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Six new submarines to be built in India in Rs 50,000 crore project

illusion8

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NEW DELHI: Frustrated with seven years of debilitating delay in even kicking off the process to select a foreign collaborator to help make new-generation stealth submarines, the Navy has junked its long-standing demand for getting two of the six such vessels directly from aboard.

Defence ministry sources said Navy has now agreed that all the six new submarines, armed with both land-attack missile capabilities and air-independent propulsion for greater underwater endurance, will be constructed in India with foreign collaboration under 'Project-75-India'.

The major decision dovetails into the Modi government's thrust on building a strong indigenous defence-industrial base with stepped-up private sector participation. The Arun Jaitley-led defence acquisitions council last month, for instance, scrapped the long-pending import of 197 light utility helicopters, holding they would be made here under the 'Buy and Make Indian' category to encourage the domestic private industry.

The approved P-75I plan till now was that the first two submarines would be imported to save time, given the country's rapidly-ageing and depleting underwater combat arm, with the next three being constructed at Mazagon Docks (Mumbai) and one at Hindustan Shipyard (Visakhapatnam) with technology transfer from the foreign company eventually selected.

But this will change now. With the Rs 23,562 crore construction of six French Scorpene submarines under Project-75 running four years behind schedule at MDL, the defence establishment could well turn to a private shipyard for execution of P-75I.

Moreover, the long delay in launching P-75I, which was granted "acceptance of necessity" way back in November 2007, will lead to some cost escalation from the initial estimate of around Rs 50,000 crore.

The import of the first two submarines and the selection of the Indian shipyard to make the other four has for long been the bone of contention, with the file still being tossed between the finance and defence ministries. This despite India being down to just 13 ageing diesel-electric submarines, with only half of them operational at present.

Once the global tender or RFP (request for proposal) for P-75I is issued, it will take at least three years to first select the foreign collaborator and then finalize the project with it. It will thereafter take another seven to eight years for the first submarine to roll out.

The Krishnamurthy panel, one of the three committees which examined the matter, had held that MDL among the defence shipyards had the "capability" to take on P-75I, while L&T was the only private one to have the "potential" for it. But that was some years ago. The RFP, when it is issued, will go to entities like DCNS (France), HDW (Germany), Navantia (Spain) and Rosoboronexport (Russia), among others, who will have to tie up with an Indian shipyard for the project.

The Navy, meanwhile, is keeping its fingers crossed that there are no more delays in the Scorpene project, under which the first submarine will now be inducted in September 2016, with the other five following at 9-10 months intervals each.

Last month, the defence ministry also approved the Rs 4,800 crore mid-life upgrade and life-extension of four Kilo or Sindhughosh-class (Russian) submarines and two HDW or Shishumar-class (German) ones. While two of the Kilo-class submarines will be upgraded in Russia, the other two will follow suit at Mumbai naval dockyard. The two HDW submarines, in turn, will be upgraded at MDL with the German company's help.

Six new submarines to be built in India in Rs 50,000 crore project - The Times of India
 
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Just don't bullshit and instead of this useless rfi buy scorpenes with AIP directly/construct in india.
It will cut the development time in years,maybe even decade.

If a new one is selected we will take years mastering it just like we did with scorpenes
 
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Just don't bullshit and instead of this useless rfi buy scorpenes with AIP directly/construct in india.
It will cut the development time in years,maybe even decade.

If a new one is selected we will take years mastering it just like we did with scorpenes

It's quite disgusting how they keep messing it up further. what the F does it take to F'in release a RFI which they haven't been able to do for the last 7 years? 3 years to study a proposal and another 8 to manufacture - we will see a sub under P75I in 2027? Not to mention - no new sub for at least the next 2-3 years under the p75 program. One arihant may come up in that period and that's it.

Why the F are they not taking sub procurement seriously?.
 
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It's quite disgusting how they keep messing it up further. what the F does it take to F'in release a RFI which they haven't been able to do for the last 7 years? 3 years to study a proposal and another 8 to manufacture - we will see a sub under P75I in 2028? Not to mention - no new sub for at least the next 203 years under the p75 program. One arihant may come up in that period and that's it.

Why the F are they not taking sub procurement seriously?.

I think russia might win this contract due to politics of balance.
French will def get rafale and indian govt may want to compensate that.

