Saudi Arabia now the 18th largest economy in the world and largest in MENA

[aziqbal]

you obviously cannot read English and non-stop re-posting same old garbage to fill the thread

and I do not have any interest in reading it

keep going

 

[Zapper]

Wrong.

https://english.mubasher.info/news/3251245/Saudi-Arabia-owns-5-of-global-uranium-reserves

We have one of the biggest phosphate reserves in the world too and you can extract uranium from phosphates!

The largest uranium reserves have been found in India lately
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wo.../Largest-uranium-reserves-found-in-India.html

 

[The SC]

can you stop filling the threat with baseless posts?

what was factually incorrect?

maybe English is not your first language so let me help

"The petroleum sector accounts for roughly 87% of budget revenues, 42% of GDP, and 90% of export earnings"

anything else is just talk

https://www.forbes.com/places/saudi-arabia/

Do you know what The petroleum sector means?

Did you read the title of the thread and this article:

Saudi Crown Prince commends $76.5bn non-oil revenue in 2018

Saudi Arabia’s non-oil revenue has more than doubled between 2014 and 2018 to $76.5bn (SAR287bn), and Crown Prince HRH Mohammed Bin Salman bin Abdulaziz Al Saud said this growth underscores the kingdom’s economic achievements as outlined by the goals of its Vision 2030 long-term diversification programme.

The Crown Prince said Saudi Arabia’s economic and structural reforms are steadily moving to achieve the targets of Vision 2030, which is also accounted for in the 2019 budget. The document was approved by Custodian of the Two Holy Mosques, HRH King Salman bin Abdulaziz Al Saud of Saudi Arabia, on 18 December, 2018.

Calling financial stability a fundamental pillar of economic progress, the Crown Prince said reforms introduced in Saudi Arabia over the last two years have directly contributed to the kingdom’s steady reduction in budget deficit. The kingdom announced a budgetary shortfall for the sixth year in a row as part of its 2019 budget. On 18 December, Saudi announced that its projected 2019 deficit of $36.2bn (SAR136bn) is 32% lower than the corresponding value expected for 2018, $52bn (SAR195bn).

But it is the growth of non-oil revenues that stands out in Saudi Arabia’s 2019 budget announcement. In 2014, non-oil earnings worth $33.9bn (SAR127bn) contributed 12% to Saudi Arabia’s total revenue, and this number has surged to 32% in 2018, when the corresponding figure is valued at $76.5bn. In a statement, Saudi Arabia’s Minister of Finance, Mohammed Al-Jadaan, said this growth is “largely attributed to the continued implementation of economic reforms and initiatives such as value-added tax (VAT) and energy price reforms”.

https://www.constructionweekonline....prince-commends-765bn-non-oil-revenue-in-2018

 

[ArabianEmpires&Caliphates]

The largest uranium reserves have been found in India lately
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wo.../Largest-uranium-reserves-found-in-India.html

Who said anything about uranium not being present in India? I wrote (a factual statement) that KSA has huge phosphate reserves (one of the largest in the world) and that KSA is home to between 5-10% of the world's uranium reserves. I don't know which country has the largest reserves (digging is taking place on a yearly basis so this can change and will change in the future, almost nothing of KSA is explored yet for instance unlike say neighboring Jordan that has much uranium and has a similar geography and soil to neighboring Northern KSA). I know from memory that Australia and Kazakhstan have large uranium reserves.

Do you know what The petroleum sector means?

Did you read the title of the thread and this article:

Saudi Crown Prince commends $76.5bn non-oil revenue in 2018

Saudi Arabia’s non-oil revenue has more than doubled between 2014 and 2018 to $76.5bn (SAR287bn), and Crown Prince HRH Mohammed Bin Salman bin Abdulaziz Al Saud said this growth underscores the kingdom’s economic achievements as outlined by the goals of its Vision 2030 long-term diversification programme.

The Crown Prince said Saudi Arabia’s economic and structural reforms are steadily moving to achieve the targets of Vision 2030, which is also accounted for in the 2019 budget. The document was approved by Custodian of the Two Holy Mosques, HRH King Salman bin Abdulaziz Al Saud of Saudi Arabia, on 18 December, 2018.

Calling financial stability a fundamental pillar of economic progress, the Crown Prince said reforms introduced in Saudi Arabia over the last two years have directly contributed to the kingdom’s steady reduction in budget deficit. The kingdom announced a budgetary shortfall for the sixth year in a row as part of its 2019 budget. On 18 December, Saudi announced that its projected 2019 deficit of $36.2bn (SAR136bn) is 32% lower than the corresponding value expected for 2018, $52bn (SAR195bn).

But it is the growth of non-oil revenues that stands out in Saudi Arabia’s 2019 budget announcement. In 2014, non-oil earnings worth $33.9bn (SAR127bn) contributed 12% to Saudi Arabia’s total revenue, and this number has surged to 32% in 2018, when the corresponding figure is valued at $76.5bn. In a statement, Saudi Arabia’s Minister of Finance, Mohammed Al-Jadaan, said this growth is “largely attributed to the continued implementation of economic reforms and initiatives such as value-added tax (VAT) and energy price reforms”.

https://www.constructionweekonline....prince-commends-765bn-non-oil-revenue-in-2018

Brother, no need to waste your time on that Mullah drone. The sole purpose of his ignorant and factually incorrect one-liners is to troll. I have seen him do that in a few KSA-related threads. A few minutes ago he was praising the "morality police" in Iran so go figure which "sect" and "regime" he is a fan of and go figure why we see troll posts from him in relation to KSA.

