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Serving Brigadier arrested for suspected links with Hizbut Tahrir

1) Pathetic argument, just because the Syrian and Libyan army are opposing their people doesn't mean our's will. Just because their military is oppressing their people doesn't mean every country should disband their military.
2) If our military were "American Ghullams" why would we have such poor relations with America ? And why would they expel 345 Americans from Pakistan ?

o brother wats the topic of this thread????
who arrested brig supporting h.t,asking to limit u.s support and questioned about abtabad issue??
and 4 more majors investigation?? wat they asking them? -"why u supporting h.t,u trying to bring sharia here and stop supporting amereica"??
isnt the action enough to tell army heads r ghullam,
expeling few,allowing drone,building base in islamabad,navy base,releasing raymond!!!
joke!!
its a tric..."see we r strict with america now!"
 
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orignally the conquests r jihad in islam as they r based on hukm "to spread the deen"
wid wat intention later rulers did is separate ...
n sending invitation,..,.. is also the corrct way of islam

if sum1 did not follow thats his fault..
but once we have khilafa we will invite america to embrace islam i bet they wud atleast agree to join islamic state as dhimmis!! they wont go 4 war with muslims!!

Brig Ali Khan - if guilty of what he is accused of - is a traitor to the PA and Pakistan - he deserves the severest punishment under the law.
 
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o brother wats the topic of this thread????
who arrested brig supporting h.t,asking to limit u.s support and questioned about abtabad issue??
and 4 more majors investigation?? wat they asking them? -"why u supporting h.t,u trying to bring sharia here and stop supporting amereica"??
isnt the action enough to tell army heads r ghullam,
expeling few,allowing drone,building base in islamabad,navy base,releasing raymond!!!
joke!!
its a tric..."see we r strict with america now!"

The army is non-aligned, links with any political or religious party are forbidden, especially with an outlawed organization that is considered a probable financier of terrorism. Secondly, there is no base in Islamabad, and Raymond Davis was not released by the Army, he wasn't even in the Army's custody, neither was his case being processed by a military court, the victim's relatives chose to take blood money, how does that relate to the army ?
Your argument is based on opinion(biased opinion) and not on facts.
 
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Alleged HuT links: ‘Brigadier Ali likely to be released soon’
By Kamran Yousaf

Published: June 29, 2011

ISLAMABAD: Brigadier Ali Khan is likely to be released soon after spending more than a month and a half in detention for suspected links with the banned extremist group Hizb ut-Tahrir, his family and officials said.

The brigadier and four unnamed majors are in custody for questioning for their suspected ties with Hizb ut-Tahrir (HuT), which calls for creating a pan-Islamic caliphate system by ousting, what it says, the pro-American government in the country.

Military officials grilling the brigadier have yet not found ‘enough evidence’ to formally charge him, said a military official familiar with the development.

“You need to have very solid evidence to charge-sheet anyone in the military. At the moment there is no such thing against the detained officers, including Brig Ali,” added the official, requesting not to be identified. “Brig Ali is likely to be released soon,” he added.

However, it is unclear whether he will be dismissed from service or allowed to go home with his perks and privileges intact. Brig Ali is due to retire on July 9.

Sources say though Brig Ali was allegedly in contact with HuT, the main reason behind his detention appears to be his highly critical stance on the army’s high command over its relationship with the US.

According to the BBC, Brig Ali started writing letters to army generals, some of whom were his former colleagues, with suggestions on how to become ‘self-reliant’ and “to purge the army of the American influence”.

Alleged HuT links:
 
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The army is non-aligned,
Os it now - read below top see just how non-aligned:


The war within

By Saroop Ijaz
Published: June 28, 2011

The writer is a lawyer and partner at Ijaz and Ijaz Co in Lahore saroop.ijaz@tribune.com.pk

“He who battles monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster himself, and if you gaze for long into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you,” wrote Friedrich Nietzsche. The arrest of a serving brigadier and four majors for allegedly having links with banned religious outfit Hizbut Tahrir has been the cause of considerable commotion recently. There are widespread displays of feigned shock at the possibility of linkages between senior army officers and a violence-advocating religious organisation. The expression of horror at this nexus by a person of reasonable comprehension is incredulous. The Islamist tendencies of some in the Pakistan Army have been known and on display for a while now.

