Senators fear China may use CPEC to enhance trade with India

[Indus Pakistan]

You're not alone here, a lot of people actually make such points without visiting Karachi a single time in their entire life. So pretty much no surprises there.

Well if we could only make comments based on our visits I think our room for discussion would shrink enormously. I doubt if you have been to Gwadar either - not that I have either.

And if there was genuine industry - say like a local car manufacturer like Tata Motors in India making cars in say Karachi then it would be worth protecting. But protecting rackets being run by players from outside with local collaborator is not genuine industry and deserves no protection. They are nothing but elaborate legalized 'Bhatta enterprises'.

 

[SBD-3]

Well if we could only make comments based on our visits I think our room for discussion would shrink enormously. I doubt if you have been to Gwadar either - not that I have either.

By visiting I meant living and realizing the local dynamics of Karachi. I hope you do realize that. Actually, Balochistan is still a pretty much no-go area beyond Hub and that you would find out once you travel on road from Karachi to Balochistan, Gawadar, Well I'm not there physically so I don't make claims on the aspects I am not aware of. What I know of is that when I reached a dealer about property in Gawadar, he quoted me that not the documents but the encroachments trade with land grabbers with good repute fetching higher prices.

 

[Mrc]

If you run after every dog that barks on your way... u will never reach your destination

Sir churchill

 

[Indus Pakistan]

By visiting I meant living and realizing the local dynamics of Karachi.

Well to me Balochistan and Karachi are 'no go areas' as much as beyond Hub it is a 'no go' for you. I know a doctor from Karachi who moved there in 1960s. In 1980s he moved to UK. He built a house in Karachi for his retirement but now is loath to go there because he does not feel secure. So as much as you make conclusions about what lays beyond Hub I also make my comclusions.

However I do know that the Chinese are behind Gwadar and if Karachi was able to muster the wind behind the Chinese sail as you claim they would not have invested in middle of no where. The fact is if Gwadar is developed, as is. The road from Gwadar to Hoshab, Quetta, Zhob, Dera Ismail Khan, Mianwali, Hakla on M1 near Hasan Abdal is completed as is being built, it will offer a straight route from KKH to Gwadar without even going near Karachi. I think you know the Chinese are behind that. Contracts for Hakla-DIK motorway already have been given.

Which will fit in with westerly route of the CPEC.

 

[SBD-3]

Well to me Balochistan and Karachi are 'no go areas' as much as beyond Hub it is a 'no go' for you. I know a doctor from Karachi who moved there in 1960s. In 1980s he moved to UK. He built a house in Karachi for his retirement but now is loath to go there because he does not feel secure. So as much as you make conclusions about what lays beyond Hub I also make my comclusions.

And perhaps that's why 6 Million of Pukhtoon population exists in Karachi, leaving other ethnic groups aside.
http://tribune.com.pk/story/43827/the-pakhtun-in-karachi/

 

[Indus Pakistan]

And perhaps that's why 6 Million of Pukhtoon population exists in Karachi, leaving other ethnic groups aside.

Yes. Some were there in 1840s before British arrived. Some were there in 1900s after British arrived. Some were there in 1940s when a deluge arrived from India. Some are still there although the numbers have gone up but they cannot match the 10s of millions of others who have arrived since 1940s and who like Jewish migrants in Palestine now think they own it.

And they form the second largest group in the army that has been protecting the borders since 1947 including guarding the streams of migrants from Hindu and Sikhs.

 

[SBD-3]

Yes. Some were there in 1840s before British arrived. Some were there in 1900s after British arrived. Some were there in 1940s when a deluge arrived from India. Some are still there although the numbers have gone up but they cannot match the 10s of millions of others who have arrived since 1940s.

okey. These some grew to 6 Million whereas you see nothing of Pukhtoon Origin in Old Karachi. Karachi knows the contribution of Parsis and Christians but I am still to see a building or an institution carrying the nameplate of a original Pukhtoon you're hypothesizing above. Those who've lived in Karachi have left their mark crystal clear. If you know of something, I'll be glad to be corrected.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

okey. These some grew to 6 Million whereas you see nothing of Pukhtoon Origin in Old Karachi.

Let me make this clear to you. If you talk about Karachi and ethnic groups remind yourself it is in Sindh. It belonged to Sindhi's. All other are migrants. I can't understand why one migrant group who arrived in 1947 think they own Karachi like it is their property and that Pashtun's are outsiders. The only 'natives' are Sindhi's.

And there was Pashtuns/Baluch in 1880s Karachi. I am doing research on 129th Baluch Regiment and the British originally raised it from Karachi in 1870s from Baluchi/Pashtun recruits.

 

[SBD-3]

Let me make this clear to you. If you talk about Karachi and ethnic groups remind yourself it is in Sindh. It belonged to Sindhi's. All other are migrants. I can't understand why one migrant group who arrived in 1947 think they own Karachi like it is their property and that Pashtun's are outsiders. The only 'natives' are Sindhi's.