 

[XTQ1999]

Someone is butthurt that 1 Arab country alone (KSA) has a larger economy than 80 million big Turkey.

Saudi Arabia only has a better economy on paper, Turkey has a true well diversified economy that Saudis can only dream of achieving.

Not even mentioning the other 20+ Arab countries. This divide will only continue as all of our countries will increase their populations (significantly) and we have more unfulfilled potential than anyone else.

and the only wealthy nations out of those heavily depend on natural resources.

BIGGEST potential for wind, solar and alternative energy

and? such energy is only useful for internal consumption and has very little export potential.

 

[ArabianEmpires&Caliphates]

Saudi Arabia only has a better economy on paper, Turkey has a true well diversified economy that Saudis can only dream of achieving.



and the only wealthy nations out of those heavily depend on natural resources.



and? such energy is only useful for internal consumption and has very little export potential.

Not on paper in reality. Our sovereign wealth fund is 1000 times larger too. So is our natural resources and mineral wealth. Not "on paper" only. We have zero debt compared to Turkey as well. Our currency is such stronger too. As are our financial markets who happen to be the largest in the MENA region.

What real economy? Agriculture, some consuming goods that 100's of other countries produce and what more? You are acting like Turkey was some kind of industrial power. It is not.

Today. Won't be the case in the future given the demographics and potential.

No, it is not. KSA plans to export wind and solar to neighboring countries and has the potential to do just that. We are already exporting electricity to neighboring countries.

 

[XTQ1999]

Not on paper in reality.

Lol, you don't even understand the metaphor

Our sovereign wealth fund is 1000 times larger too.

and?

So is our natural resources and mineral wealth.

and?

What real economy?

A real economy is an economy that doesn't depend on a single resource.

Turkey was some kind of industrial power. It is not.

Yes, Turkey is a regional industrial power.

Today. Won't be the case in the future given the demographics and potential.

You talk about all this potential, none of this potential has been fulfilled after decades of oil profits, at your height your country was making 300+ billion in trade surplus, but wasted it all without any economic development. If you had a proper government, such as Norway for example, you would be one of the most advanced countries in the world.

No, it is not. KSA plans to export wind and solar to neighboring countries and has the potential to do just that. We are already exporting electricity to neighboring countries.

Do you even have any idea regarding the dollar value of electricity exports in the world? the top 15 electricity exporters don't even export 15 billion of electricity combined, and your country is not even on the list, meaning you are making only millions from exports. Now compare that to your oil exports, and my point stands. Electricity Exports have very little potential to become a dominant part of your economy.

 

[ArabianEmpires&Caliphates]

Lol, you don't even understand the metaphor



and?



and?



A real economy is an economy that doesn't depend on a single resource.



Yes, Turkey is a regional industrial power.



You talk about all this potential, none of this potential has been fulfilled after decades of oil profits, at your height your country was making 300+ billion in trade surplus, but wasted it all without any economic development. If you had a proper government, such as Norway for example, you would be one of the most advanced countries in the world.



Do you even have any idea regarding the dollar value of electricity exports in the world? the top 15 electricity exporters don't even export 15 billion of electricity combined, and your country is not even on the list, meaning you are making only millions from exports. Now compare that to your oil exports, and my point stands. Electricity Exports have very little potential to become a dominant part of your economy.

"On paper" implies something else when the reality is as described.

We are much better off as a consequence and will be for a long, long time to come if not always.

Same answer as above.

No longer the case with KSA as of 2019 and for each month the dependency will decrease as well. Our non-oil income and its growth in the past 4 years alone speaks for itself. Almost 150% growth.

"Regional". Quite a huge detail when most of the region is undergoing that exact same process. Still lightyears behind tiny Israel despite 80 million big population and 70 years of alliance with the West (NATO).

Norway is a country of 5 million located next to the Arctic and North Sea. In a completely peaceful part of the world. A country in Western Europe that was one of the first countries to undergo an industrial revolution unlike the Middle East and developing world. Next time you will compare KSA with the US.

Electricity was not the topic of discussion but alternative energy such as solar and wind where KSA has a bigger potential than anyone else in the region (by far) and already has announced the largest solar park in the world to be built.

As for potential, the economy of a country automatically grows the larger the population is combined to the opposite. Which is why all the largest economies of the world (top 3) in the future, are also countries that have the 3 largest populations in the world (China, India and USA). So yes Arab economies are bound to grow at a fast pace. Egypt is a good example. Constant growth despite all the problems and already approaching top 30 in the world. Bound to reach top 20 as well not long from now.

 

[Numerous]

We are honestly wasting our time. You have your views and I have my views that happen to be supported by most scholars and the ground realities in KSA and much more so the remaining Muslim countries. I told you when I would get worried if MbS tried to imitate certain practices common in many Muslim countries of the region. Let us return to the topic of this thread which is KSA's economy. If you want to create a thread about harmless WWE in KSA or Akon giving 1 concert, please do so on the Arab section. Or in the Arabic coffee shop thread. Maybe more Arab users (the few that remain) will join this discussion.



Do you do anything else than posting retarded and non-factual one-liners and showing your inferiority complexes towards Arabs? How does it feel to bullshit this much and making a laughing stock out of yourself?

@The SC @Wilhelm II @dani92 guys check this "genius" out.