The genesis of this religious fervour in the armed forces in general, and the army in particular, is intuitively and easily traced to the Ziaul Haq era and the Afghan war. Admittedly, this is a major contributing factor to the radicalisation of the military, but it is by no means the sole cause. The motto of the Pakistan Army as changed by Ziaul Haq is now, “imaan, taqwa, jihad fi sabilillah” (faith, piety, holy war in the path of Allah). It is interesting to compare this incredibly intense motto with the original unassuming, almost placid, national motto “ittehad, yaqeen aur tanzeem” (unity, faith and discipline). The current motto of the army is blatantly prejudiced and is completely inappropriate as the motto of an army of a nation state. This may seem trivial semantic nitpicking, since who cares about the motto anyway. While that is true for the most part, the primary purpose of slogans and mottos is not to be acted upon, but rather to mould the narrative. And our narrative is quite solidly moulded now. As an example, the implication of the motto is that no non-Muslim is eligible to join the Pakistan Army, or at least join with intellectual honesty since it is theoretically impossible for him or her to live up to or agree with the motto. The Pakistan Army website defines the three components, imaan, taqwa and jihad fi sabilillah, in sufficient detail so as to remove any doubts or aspirations that an infidel may have about joining the army.

The website of Hizbut Tahrir states that its “objective is to resume the Islamic way of life by establishing an Islamic state that executes the systems of Islam”. One can easily mistake this as an excerpt from the Objectives Resolution of the Constitution of Pakistan. Now guess from where the line, “The mission and aim of the momin is martyrdom,” is taken. A reasonable supposition could be the al Qaeda or Tehreek-i-Taliban Pakistan (TTP) manifesto. The guess could not be more wrong, since it is from the official website of the Pakistan Army. Hence, the potential succumbing of serving army officers to the propaganda of militant, violent religious-fascist organisations should not be surprising. To put it bluntly, the Pakistan Army has not been commissioned to fight the “holy war in the path of Allah,” but rather to protect the physical frontiers of Pakistan. The army is not being paid a vulgarly large proportion of the budget to pursue the selfish goal of personal salvation, but rather to guard our borders. The phrase “holy war in the path of Allah,” may be a very honourable phrase objectively but its use becomes very tenuous when both sides to a battle are fighting ostensibly in the same path. The academic discussion on precisely what constitutes jihad or not has its place amongst believers, but its place is certainly not the armed forces. The allusion then is that it is a battle over an issue of the interpretation of jihad within the same camp, obscuring the real conflict between civilisation and savagery. My argument is not against personal faith but rather for personal faith, ‘personal’ being the operative word. Furthermore, it is insulting to those of the armed forces who gallantly lay down their lives fighting terrorists and hate-mongers. Our brave soldiers are martyred while fighting a very real, tangible, temporal and existential war, and not in an abstract theological quarrel.

George Bush Jr was widely and rightly censured for making the unbelievably idiotic and hopelessly inexact parallel of the war on terror with the Crusades. Our nation and army are constantly guilty of a similar folly as a collective. It would be slightly unfair to single out the army for this exhibition of prejudice. A provincial chief justice some time ago remarked that only a good Muslim can be a good judge. The primary and, no doubt, unintended result was not a slur at Lord Dennings or Justice Antonin Scalia etc but at the impeccable Justice Rana Bhagwan Das.