Let me correct you as well, Karachi has always been a distinct city. If it ever had any influence of Sindhi Culture It would have been evident in the heritage of Karachi. Even the Sindh Mardissah tul Islam was formed by a person whose ancestry was that of Turkish

 

[Indus Pakistan]

The regiment was raised on 6 May 1846 at Karachi on the orders of General Sir Charles Napier, the British Governor of Sindh. Its manpower was mostly drawn from Balochis, Sindhis and Pathans of Sindh. Later, it also recruited Brahuis and Punjabi Muslims, while the recruitment area was extended to include Baluchistan, North-West Frontier Province and the Punjab.

Link > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/129th_Duke_of_Connaught's_Own_Baluchis

distinct city.

So? does that mean it belongs to you because it was 'distinct' - leaving asides that claim.

Turkish

So your a Turk now? Good for you. I am miffed by people claiming to be Arab, Syeds, Moghul when their exterior clearly exposes that as fallacy.

Karachi has always been a distinct city.

It was distinct. It was nurtured by British and mostly built by British. It was surrounded by miles of dry land which was unlike most of India. That and it's position as hinterland of Indus region made it distinct. It soon was built up with major military cantonment. 129th Baluchis were based there first. The dry desert climate, low population gave this city a very un-Indian look to it.

Anyway, whoever they are. All migrants can thank GM Syed whose resolution in 1940 or else Pashtuns would have still been in K-PK and you might still have been in - fill this space [ xxxxxxxxxxxx ]

 

[Kabira]

Let me correct you as well, Karachi has always been a distinct city. If it ever had any influence of Sindhi Culture It would have been evident in the heritage of Karachi. Even the Sindh Mardissah tul Islam was formed by a person whose ancestry was that of Turkish

There was population of pakhtuns in Sindh before 1947 and now speak sindhi. There were also many punjabis settled in Sindh before 1947, I have met few.

 

[SBD-3]

There was population of pakhtuns in Sindh before 1947 and now speak sindhi. There were also many punjabis settled in Sindh before 1947, I have met few.

Punjabis have even settled in Balochistan for long. Pukhtoons have even settled in areas now India. Most of the Muslim invaders in India were either of Turkish or Afghan descent and they settled in these areas. But I was talking about the communities which inhabited and shaped Karachi in what it is today.

 

[Kabira]

Punjabis have even settled in Balochistan for long. Pukhtoons have even settled in areas now India. Most of the Muslim invaders in India were either of Turkish or Afghan descent and they settled in these areas. But I was talking about the communities which inhabited and shaped Karachi in what it is today.

I was talking about post British era and before 1947.

 

[-blitzkrieg-]

I understood you the first time. If China is investing so heavily in your country they expect same kind of returns. By the way whose trucks will be used to transport inside Pakistan? Will it be Chinese trucks or Pakistani trucks?? If it is Chinese trucks they will not be happy sending empty trucks back after travelling such long distance.

As you are aware Afghans are also facing the same situation and they are not happy either.

Both Chinese and Pakistani Trucks participating. The same trucks will be used to send back imports (big portion of which will be for Xinjiang region) .There will always be empty containers going back , this is one transport loss which is negligible in the overall gain.

 

[Ea Returns]

1) If you had such projects announced every week then India would of had double digit figures in growth Currently you still have more poverty than the whole of Africa combined. Please stop being delusional.
2) The first phase of CPEC is currently worth $51 billion, however this is expected to increase by 2022. In the next three phases by 2030 China will increase its investments that would make the first phase look like peanuts.
3) I don't know why you are gloating Do you know within the next decade India requires a trillion dollars in infrastructure investments? If this target is not met then your country will face structural flaws.
4) We don't give a flying hoot about India, but your chai wala prime minister keeps mentioning CPEC like a two dollar clown.
5) China's rail investment in the next five years is bigger than your entire infrastructure investment.

There is one problem with this long story... you are yet to read about CPEC. The height of ignorance about this project is amazing, your inexperience in such deals is taken advantage of.

1. It's not INVESTMENT but LOAN and that's too with unrealistic conditions. Technically one can do anything with Loan he wishes to but it's different story here. You have to pay interest which is highest anywhere in today's world (more than 5%), you commit return of 27% for coal electricity plants for which you have given free land. Worst, all expertise working on this project has to be chinese. One such eg. is Japan is financing Mumbai-Ahmadabad Bullet train project at $10 Billion@0.1% and with moratorium period of 30 yrs (no installment to be paid for first 30 yrs). In addition, after importing a fixed amount of trains, same will be produced locally for future requirements. Did it ring any bell for an all weather ally? I guess they have plan to milk you to the bones during all weathers. sorry for being so blunt.
2. I don't know other secret conditions which could be mortgages in case interest and returns are not feasible!!
3. 80% of CPEC amount is for coal fired electricity plants, only 20% (around $11 B) is for Road project... did i burst your bubble?
4. The cost/unit of this power plant has already shot up to Rs 17/unit, considering there are no delays and implemented on time. Do you think, your people are prepared to buy this costly electricity or would rather prefer to enjoy load shedding?
5. Only people who are getting benefited are your politicians and generals involved in signing off this deal whom chinese have bribed to the throat. Many of them will flee to US/UK after retirement.
6. When you are not informed about Pakistan, i don't expect you to know anything about India. Keep dancing in your la-la land,