Oiling the wheels on a road to success

• Pakinam Amer

Nature volume 532, pages S13–S15 (28 April 2016) | Download Citation

With the benefit of a sustainable plan and the funds to back it, Saudi Arabia is aiming high.

Saudi Arabia's scientific development may be in its infancy, but the oil-rich Kingdom is making strides in terms of research investment and publication — with a clear ambition to one day join those in the highest echelons.

KAUST students embark on a new school year with a commencement ceremony. The relatively new university has quickly made an impact on the Nature Index. Image: KAUST

In 2012, Saudi Arabia had a weighted fractional count (WFC) of 52.84 in the index, sitting behind Turkey, Iran, Mexico, Chile and South Africa. In four years it rose 86.8% to reach a WFC of 98.67, leapfrogging all these countries to compete with Chile and Argentina globally. Saudi Arabia ranks at number 31 in the world in terms of WFC — up from 39 in 2012.

The country has risen even higher in specific subject areas. In chemistry, for example, it has surpassed countries with a strong scientific impact like Finland and Ireland, with its WFC rising to 66.54, achieving almost a three-fold increase from its position in 2012.

Institutionally, the country's leading science hub King Abdullah University of Science and Technology (KAUST) made an impressive leap in its WFC between 2012 and 2015, carving a place for itself to compete with American and European research powerhouses.

In just four years, its WFC has risen to become higher than those of prestigious institutions including the European Organization for Nuclear Research (CERN), Brookhaven National Laboratory (BNL), the University of Georgia, United States, and Dresden University of Technology, Germany, to name a few. The output of all of these institutions dwarfed KAUST's in 2012, but KAUST's impressive trajectory since then has seen its WFC shoot to 72 in 2015, overtaking these heavy-hitters.

The country's science development ambitions have been backed by action. Since 2008, the country has embarked on a multi-tiered strategy that will see the Kingdom overhaul its science infrastructure, build high-spec labs, secure grants for research in priority areas in applied science, and link science to industries that drive the economy.

The strategy, broken into four stages to be implemented by 2030, aims to eventually “see Saudi Arabia become a leader in Asia and give it an economic power based on science,” says Abdulaziz Al-Swailem, vice president of scientific research support at King Abdulaziz City for Science and Technology (KACST).

The Saudi Human Genome Project will sequence 100,000 human genomes to conduct biomedical research in the Saudi population. Image: Fayez Nureldine/AFP/Getty Images

Saudi Arabia's march to the top Saudi Arabia's efforts to boost its scientific research have been paying off, with its output in the Nature Index (WFC) rising steadily over the years. The two graphs below highlight Saudi Arabia's rise compared to other nations, both overall and for chemistry.

Overall output In 2012 Saudi Arabia's overall output in the index was below all the countries shown, but continuous efforts have seen the Kingdom's WFC rise to overtake them all in 2015.

Chemistry More marked than its overall rise, Saudi Arabia has made great strides in chemistry. After accelerated growth, which saw the Kingdom's chemistry WFC triple since 2012, it has outshone many larger players in the field in 2015.

The Kingdom's science investments focus on applied research that feeds directly into the country's industrial interests, particularly the oil and energy sector. But even in its strong subjects, chemistry and the physical sciences, Saudi Arabia's WFC remains modest compared to big players in Asia like China, Japan and South Korea.

“Saudi Arabia could look to some successful emerging economies for inspiration.”

To truly swim comfortably with these bigger fish, Saudi Arabia may benefit from looking at successful emerging economies in Asia.

One inspiration could be India. In addition to multi-disciplinary scientific and technical advancements that have improved its output in the index from 736.5 to 901.4 in the past four years, the subcontinental giant has joined the exclusive club of countries that have launched successful space missions.

Like Saudi Arabia, India's leading research institutes focus on chemistry, and their total output currently outstrips their Saudi Arabian counterparts by almost a factor of seven (the latter surpassing 472 in 2015, while the former is 66.5).

India's prowess in chemistry is something that Saudi Arabia can aspire to, considering that working conditions for researchers in the Kingdom are more conducive.

India's science ecosystem is far from perfect. Research funding cannot keep up with inflation and a general slowdown in the country's economy. In addition, commentators from the research community say the funding processes are lengthy, bureaucratic, and provide little feedback when applications for grants are turned down. Meanwhile, Saudi Arabia's healthy stream of oil revenue provides assured funding for the country's state-of-the-art research facilities.

While India has slightly increased spending and dedicated US$1.19 billion for the next fiscal year (2016–2017) for science, it has around 700 universities and 200,000 full-time researchers drawing on the same funding pot. By contrast, Saudi Arabia has pledged an education and training budget of US$50.9 billion for next year, which includes higher education and scientific research. With a total population of just 30 million, it has a much lower number of full-time researchers competing for the available resources.

Another impressive trajectory that Saudi Arabia might look to emulate is that of Singapore, which has a smaller population as well and has managed to climb high in the index. Like the Kingdom, Singapore also has a focus on chemistry research, and it has put together a similar top-down national science strategy for research institutes across the country. Both countries have strong collaborations with top universities around the world and are welcoming of foreign researchers in their efforts to drive innovation.

Mansour Alghamdi, director of the general directorate of scientific awareness and publishing at KACST, is optimistic that Saudi Arabia can bridge the large gap that currently exists in the volume of scientific output between it and such countries as India and Singapore.

“The Kingdom of Saudi Arabia has a clear plan to do so and it has the resources,” he says.