Our television anchors and writers are particularly fond of using broad, monolith terms for those outside the fold of Islam. Appealing to Jinnah’s Pakistan may not prove very reassuring. The conflation of religious and national identity begins from Jinnah’s Pakistan, resulting in the fallacy of confusing being a good Muslim with being a good Pakistani. The absurdity extends to negative stereotyping, with the most obvious example being using the word ‘Hindu’ when intending to refer to an ‘Indian’. An example of another semantic battle that is continuing at the moment is the vehemently divergent views on the use of the word maulvi by the president while referring to Nawaz Sharif. The major point of debate is whether the president has desecrated the word maulvi by employing it in an apparently pejorative manner. The specifics of the petty contest are irrelevant; however, the particular term chosen for the inordinate amount of emphasis should be disturbing.

The detailed particulars of the involvement of serving army officers with militant organisations have not been divulged yet, and if past record is anything to go by, probably never will be. However, it is important to realise that every time we use exclusionary, discriminatory religious rhetoric, we are inching towards those very militant terrorists that we seek to fight.
 
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musharfy's war has divided your nation
did the taleban attacked Pakistan on 9/11?if not then why did musharfy waged a war against them?
Dollars in the pocket and blood of fellow muslims and fellow countrymen on hand makes a person feel invincible.nato supplies that you allow into afghanistan are used in drone that come attack you
very nice job you are doing and above all your politicians

even if a single innocent child died in a drone attack that equals to killing of entire humaity...look at the face of your politicans....God has put a curse on their faces which can be viewed in day and night,appearing apologetic and burning from inside,the dollars they consumed and smell of blood coming from cloths,lies lies and more lies is what they have for the common man and dollars for their themselves
why dont you tell the nation last years floods were caused cause the american aeroplanes have created so much heat in the region that your glaciers melted.
If taleban have managed to make american exit in 10 years then you could have allied with taleban in 9/11 and made americans leave the region in 3 years but you dident cause dollars and illegal rule has its wonders..
70 billion worth of loss to economy,40,000 citizens dead,,,a divided nation on all levels,,,,musharfies must be so proud
 
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musharfy's war has divided your nation
did the taleban attacked Pakistan on 9/11?if not then why did musharfy waged a war against them?
Dollars in the pocket and blood of fellow muslims on hand makes a person feel invincible.nato supplies that you allow into afghanistan are used in drone that come attack you
very nice job you are doing and above all your politicians

Mushy and his types are the ones for whom American said "pakistanis sell their mothers for dollars"-
 
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musharfy's war has divided your nation
did the taleban attacked Pakistan on 9/11?if not then why did musharfy waged a war against them?
Dollars in the pocket and blood of fellow muslims and fellow countrymen on hand makes a person feel invincible.nato supplies that you allow into afghanistan are used in drone that come attack you
very nice job you are doing and above all your politicians

even if a single innocent child died in a drone attack that equals to killing of entire humaity...look at the face of your politicans....God has put a curse on their faces which can be viewed in day and night,appearing apologetic and burning from inside and with stale faces,the dollars they consumed and smell of blood coming from cloths and fingers nails,lies lies and more lies is what they have for the common man and dollars for their themselves
why dont you tell the nation last years floods were caused cause the american aeroplanes have created so much heat in the region that your glaciers melted.
If taleban have managed to make american exit in 10 years then you could have allied with taleban in 9/11 and made americans leave the region in 3 years but you dident cause dollars and illegal rule has its wonders..

next time when you eat meat,take a closer look at it cause thats the meat of your fellow countrymen,women and chidren who got torn apart in the drone attacks
then smell it and you will smell the blood of your brothers which you traded for dollars.
you politicans move in decoy cars that are bomb proof with cars installed with jammers at the front and back and ambulances,why would they make public friendly policies,they will never do it cause they are eating dollars and they will leave your country just like musharfy and shauki once their rule ends

70 billion worth of loss to economy,40,000 citizens dead,,,a divided nation on all levels,,,,musharfies must be so proud
 
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Allama Iqbal's Shikwa sums up your state of affair as follows

Wadiye najd men wo shor-i salasil na raha,
Qais deewana-i nazzarai mehmil na raha
Hausley wo na rahey ham na rahey dil na raha
Ghar ye ujra hai ke too raunaq-i mahfil na raha
Aye khush aan rooz ke aayee wa basad naaz aayee
Bay hijabana su-i mahfil-i maa baaz aayee

translation
(The noise of lover’s chains in the Najd’s valley has disappeared
Qais has no more remained longing for the litter’s sight
Those old ambitions, we, as well as the heart have disappeared
The house is destroyed as Thou art not present in the house
O that happy day when Thou with elegance will come back
When Thou unveiled to our congregation will come back.)
 