But yeah that would be a terrible decision
 
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HDW 216 class would be my choice. Clearly the best sub in the market.

I wonder if HDW is still blacklisted.

Then there is Japan's Soryu class submarine, only its bloody expensive.

Anyway with Modi at the helm, this contact will move forward FAST without the usual policy paralysis. 90% L&T would get the contract.
 
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HDW 216 class would be my choice. Clearly the best sub in the market.

I wonder if HDW is still blacklisted.

Then there is Japan's Soryu class submarine, only its bloody expensive.

Anyway with Modi at the helm, this contact will move forward FAST without the usual policy paralysis. 90% L&T would get the contract.

U are again making assumptions.
Anything other than 6 more scorpenes with AIP is a bad decision....................anything

Again? Just build German subs......or Jap if you could get them

We need time to absorb the tot from new subs if anything except scorpene is selected.
It will push us back another 4-5 years
 
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U are again making assumptions.
Anything other than 6 more scorpenes with AIP is a bad decision....................anything

This is YOUR OPINION. Not mine Or the Indian Navy's.

We need time to absorb the tot from new subs if anything except scorpene is selected.
It will push us back another 4-5 years

Yes, but that is the way it should be done. There are no short cuts in life.
 
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This is YOUR OPINION. Not mine Or the Indian Navy's.



Yes, but that is the way it should be done. There are no short cuts in life.

U are new here,,,after some research on scorpene fiasco u will agree what i am saying.
As i said earlier only politics can explain why we are not going for scorpenes directly which should be the case.
 
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U are new here,,,after some research on scorpene fiasco u will agree what i am saying.
As i said earlier only politics can explain why we are not going for scorpenes directly which should be the case.




I know you are saying but holding ourselves hostage to inferior tech simply to speed up the process of building is nto conducive to our long term interests. France has sold weapons to Pakistan that counter our weapons. Our scorpenes and their Agostas for example.



Another area of concern is not these foreign suppliers but India itself.


I posted a link to how China is going about to build its thorium fast breeder reactor quicker. It involves giving directives, montoring the progress, increasing the number of workers/scientists, running construction 24 hrs, 7 days a week to beat deadlines. India has never adopted such moves....why?
 
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Read this news in the early morning and seriously it pissed me off... 3 yrs to decide on a foreign player,8yr for the first sub to start floating? .i will break my phone if such news keep coming out.
There was an article few days back of all sub's being delived to IN by 2018-19 timeline and now this,11yrs for last two subs? :sick:
 
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U are new here,,,after some research on scorpene fiasco u will agree what i am saying.
As i said earlier only politics can explain why we are not going for scorpenes directly which should be the case.

I have nothing against the scorpene, only 216 appears to be a better sub based on specs and reputation of HDW.
 
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I know you are saying but holding ourselves hostage to inferior tech simply to speed up the process of building is nto conducive to our long term interests. France has sold weapons to Pakistan that counter our weapons. Our scorpenes and their Agostas for example.



Another area of concern is not these foreign suppliers but India itself.


I posted a link to how China is going about to build its thorium fast breeder reactor quicker. It involves giving directives, montoring the progress, increasing the number of workers/scientists, running construction 24 hrs, 7 days a week to beat deadlines. India has never adopted such moves....why?

Dude scorpenes are no inferior tech!!
Its french.

The only major problem is lack of AIP
 
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U are new here,,,after some research on scorpene fiasco u will agree what i am saying.
As i said earlier only politics can explain why we are not going for scorpenes directly which should be the case.

I doubt scorpenes will be considered again for p75i, who do you think DCNS is tied up with? its Mazaagoan docks with which they have a long term contract. I am willing to bet that this will go to a new private player who ties up with Germans...which will result in faster execution.

If they fall back on MDL and DCNS combine then say goodbye to P75i for a decade and a half.

Jaitleyji was pretty pissed off and not interested when he visited MDL and the way the handled P75. The naval officers accompanying him too reciprocated by opening up P75I to private players.
 
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I have nothing against the scorpene, only 216 appears to be a better sub based on specs and reputation of HDW.

Having 3 different types of boats is stupid

10-12 kilo
some old hdw
6 new scorpenes
6 others.

Its plain stupid,,will take 3-4 years to absorb the tot and then additional time to build them.
Plus scorpenes are very good,,,we just need to fit an AIP
 
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