Future growth

An internationally rising star This graph shows KAUST's rise compared to a selection of other institutions*. *Institutions shown are those that were furthest above KAUST in 2012, have experienced overall growth in WFC by 2015 and have been overtaken by KAUST in 2015. For clarity, only 2012 and 2015 data points are shown.

In 2012, Saudi's ranking in research output, with a WFC of 52.8, meant it was comparable with countries like South Africa, Turkey and Iran, all hovering around the 60–70 mark. Its WFC stood way below countries like Mexico, Hungary, Chile, Greece and Argentina.

Saudi Arabian researchers benefit from cutting-edge labs and generous funding that has boosted the country's R&D. Image: Top: KACST; Bottom: KAUST

Four years later, the country's research outlook is very different and it is surpassing countries like Argentina, Mexico and Hungary in the index, and levelling the playing field with Chile. Chemistry research led the country's rapid rise to surpass these countries, but its life sciences and physical sciences WFCs of 8.5 and 31.5 still lag behind.

However, the Kingdom's AC has been steadily growing in these two fields over the past four years, hinting at the ever-increasing significance of international collaborations. It seems that Saudi Arabian researchers are casting their nets ever wider and are participating in publishing more articles, to the detriment of the WFC accredited for these articles.

Though international collaboration has proved fruitful, Saudi Arabia must keep a focus on nurturing home-grown talent, says Nasser Al-Aqeeli, dean of research at King Fahd University of Petroleum & Minerals (KFUPM), based in Dhahran's 'techno valley' in the eastern region of the Kingdom. In the next five years, he says, the country will focus on a programme for national capacity building.

A good first step was the Saudi government's decision to create a large scholarship programme in 2005, arguably the largest in the world, which has seen more than 200,000 young Saudi Arabians studying abroad. This makes Saudi Arabian students in the United States the fourth largest bloc of expatriate students, following those of China, India and South Korea. The government hopes these students will come back and drive a scientific culture in the country.

“Its rise up the ranks depends on a 'self-correcting mechanism' of a slow start to sustainable growth.”

Saudi Arabia is also looking to increase its applied research focus, which is an integral part of the current phase of its national science strategy, while securing good funding for basic research as well. Al-Aqeeli says that Saudi's journey involves what he termed a “self-correcting mechanism” where the country is having a slow start in high-impact research, but a more sustainable one. An eventual future move towards basic research might help Saudi Arabia's research capacity to mature.

https://www.nature.com/articles/532S13a

A few days ago Saudi Arabian students won gold medals in an international physics and science olympiad in Latvia. Will post the article in a few minutes when I find it.

Saudi foundation wins gold, bronze in European Physics Olympiad

RIYADH: Azan Al-Majnooni and Hisham Al-Maliki, of the King Abdul Aziz and his Companions Foundation for Giftedness and Creativity (Mawhiba), won gold and bronze medals respectively at the European Physics Olympiad (EUPHO) 2019, in Riga, Latvia.
The contest ran from May 31 to June 4, and the Saudi duo were praised for their awards by the secretary-general of Mawhiba, Dr. Saud bin Saeed Al-Mathami.
Al-Mathami stressed that the accomplishments were achieved thanks to government support for the sciences and the foundation. This was the first time the Kingdom had taken part in EUPHO, which hosted 26 other nations.
“This comes as an extension to the march toward achieving the targets of the Kingdom’s Vision 2030 through improving education and building a solid base for a talented generation, capable of realizing the aspirations of a state able to rely on creativity and innovation as a means to achieve,” he said.
The secretary-general added that Saudi Arabia paid great attention to gifted and talented citizens, catering their needs and requirements, upgrading services and programs supporting them, and creating the right environment to grow and develop their abilities.
Al-Mathami underlined that this victory was the result of fruitful and constructive cooperation between Mawhiba and King Abdullah University of Science and Technology and the Royal Commission for Jubail and Yanbu.
EUPHO is an international student contest, first held in 2017 in Estonia, and then in Russia 12 months later.

http://www.arabnews.com/node/1506936/saudi-arabia

Here is a statistic:

As of 2018, Saudi Arabia ranks 28 worldwide in terms of high-quality research output according to the renowned scientific journal Nature.[564] This makes Saudi Arabia the best performing Middle Eastern, Arab and Muslim country.

Saudi Arabia spends 8.8 % of its gross domestic product on education, compared with the global average of 4.6%, which is nearly double the global average on education.[565]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saudi_Arabia

Courtesy of @The SC

Saudi Crown Prince commends $76.5bn non-oil revenue in 2018

Saudi Arabia’s non-oil revenue has more than doubled between 2014 and 2018 to $76.5bn (SAR287bn), and Crown Prince HRH Mohammed Bin Salman bin Abdulaziz Al Saud said this growth underscores the kingdom’s economic achievements as outlined by the goals of its Vision 2030 long-term diversification programme.

The Crown Prince said Saudi Arabia’s economic and structural reforms are steadily moving to achieve the targets of Vision 2030, which is also accounted for in the 2019 budget. The document was approved by Custodian of the Two Holy Mosques, HRH King Salman bin Abdulaziz Al Saud of Saudi Arabia, on 18 December, 2018.

Calling financial stability a fundamental pillar of economic progress, the Crown Prince said reforms introduced in Saudi Arabia over the last two years have directly contributed to the kingdom’s steady reduction in budget deficit. The kingdom announced a budgetary shortfall for the sixth year in a row as part of its 2019 budget. On 18 December, Saudi announced that its projected 2019 deficit of $36.2bn (SAR136bn) is 32% lower than the corresponding value expected for 2018, $52bn (SAR195bn).