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our local politics is like a 'Gutter- who ever falls in it, you know the next------' We are seeing again and again the gifts our rotten political setup giving us, the baboons from Zardari gang wins the election in AJK :coffee:

i don't think that HT has ever demanded to install them in the government----

Brother, actually they do ask to be installed in government and this has been mentioned in their letters and even in their meetings.

You know that i am not an Islamophobic person and am actually a keen student of Islamic History, though i am not that bright.

The thing that bothers me is that our Mullahs have played dirty politics and gotten into government time and again through piggyback rides, while really spoiling the image of Islam and abusing it to such degrees that we have very polarized views towards political capacity of Islamic parties to deliver the goods.
The damage is severe since the intent of these parties is very questionable as proven by their actions, time and again!

If HT needs to change the perception and bridge the trust deficit then it cannot take such an approach. This approach of an Islamic coup has not really helped the Muslim world. We need a popular movement which at least exhausts all the political avenues available in the society which it wishes to lead towards betterment.
Let us say that instead of 2 minute noodle approach they undertake a much more hard, time consuming approach to create a political base and at least have representatives in the governments/assemblies/parliaments etc. of the various Muslim countries...this can bring real dividends to create an environment of trust and affiliation with the people.
If they stop the mantra of overthrowing government and giving "strength and Nusr to HT" (which clearly means a piggyback ride!!!) but instead start a legitimate political campaign in Muslim countries with the declared agenda to facilitate unification in Muslim world and meaningful engagements like common banking system and currency, defense pacts, common education system etc. to benefit all the member countries, this can work in my mind...will take time but will work.

I know we are all pissed at OIC but it cannot be that we include all Muslim countries in one room and expect miracles, their huge differences and disputes eventually let it all crumble.
HT should start with few countries where the people are not opposed to a unified Muslim block for defense and social/economic uplift.
It should not be a cry for removal of current system and government (which causes trust deficiency) but a logical and convincing proposal to create an EU like block where we can day by day increase our commonality based on challenges and possibilities.
Without a local government level presence (even if minor stake) in the initial targeted member countries, HT will not be able to help facilitate meaningful dialogue and agreements between the countries and it will be an OIC like situation.
Just because OIC flopped, it does not mean that this approach will flop.
It is difficult but will be much stronger and long term rather than a Taliban style rule which gains popularity and then deflates over time.

Now in Turkey no one could imagine that a party with many pro islamic leaders will get into power but the pro Islamic parties ran a lot of charities and through participation in the current election system and local politics, they created an image which appealed to a lot of Turks.
Now despite the Military actions against some of these parties, new ones are created and functioning while gradually gaining trust of the people.
Most of these parties are hardly 2 decades old but have made great contribution in bringing a change in Turkey.

Unlike our Mutahidda Majlis e Amal in which all the member parties were for sale to whoever gives them ministries...the pro Islamic Parties in Turkey created a far more decent image and bridged the trust deficit, despite having severe constitutional obstacle to overcome.
They have a long way to go but believe me, they are on the right track.
You need to plant a seed in society and then let it grow over the years.

In case of Pakistan we have yet to see any principled Islamic party, all the parties grab power when available through any corridor.
They have been part of the most pro US eras but on the other hand are severely anti US.
Their shameless hypocrisy and self centered politics has tarnished the image and concept of a political Islamic entity.

It is not impossible for HT to make inroads, but it cannot and must not be a forced imposition on the people and it certainly should not sound like a quick fix solution which wants to eliminate the national fiber of Muslims countries and build it anew.
Its proposal should sound like an EU like union which is practical and achievable in my mind and most importantly can be a long term stabilizing agent in the Muslim World.
If Muslims from Tunisia to Pakistan all want this, then i am sure HT has a realistic chance of getting into governments of these countries in 1 to 2 decades time, if it matures and appreciates the ground realities.
 
