it because the EU is upset that we have banned raw Nickel exports...?

German Diplomat Suspected of Visiting Islamic Defenders Front

The Indonesian Ministry of Foreign Affairs is requesting clarification from the German Embassy in Jakarta regarding a report that one of its diplomats

indonesiaexpat.biz

German Diplomat Suspected of Visiting Islamic Defenders Front
by Indonesia ExpatDecember 20, 202001067

German Diplomat Suspected of Visiting Islamic Defenders Front
The Indonesian Ministry of Foreign Affairs is requesting clarification from the German Embassy in Jakarta regarding a report that one of its diplomats visited the headquarters of the Islamic Defenders Front (FPI) on Thursday this week.
“We’re currently still waiting for a statement from the German Embassy. We have asked for clarification for the initial communication,” said the spokesman for the Indonesian Ministry of Foreign Affairs, Teuku Faizasyah.
Islamic Defenders Front attorney, Aziz Yanuar, claimed that a foreigner who was identified as a German diplomat visited the Secretariat of the Islamic Defenders Front Central Leadership Council in Petamburan, Central Jakarta, on Thursday 17th December.
Aziz said the diplomat wanted to understand the Islamic Defenders Front first-hand, and conveyed empathy for their leader Rizieq Shihab. Furthermore, General Secretary of the Islamic Defenders Front Munarman admitted that representatives of the German Embassy had visited him.

Munarman possesses two photos indicating a visit. The first photo is of two foreigners entering the Secretariat Office on Jalan Petamburan III. Meanwhile, the second photo shows a car with a number plate on a white background that is usually used by representatives of embassies in Indonesia. However, the photo does not clearly show the license plate number.
According to Munarman, the arrival of the German Embassy representative would trigger international attention.
“International attention to the extrajudicial killings of six martyrs will have an impact on Indonesia’s reputation in the international world,” he said.
Previously, six Islamic Defenders Front members are suspected to have been shot dead by the police. Two of them died in a shootout, while four others were shot in the car for resisting and trying to grab officers’ weapons.
Indonesian National Commission on Human Rights has investigated the shooting incident by examining a number of parties, including the Head of Metropolitan Police Inspector General Fadil Imran and Jasamarga regarding CCTV videos at the time of the incident. They are targeting the investigation to be completed in a month.
The German Embassy has been contacted by telephone and email but until this news was published, no response has been received.
Image credits wartaekonomi.co.id
------------------------------------------------------------

Latest update - This German diplomat will be recalled back to Germany.... The embassy has apologized and claims this act is just a private initiative by the concerned individual...

Still I find their action highly suspicious though... imagine how would the German gov feel if one of our diplomats go to visit and socialize with a violent Neo-Nazi group in Germany..??

 

[Menthol]

What the heck...?? Why would a German diplomat need to make a visit to such a controversial and intolerant group that is clearly in opposition to the government...?? Are they trying to give international legitimacy to this group..? Or are they trying to pressure the Indonesian gov by openly recognizing / supporting this group..? Is it because the EU is upset that we have banned raw Nickel exports...?

German Diplomat Suspected of Visiting Islamic Defenders Front

The Indonesian Ministry of Foreign Affairs is requesting clarification from the German Embassy in Jakarta regarding a report that one of its diplomats

indonesiaexpat.biz

German Diplomat Suspected of Visiting Islamic Defenders Front
by Indonesia ExpatDecember 20, 202001067

German Diplomat Suspected of Visiting Islamic Defenders Front
The Indonesian Ministry of Foreign Affairs is requesting clarification from the German Embassy in Jakarta regarding a report that one of its diplomats visited the headquarters of the Islamic Defenders Front (FPI) on Thursday this week.
“We’re currently still waiting for a statement from the German Embassy. We have asked for clarification for the initial communication,” said the spokesman for the Indonesian Ministry of Foreign Affairs, Teuku Faizasyah.
Islamic Defenders Front attorney, Aziz Yanuar, claimed that a foreigner who was identified as a German diplomat visited the Secretariat of the Islamic Defenders Front Central Leadership Council in Petamburan, Central Jakarta, on Thursday 17th December.
Aziz said the diplomat wanted to understand the Islamic Defenders Front first-hand, and conveyed empathy for their leader Rizieq Shihab. Furthermore, General Secretary of the Islamic Defenders Front Munarman admitted that representatives of the German Embassy had visited him.

Munarman possesses two photos indicating a visit. The first photo is of two foreigners entering the Secretariat Office on Jalan Petamburan III. Meanwhile, the second photo shows a car with a number plate on a white background that is usually used by representatives of embassies in Indonesia. However, the photo does not clearly show the license plate number.
According to Munarman, the arrival of the German Embassy representative would trigger international attention.
“International attention to the extrajudicial killings of six martyrs will have an impact on Indonesia’s reputation in the international world,” he said.
Previously, six Islamic Defenders Front members are suspected to have been shot dead by the police. Two of them died in a shootout, while four others were shot in the car for resisting and trying to grab officers’ weapons.
Indonesian National Commission on Human Rights has investigated the shooting incident by examining a number of parties, including the Head of Metropolitan Police Inspector General Fadil Imran and Jasamarga regarding CCTV videos at the time of the incident. They are targeting the investigation to be completed in a month.
The German Embassy has been contacted by telephone and email but until this news was published, no response has been received.
Image credits wartaekonomi.co.id
------------------------------------------------------------

Latest update - This German diplomat will be recalled back to Germany.... The embassy has apologized and claims this act is just a private initiative by the concerned individual...

Still I find their action highly suspicious though... imagine how would the German gov feel if one of our diplomats go to visit and socialize with a violent Neo-Nazi group in Germany..??

Just as the rumor said.

FPI is a foreign tool to take control of Indonesia.

Work together with the New Order.


The West today wants to reduce and divide the attention toward USA, because of the past reputation of being too much involved in other country affairs.

The most visible is to use France to invade Libya and Turkey for Syria.

But still, behind it, there's USA.


Now, they use Germany for Indonesia.


Is Islam bad and full of violence?

Well, you see it now, who is the grandmaster!


FPI is similar to the student movement in HK and Thailand.

They all are just tools.

Despite they came from a different background, like students or religious people, but they have a similarity and the same purpose, political control.


It will depend on Jokowi how to handle it and our future presidents.

There's a chance that one day Indonesia will be given an ultimatum.

If a softer approach fails, there's a chance for a harder one, like riots in 1997.

But of course, for a riot, it still needs a reason to make it happen.

Like before the West execute the riot, they will make Indonesia's economy collapse or a hard economic sanction.

So everything looks like makes sense for a violent riot that able to gain total political control.

 

[Whizzack]

Press release from the German Embassy in Jakarta

Yeah right... their boss doesn't know anything...

Personally I find the embassy explanation ridiculous, how is it that their diplomats could just go out on their own, without the coordination or knowledge of their embassy (or superiors), during working hours, on a work day, using embassy vehicle, for a meeting with a notorious organization which has been causing a lot of tensions in their host country...? Being diplomats stationed here in Indonesia, I'm sure they are all well aware what FPI is and what they stand for...

Kinda reminds me of this quote :
"...As always, should you or any of your IM Force be caught or killed, the Secretary will disavow any knowledge of your actions. This tape/disc will self-destruct in five/ten seconds. Good luck..."