But it is the growth of non-oil revenues that stands out in Saudi Arabia’s 2019 budget announcement. In 2014, non-oil earnings worth $33.9bn (SAR127bn) contributed 12% to Saudi Arabia’s total revenue, and this number has surged to 32% in 2018, when the corresponding figure is valued at $76.5bn. In a statement, Saudi Arabia’s Minister of Finance, Mohammed Al-Jadaan, said this growth is “largely attributed to the continued implementation of economic reforms and initiatives such as value-added tax (VAT) and energy price reforms”.

https://www.constructionweekonline....prince-commends-765bn-non-oil-revenue-in-2018

2017 mind you..


Crowning achievements

1- Saudi Vision 2030

On April 25, 2016, then deputy crown prince put forth the ambitious Vision 2030 project, aimed at pulling Saudi's economy away from its dependence on oil, implementing structural reforms, and opening the country to diversified sources of income and investments.

2-Saudi PMO

Then deputy crown prince was also behind the launching of Saudi National Transformation Plan (NTP) 2020 across 24 government bodies operating in the economic and development sectors, and most importantly having in 2016 initiated the Project Management Office (PMO), which puts certain consultancies in position to bring more efficiency to the public sector, and mediate issues related to government services.

3- Aramco IPO

In October 2016, it was announced that Aramco was selling 5% of its shares for an estimated value of $100bn, based on a $2trn estimation that the government has put out. The sale, orchestrated by then deputy crown prince, will take place in 2018.

4- Saudi women driving

The Saudi crown prince sponsored the Saudi lifting the world's only ban on women driving, with implementation in June 2018 to allow for the proper laws and procedures to take effect. Already, many advertisers, such as Coca Cola have taken advantage of this and put their products behind the wheel as well.

5- Saudi entertainment

Keen on attracting tourists, but also on keeping Saudis in the country instead of seeing them travel away on tourism, the crown prince was behind the idea of launching a $2.7bn entertainment firm heralding a new era for the kingdom that could relax previously stringent rules on movie viewing, and theatre, among others.

6- NEOM + 50 virgin islands

Virgin Group founder Sir Richard Branson announced his intent to invest in a Red Sea project that turn 50 Saudi Arabian islands into luxury tourism destinations, and the $500bn 100% renewable NEOM city by the Red Sea, with SoftBank investing $$billions into the project as well. Both development projects were launched by the crown prince.

7- VOIP

The crown prince approved Saudi Arabia's lifting of its ban on voice calls such as Skype,WhatsApp and other applications, whereas this was not legally possible before, and with it, a new era of open communication was launched.


https://www.ameinfo.com/industry/finance/crown-prince-mohammed-bin-salmans-top-7-achievements

The Wilayat al-Faqih drone praising the Iranian Mullah regime and their "morality police" in another thread (one-liner) again just a few minutes ago.

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/morality-police-hit-irans-restaurants.622491/page-4

Talk about a troll.

Fair enough bro, we shall agree to disagree.

 

[KediKesenFare3]

KSA is not North Korea. You are not forced to attend local Majalis, you are not forced to attend the mosque (shops, almost all, of course hospitals, police stations, vital state institutions do not close) but you are not forced to attend the mosque. You might be looked down upon by same who do but that is about it. You won't be rounded up and forced to go.

So when KSA opens up for more entertainment much alike pre-Sahwa era, it is not about forcing or "pushing". It is about given people that opportunity if they want to under regulated conditions.

You considering music wrong, is YOUR opinion. We already agreed that there are different viewpoints of music in Islam. I don't know why we are discussing KSA here when practically every Muslim country is doing the same and "much worse" too. I don't know with Afghanistan though, Somalia or such countries. Maybe those countries are your ideal, they are surely not mine.

I can do whatever, at the end of the day it is up to the individual himself. I cannot force him or her to do what I believe in. I don't like WWE but I cannot force another person to not like it or not watch it.

I told you the day I see what is going on in countries like Turkey where prostitution is legal, where hordes of foreigners (Arabs included) go there for cheap holidays to have "fun" (no need to say more), when alcohol (beer) is sold on a massive scale and produced locally, I will then stop up and say, hey, this is not exactly an ideal of a society. Until the, what we are discussing, is absurdities.

No, but most were well-learned Islamic scholars in particular the 4 Rightly Guided Caliphs and Caliphs of the Umayyad and Abbasid dynasty (many of them at least). Anyway the point was that this position was created so not everyone would fight for leadership similar to why there are state clergy's to have some type of regulation and discourse and not 1000's of different opinions and fatwas.

Anyway, what are you personally doing to prevent all that evil in the UK and the many Muslims that engage in it in the UK? I mean KSA is the last country you should be worrying about honestly.



I created a thread about the topic of Arab trade slave and everyone that participated, even a Nigerian, agreed with all of my points. I don't know where "proud" comes from either. Only in your head. That was the norm of the time and every empire and people did it.

Secondly no, Arabs never identified as Turks. That is some Mustafa Kemal propaganda. Not even the elite in the Ottoman society identified as Turks.

I am posting this only because you are writing lies.