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Brother, actually they do ask to be installed in government and this has been mentioned in their letters and even in their meetings.

You know that i am not an Islamophobic person and am actually a keen student of Islamic History, though i am not that bright.

The thing that bothers me is that our Mullahs have played dirty politics and gotten into government time and again through piggyback rides, while really spoiling the image of Islam and abusing it to such degrees that we have very polarized views towards political capacity of Islamic parties to deliver the goods.

If HT needs to change the perception and bridge the trust deficit then it cannot take such an approach. This approach of an Islamic coup has not really helped the Muslim world. We need a popular movement which at least exhausts all the political avenues available in the society which it wishes to lead towards betterment.
Let us say that instead of 2 minute noodle approach they undertake a much more hard, time consuming approach to create a political base and at least have representatives in the governments/assemblies/parliaments etc. of the various Muslim countries...this can bring real dividends to create an environment of trust and affiliation with the people.
If they stop the mantra of overthrowing government and giving "strength and Nusr to HT" (which clearly means a piggyback ride!!!) but instead start a legitimate political campaign in Muslim countries with the declared agenda to facilitate unification in Muslim world and meaningful engagements like common banking system and currency, defense pacts, common education system etc. to benefit all the member countries, this can work in my mind...will take time but will work.

I know we are all pissed at OIC but it cannot be that we include all Muslim countries in one room and expect miracles, their huge differences and disputes eventually let it all crumble.
HT should start with few countries where the people are not opposed to a unified Muslim block for defense and social/economic uplift.
It should not be a cry for removal of current system and government (which causes trust deficiency) but a logical and convincing proposal to create an EU like block where we can day by day increase our commonality based on challenges and possibilities.
Without a local government level presence (even if minor stake) in the initial targeted member countries, HT will not be able to help facilitate meaningful dialogue and agreements between the countries and it will be an OIC like situation.
Just because OIC flopped, it does not mean that this approach will flop.
It is difficult but will be much stronger and long term rather than a Taliban style rule which gains popularity and then deflates over time.

Now in Turkey no one could imagine that a party with many pro islamic leaders will get into power but the pro Islamic parties ran a lot of charities and through participation in the current election system and local politics, they created an image which appealed to a lot of Turks.
Now despite the Military actions against some of these parties, new ones are created and functioning while gradually gaining trust of the people.
Most of these parties are hardly 2 decades old but yet there has been a change in Turkey.

Unlike our Mutahidda Majlis e Amal in which all the member parties were for sale to whoever gives them ministries...the pro Islamic Parties in Turkey created a far more decent image and bridged the trust deficit, despite having severe constitutional obstacle to overcome.
They have a long way to go but believe me, they are on the right track.
You need to plant a seed in society and then let it grow over the years.

In case of Pakistan we have yet to see any principled Islamic party, all the parties grab power when available through any corridor.
They have been part of the most pro US eras but on the other hand are severely anti US.
Their shameless hypocrisy and self centered politics has tarnished the image and concept of a political Islamic entity.

It is not impossible for HT to make inroads, but it cannot and must not be a forced imposition on the people and it certainly should not sound like a quick fix solution which wants to eliminate the national fiber of Muslims countries and build it anew.
Its proposal should sound like an EU like union which is practical and achievable in my mind and most importantly can be a long term stabilizing agent in the Muslim World.
If Muslims from Tunisia to Pakistan all want this, then i am sure HT has a realistic chance of getting into governments of these countries in 1 to 2 decades time, if it matures and appreciates the ground realities.

sir what are you talking about??will this make any sense to a common man who walks the street in search for job and then loses an arm or a foot in bomb blast?
All he knows is that musharfys love for dollars and illegal rule brought him and his country to this point.
blaming everything on mullahs
mullah's allowed nato suppy route?they decided to join Wot to prolong their illegal rule..they imported shaukat aziz?
they are the ruling party?they hold powerful positions?they allow drones that kills innocent Pakistani children?
 