Even within the Ottoman Empire, the term "Turk" was sometimes used to denote the Yörük backwoodsmen, bumpkins, or illiterate peasants in Anatolia. "Etrak-i bi-idrak", an Ottoman play on words, meant "the ignorant Turk".[26]

Özay Mehmet wrote in his book Islamic Identity and Development: Studies of the Islamic Periphery:[27]

“ The ordinary Turks [Turkmen, or Yörüks] did not have a sense of belonging to a ruling ethnic group. In particular, they had a confused sense of self-image. Who were they: Turks, Muslims or Ottomans? Their literature was sometimes Persian, sometimes Arabic, but always courtly and elitist. There was always a huge social and cultural distance between the Imperial centre and the Anatolian periphery. As Bernard Lewis expressed it: "In the Imperial society of the Ottomans the ethnic term Turk was little used, and then chiefly in a rather derogatory sense, to designate the Turcoman nomads or, later, the ignorant and uncouth Turkish-speaking peasants of the Anatolian villages." (Lewis 1968: 1)
In the words of a British observer of the Ottoman values and institutions at the start of the twentieth century: "The surest way to insult an Ottoman gentleman is to call him a 'Turk'. His face will straightway wear the expression a Londoner's assumes, when he hears himself frankly styled a Cockney. He is no Turk, no savage, he will assure you, but an Ottoman subject of the Sultan, by no means to be confounded with certain barbarians styled Turcomans, and from whom indeed, on the male side, he may possibly be descended." (Davey 1907: 209)​

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Turkism

Ottoman culture was more Arabic than anything remotely "Turkic". That is not even worthy of a discussion so you are telling me that Arabs marginally impacted by Anatolia let alone Istanbul somehow after millennia of being Arabs and belonging to the most influential culture of the region, suddenly started to identify as Turks while not speaking a single word of Turkish. Speaking about Turkish, your language was changed completely in the past 100 years. From an almost Arabic dialect to this new language. Ottoman Turkish was more Arabic than Turkic as well so what are you even talking about? Nice try, again, lol. Ottoman = Turkic. What a logic, when most Ottoman citizens were ARABS and the culture was much more Arabic than Turkic for obvious reasons as was the lands and that lands history. Whatever.

That is only due to ignorance of locals. However nobody calls them that today. They call them Arabs which they are. Many Europeans think that every Muslim is an Arab as well so what is that supposed to prove? Nothing.

No racism at all but nice insult of @waz . As for racism, don't even go there given the history of the Turkish state. Do I need to say more than the fact that millions (majority of the population) were forcibly assimilated and had to adopt Turkish surnames while every language that was not Turkic was banned? Yet to this day (despite all this) the ancient Turkish Arab community (predates the Turkic migration) still speaks Arabic by large. As for racism, only Turks on PDF call for the deportation of an entire people (Syrians) in a conflict that they have been deeply involved in. When Arab users start talking about deporting all foreigners, expats, Iranians, Pakistanis, Indians, Turks, Bangladeshis, Afro-Arabs, Europeans and what not we can talk.

As expected, you have no idea. During the Ottoman period, the Turkish core identity of the empire was treated very differently - that's truth. Apart from that, you're like always cherry picking historic facts and putting them deliberately in the wrong context. This is why no one on this entire board takes you seriously. Nobody bothers reading your posts anymore. Think about it and look around, you're the glue that holds us Shias, Sunnis, Liberals, Leftists, Pakistanis, Arabs, Turks, Europeans together. Thank you for your service, fascist.

 

[ArabianEmpires&Caliphates]

As expected, you have no idea. During the Ottoman period, the Turkish core identity of the empire was treated very differently - that's truth. Apart from that, you're like always cherry picking historic facts and putting them deliberately in the wrong context. This is why no one on this entire board takes you seriously. Nobody bothers reading your posts anymore. Think about it and look around, you're the glue that holds us Shias, Sunnis, Liberals, Leftists, Pakistanis, Arabs, Turks, Europeans together. Thank you for your service, fascist.

More people agree with me than you, that is for sure. In fact the only ones that don't agree with me are the few Arabized and Arab-obsessed trolls. 2-3 Turkish trolls and a similar number of Farsi trolls.

Everything that I wrote previously about that topic is based on historical facts (already provided sources as well, scholarly included) which is why you do no have any arguments. Not only that it is common knowledge.
Well, you provided one argument, an absurd lie of yours of Arabs identifying as Turks. Of course that never happened as there was no "Turkic" identity in the Ottoman empire other than among Turkic nomads in the interior of Anatolia as already showcased. Calling yourself a Turk was even an insult among the Ottoman elite. Yet you tried to claim that Arabs, with little to no connection or interaction with Anatolia, while already having the STRONGEST and most INFLUENTIAL regional identity (in fact in the entire Muslim world) as in the Arab identity, identified as freaking Turks of all identities while Ottoman language, script, culture, landmass (most of it) was Arab in nature. As was the freaking system (Caliphate) and bureaucracy inherited from the Abbasid caliphate, the previous caliphate.

Fascism is actually an ideology strongly connected to your country. Mustafa Kemal being on such example as well as other of your leaders. Forceful Turkificaiton, oppression of non-Turkish languages, ban of non-Turkish surnames, Kurdish language being banned etc. Is this some kind of joke? Not even going to mention the grey wolves and other fascists. Supported by many of your countrymen on PDF as well. Must be great to know that as a Kurd.

 

[KediKesenFare3]

More people agree with me than you, that is for sure. In fact the only ones that don't agree with me are the few Arabized and Arab-obsessed trolls. 2-3 Turkish trolls and a similar number of Farsi trolls.