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sir what are you talking about??will this make any sense to a common man who walks the street in search for job and then loses an arm or a foot in bomb blast?
All he knows is that musharfys love for dollars and illegal rule brought him and his country to this point.
blaming everything on mullahs
mullah's allowed nato suppy route?they decided to join Wot to prolong their illegal rule..they imported shaukat aziz?
they are the ruling party?they hold powerful positions?they allow drones that kills innocent Pakistani children?

You do not like Musharraf, that is ok by me.
However do not distort the facts.

I am not blaming everything on Mullah's so stop trying to portray it as such.
I have spend a great deal of time writing about the problem i see with Islamic movements and what i feel HT should be doing.
You should read it instead of trying to twist it into something it was not meant to be.
My analysis was regarding the Islamic political presence and not Musharraf!


Did i say that Musharraf was an angel?
I was analyzing HT in light of past performance of other Islamic parties and actually suggesting things which are more practical and can enable a much better morrow for Muslim countries if that is indeed the intent of HT.

Mullahs have been there in the corridors of power and can hardly be called as innocent bystanders.
MMA was part of Musharraf's government was it not?
MMA was there and it allowed everything to happen as long as it suited the personal needs of glorious Islamic leaders.
It showed the nation that these Islamists are same as secular forces in terms of compromising everything for sake of their ministries.
Actually by using the religious card these Islamists do more damage than even the corrupt seculars.
This damage has to be undone and trust deficit needs to be bridged.

Islamists and Jihadis helped USA achieve dominance over the only other superpower in the world and that too in the name of Islam.
Do not tell me that this is unknown to you as well.

Will all of this make sense to a common man who has lost a limb...no it wont.
Will it make sense for a common man to support people who openly condemn USA but give excuses for the slight misconduct of the misunderstood Taliban style groups which are only reacting against US actions and Pakistani support by killing and maiming innocent Pakistanis???
The answer is still No.

I am only analyzing that HT is proposing no real plan except the nation putting our faith in them and giving them government via some coup or uprising; such an approach can backfire tremendously and that is why i have my severe reservations.
If this is the case then it is much safer to support Imran Khan, at least we know him more since he has been socially and politically active.

I spent a lot of time on my post, perhaps you should spend some time reading it again.
 
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You do not like Musharraf, that is ok by me.
However do not distort the facts.

I am not blaming everything on Mullah's so stop trying to portray it as such.
I have spend a great deal of time writing about the problem i see with Islamic movements and what i feel HT should be doing.
You should read it instead of trying to twist it into something it was not meant to be.
My analysis was regarding the Islamic political presence and not Musharraf!


Did i say that Musharraf was an angel?
I was analyzing HT in light of past performance of other Islamic parties and actually suggesting things which are more practical and can enable a much better morrow for Muslim countries if that is indeed the intent of HT.

Mullahs have been there in the corridors of power and can hardly be called as innocent bystanders.
MMA was part of Musharraf's government was it not?
MMA was there and it allowed everything to happen as long as it suited the personal needs of glorious Islamic leaders.
It showed the nation that these Islamists are same as secular forces in terms of compromising everything for sake of their ministries.
Actually by using the religious card these Islamists do more damage than even the corrupt seculars.
This damage has to be undone and trust deficit needs to be bridged.

Islamists and Jihadis helped USA achieve dominance over the only other superpower in the world and that too in the name of Islam.
Do not tell me that this is unknown to you as well.

Will all of this make sense to a common man who has lost a limb...no it wont.
Will it make sense for a common man to support people who openly condemn USA but give excuses for the slight misconduct of the misunderstood Taliban style groups which are only reacting against US actions and Pakistani support by killing and maiming innocent Pakistanis???
The answer is still No.