Everything that I wrote previously about that topic is based on historical facts (already provided sources as well, scholarly included) which is why you do no have any arguments. Not only that it is common knowledge.
Well, you provided one argument, an absurd lie of yours of Arabs identifying as Turks. Of course that never happened as there was no "Turkic" identity in the Ottoman empire other than among Turkic nomads in the interior of Anatolia as already showcased. Calling yourself a Turk was even an insult among the Ottoman elite. Yet you tried to claim that Arabs, with little to no connection or interaction with Anatolia, while already having the STRONGEST and most INFLUENTIAL regional identity (in fact in the entire Muslim world) as in the Arab identity, identified as freaking Turks of all identities while Ottoman language, script, culture, landmass (most of it) was Arab in nature. As was the freaking system (Caliphate) and bureaucracy inherited from the Abbasid caliphate, the previous caliphate.

Fascism is actually an ideology strongly connected to your country. Mustafa Kemal being on such example as well as other of your leaders. Forceful Turkificaiton, oppression of non-Turkish languages, ban of non-Turkish surnames, Kurdish language being banned etc. Is this some kind of joke? Not even going to mention the grey wolves and other fascists. Supported by many of your countrymen on PDF as well. Must be great to know that as a Kurd.

The important fact here is that Turkey is more popular among the average, politically unaffiliated Sunni Arab in the Middle East than Saudi Arabia probably ever will be. Take Egypt as a prime example; you may have that disgusting killer Sisi in your pocket but the heart of the Egyptian folk is ours. Now, call some PDF Egyptian user and desperately try to debunk me but you know that I'm right. It's a mutual thing, btw. Every Turk I know would chose an Egyptian over any Saudi in a heartbeat.

Same goes for Arab Shias. They don't like you and they never will. They're overwhelmingly pro Iran and nothing can change this. Not even your hand-selected PDF Shias celebrating some imaginary Arab brotherhood. It's time you burst your bubble and come back down to earth.

 

[ArabianEmpires&Caliphates]

The important fact here is that Turkey is more popular among the average, politically unaffiliated Sunni Arab in the Middle East than Saudi Arabia probably ever will be. Take Egypt as a prime example; you may have that disgusting killer Sisi in your pocket but the heart of the Egyptian folk is ours. Now, call some PDF Egyptian user and desperately try to debunk me but you know that I'm right. It's a mutual thing, btw. Every Turk I know would chose an Egyptian over any Saudi in a heartbeat.

Same goes for Arab Shias. They don't like you and they never will. They're overwhelmingly pro Iran and nothing can change this. Not even your hand-selected PDF Shias celebrating some imaginary Arab brotherhood. It's time you burst your bubble and come back down to earth.

More absurd unfunded nonsense.

That is not the case, has never been the case and will never be the case. An Arab will always take the side of a fellow Arab. KSA is much more than the House of Saud. Every Arab, in particular all Muslim Arabs, will always feel a deep affinity towards Arabia for religious, cultural, linguistic, ancestral and historical reasons that are millennia old. As well as the people. Regardless of who rules KSA. House of Saud, MB, liberals, communists and what not.

Egyptians have nothing to do with you historically, culturally, geographically nor ancestrally. Unlike KSA. Ties between Saudi Arabians (people) and Egyptians (people) are like that of brother. In particular with Hijaz. Even the dialect is extremely similar. You are just an outsider. Now Erdogan and his Arab wife have tried to champion political Islam in order to gain influence in the Arab world (the Islamic heartland which is why Erdogan does not care about Indonesia or Malaysia and spends little time trying to gain influence there) by attaching himself to the MB movement but that is a failed project before it even began. Not only that Erdogan is on his last legs in Turkey. The influx of millions of Syrians is not helping either.

Arab Shias are small in numbers and unlike popular belief the vast majority of Arab Shias, who happen to be Iraqi Shia Arabs form Southern Iraq, share everything in common with KSA and love the people greatly and the land as well. Now that KSA and Iraq (politically) have great and close ties again, the popular sentiment is changing very quickly among those brainwashed by Iranian propaganda. Only a visit on social media (Arabic), Twitter, Youtube etc. where KSA-Iraq related videos can be watched, will confirm this.

Ask @CamelGuy or @dani92 or any Iraqi.

I understand as an Turkish Kurd born and breed in Germany, that has never met any Saudi Arabian in his life or many Arabs other than Syrian refugees or some Iraqis, you are pretty clueless. That and not speaking a word of Arabic and having zero clue about Arab history etc or the Arab world. Probably never visited a single Arab country at that too and if visited one or two as a tourist for 2 weeks in some hotel, lol.

As for Arab Shias "loving" Iran (LOL) I suggest taking that discussion with this Pakistani brother in his 40's who will shatter another lie and absurd claim of yours.

@GumNaam please tell this anti-Arab and Arab-obsessed Kurdish Zaza how much Shia Arabs in KSA love Iran. Or how much Iraqi Shia Arabs love Iran, the shame Iran that they curse daily and whose consulates they BURNED down last summer and flags in public in protests attended by 100.000's of Iraqi Shia Arab youth.

Also tell him that we have never interacted until yesterday so no bias either.

Guys check this out:

@Wilhelm II @The SC @Philip the Arab

There have literally been 15-20 active Egyptian users on PDF overall since I have been here. Not one shared your nonsense lie or "view". On the contrary not a single one was anti-KSA. The most that occurred were some disagreements about internal House of Saud policies and a too strict clergy. None of which is relevant as of 2019. Not only that millions of Egyptians have lived and worked in KSA in the past many decades.

Anyway regardless of disagreements, petty rivalries among Arabs (even within the same country) we will always remain Arabs and brother and sisters that share almost everything. Foreigners (in your case Turkish Kurds) are like aliens in this relationship and frankly irrelevant. That is the reality.

 

[The SC]

The important fact here is that Turkey is more popular among the average, politically unaffiliated Sunni Arab in the Middle East than Saudi Arabia probably ever will be. Take Egypt as a prime example; you may have that disgusting killer Sisi in your pocket but the heart of the Egyptian folk is ours. Now, call some PDF Egyptian user and desperately try to debunk me but you know that I'm right. It's a mutual thing, btw. Every Turk I know would chose an Egyptian over any Saudi in a heartbeat.

Same goes for Arab Shias. They don't like you and they never will. They're overwhelmingly pro Iran and nothing can change this. Not even your hand-selected PDF Shias celebrating some imaginary Arab brotherhood. It's time you burst your bubble and come back down to earth.

Just one fact.. go visit any Arab forum to see how much the Egyptian folk or any other Arab likes Turkey..And they will all die for KSA if it is required as well as the Saudis will do for them..Don't dream too much..You are brothers in Islam but don't push it to nationalism.. we know you are nationalists and we are too..

 

[dani92]

More absurd unfunded nonsense.

That is not the case, has never been the case and will never be the case. An Arab will always take the side of a fellow Arab. KSA is much more than the House of Saud. Every Arab, in particular all Muslim Arabs, will always feel a deep affinity towards Arabia for religious, cultural, linguistic, ancestral and historical reasons that are millennia old. As well as the people. Regardless of who rules KSA. House of Saud, MB, liberals, communists and what not.

Egyptians have nothing to do with you historically, culturally, geographically nor ancestrally. Unlike KSA. Ties between Saudi Arabians (people) and Egyptians (people) are like that of brother. In particular with Hijaz. Even the dialect is extremely similar. You are just an outsider. Now Erdogan and his Arab wife have tried to champion political Islam in order to gain influence in the Arab world (the Islamic heartland which is why Erdogan does not care about Indonesia or Malaysia and spends little time trying to gain influence there) by attaching himself to the MB movement but that is a failed project before it even began. Not only that Erdogan is on his last legs in Turkey. The influx of millions of Syrians is not helping either.

Arab Shias are small in numbers and unlike popular belief the vast majority of Arab Shias, who happen to be Iraqi Shia Arabs form Southern Iraq, share everything in common with KSA and love the people greatly and the land as well. Now that KSA and Iraq (politically) have great and close ties again, the popular sentiment is changing very quickly among those brainwashed by Iranian propaganda. Only a visit on social media (Arabic), Twitter, Youtube etc. where KSA-Iraq related videos can be watched, will confirm this.

Ask @CamelGuy or @dani92 or any Iraqi.

I understand as an Turkish Kurd born and breed in Germany, that has never met any Saudi Arabian in his life or many Arabs other than Syrian refugees or some Iraqis, you are pretty clueless. That and not speaking a word of Arabic and having zero clue about Arab history etc or the Arab world. Probably never visited a single Arab country at that too and if visited one or two as a tourist for 2 weeks in some hotel, lol.

As for Arab Shias "loving" Iran (LOL) I suggest taking that discussion with this Pakistani brother in his 40's who will shatter another lie and absurd claim of yours.

@GumNaam please tell this anti-Arab and Arab-obsessed Kurdish Zaza how much Shia Arabs in KSA love Iran. Or how much Iraqi Shia Arabs love Iran, the shame Iran that they curse daily and whose consulates they BURNED down last summer and flags in public in protests attended by 100.000's of Iraqi Shia Arab youth.

Also tell him that we have never interacted until yesterday so no bias either.

Guys check this out:

@Wilhelm II @The SC @Philip the Arab

Many Shias hate Iran and they don’t even marry with them. In fact calling a Shia man an ajami will lead to a tribal conflict and the tribe of the offender have to pay a tribute. My grandparents lived the the marshes in their youth the era they lived in it was a lawless era similar to the American Wild West, they remember the conflicts between the tribes and the Iranian government and how they used to see the severed heads of the people used to flow the marshes.

The important fact here is that Turkey is more popular among the average, politically unaffiliated Sunni Arab in the Middle East than Saudi Arabia probably ever will be. Take Egypt as a prime example; you may have that disgusting killer Sisi in your pocket but the heart of the Egyptian folk is ours. Now, call some PDF Egyptian user and desperately try to debunk me but you know that I'm right. It's a mutual thing, btw. Every Turk I know would chose an Egyptian over any Saudi in a heartbeat.

Same goes for Arab Shias. They don't like you and they never will. They're overwhelmingly pro Iran and nothing can change this. Not even your hand-selected PDF Shias celebrating some imaginary Arab brotherhood. It's time you burst your bubble and come back down to earth.

Yes you are very popular and this website say it all

https://3thmanly.com/ar/amp/مدد-الشوف-عندما-قهر-فرسان-العرب-غزاة-إسطنبول-المرتشين-فى-لبنان

https://3thmanly.com/ar/article/بكنجهام-رحالة-بريطاني-يرصد-دمار-العراق-على-يد-العثمانلية


https://3thmanly.com/ar/article/المحتسب-العثماني-لص-الأسواق-المصرية

https://3thmanly.com/ar/article/يعادون-العلم-والعلماء-العثمانلي-يحول-مدارس-دمشق-إلى-حظائر-غنم