I am only analyzing that HT is proposing no real plan except the nation putting our faith in them and giving them government via some coup or uprising; such an approach can backfire tremendously and that is why i have my severe reservations.
If this is the case then it is much safer to support Imran Khan, at least we know him more since he has been socially and politically active.

I spent a lot of time on my post, perhaps you should spend some time reading it again.

sir i dont understand what your are saying.i dont understand rocket science and i am sorry if i offended you and that was not my intention
i am only saying blood and voilence came to our country when musharfy joined the american woT cause he knew he was an illegal ruler soon he would have to deport himself and live in usa and U.K.
mullah are nowhere,they are not the government,not the bureaucracy not the establishment not incharge of karachi port that allows nato supplies in...mullah wasnt flying the plane what wasnt allowed to land..netiher wa mullah controlling air traffic at the time...they do not work on the roads or as police to facilitate the nato supplies,,they dont allow drone strokes and come in public and lie and condemn it..running with the hound and hunting with hare thing
Musharaf was a dictator..dont tell me he listened to MMA...MMA told him not to hold general elections within 3 months of coup?
they are nowhere in the equation
it was only musharfies whose love for dollars brought the country to this stage
a person who gets injured when bomb goes off either in our towns or border area in shape of drone strike only knows such wasnt the scenario before 9/11.
but as i said its the dollar that is to be blamed...the intoxicating smell of a brand new dollar bill has its own wonders
 
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orignally the conquests r jihad in islam as they r based on hukm "to spread the deen"
wid wat intention later rulers did is separate ...
n sending invitation,..,.. is also the corrct way of islam

if sum1 did not follow thats his fault..
but once we have khilafa we will invite america to embrace islam i bet they wud atleast agree to join islamic state as dhimmis!! they wont go 4 war with muslims!!

Jihad is mandatory if a non Muslim country does not accept Islam?
I do not think so.
Also, Islam can spread peacefully without a problem in many countries of the world, including USA.

Jihad was applicable in case of Persia not simply because they did not accept Islam.
The king of Persia rejected the Prophet of Allah PBUH and tore up the letter sent by the Prophet (PBUH) and in his fury sent his vassals to arrest the Prophet PBUH. His contempt clearly spelled a policy of hostility towards Islam. which was understood likewise by his Vassals. In effect blocking anyone from making a choice about whether to embrace Islam or not, actually blocking the message of Islam.
This coupled with the already troubled history of Arabs and Persians created an environment of military provocation.
The Arab vassals of the Persian empire (Lakhmids) went to war against the Muslim state and eventually the conflict spread out to Persia proper.
This is what caused Jihad against the Persian empire.

Similarly the ruler of Eastern Roman Empire while not showing the same contempt as that of the Sassanid King, instigated his allied Arab tribes to militarily attack the Muslim preachers and envoys in areas bordering Rome resulting in massacres.
Mutah is an example where the hostile Arab tribes of Rome received reinforcements from Syria based Roman troops against a Muslim Army which was sent only to punish a tribal leader of Bani Ghassan (powerful Arab tribe affiliated with Rome) who butchered Muslim preachers in cold blood.
This is what caused the Jihad against Eastern Roman empire, it was a military conflict and clearly Rome was on the opposing side and had to be dealt with for supporting the butchers of peaceful Muslim envoys.

Basically both these superpowers had holdings in the Arab peninsula and were playing power games through their Arab Vassals which eventually brought about a clash with Muslim State.

Muslims are able to preach in many non Muslim countries nowadays and this is in stark contrast to what Muslims were allowed to do in Persia and Rome despite the messages sent by the Prophet of Allah (PBUH) himself.
As long as a non Muslim country does not persecute Muslims because of their faith and does not attack a Muslim country, attacking it is not Jihad.

There is no forced conversion in Islam.
 
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all-green i have spent a life time using these arguments with certain bas***ds trust me its no use these people don't read they don't write they don't have proper sources to comment on how on earth can they listen to things now .for years they have been following the retard ummah thing while the arabs and the rest of the countries dont even give a damm about u they always forget clapping is done with both hands not one cause the best they can do other wise is bring a fly down
 
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