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Saudi Arabia now the 18th largest economy in the world and largest in MENA

More fantasy.

I already told you that Arabs have zero Turkic DNA unlike Anatolians who have plenty of Arab/Semitic ancestry as confirmed by DNA. Unlike Ottomans (most were Arabs, Ottoman culture was 100 times more Arab in nature than Turkic, there were no Arab-Ottoman wars outside the Arab Revolt 100 years ago), we Arabs actually enslaved pagan Turkic people from Central Asia. Well-described in history even Atheist Turkish intellectuals talk about it when speaking badly about Islam.

We also enslaved Europeans (even raided FREAKING ICELAND in the north and Slavic people in Ukraine/Russia) and it is Europeans that have Arab blood (Spain, Portugal, Sicily, Italy, Greece, Cyprus, Malta) and not the other way around. There were European slaves even in Najd not long ago.

Jewish, lol? Last time I checked there are no Jews in KSA unlike in Turkey.

Iceland? Are you referring to the Turkish Abduction?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkish_Abductions
 
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Brothers no more offensive posts or a ban will happen, thank you.
He was banned several times from PDF. Why is he allowed to return? What's the purpose of having rules if they're not applied accordingly?
 
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Iceland? Are you referring to the Turkish Abduction?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkish_Abductions

Those were done by Arabs and Berbers (Barbary Pirates) of modern-day Morocco and Algeria. Not Turkic people. It is even described in your link in detail. So point still stands but nice try.

No, I am talking about Arabs having European slaves already 1000 years prior (before Islam too).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_slave_trade

Speaking about Vikings and Arabs.

https://www.thenational.ae/world/wh...new-discovery-suggests-ancient-links-1.125718

As a result, most Christian slave merchants focused on moving slaves from non-Christian areas to Muslim Spain, North Africa, and the Middle East, and most non-Christian merchants, although not bound by the Church's rules, focused on Muslim markets as well.[13][14][15][16] Arabic silver dirhams, presumably exchanged for slaves, are plentiful in eastern Europe and Southern Sweden, indicating trade routes from Slavic to Muslim territory.[20]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_medieval_Europe

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saqaliba

Saqaliba = European slaves, mainly Slavic but not only.

He was banned several times from PDF. Why is he allowed to return? What's the purpose of having rules if they're not applied accordingly?

Not banned. Asked for a ban myself from Webby due to obligations (extremely busy). Not visited for almost 1 year too for that reason. Otherwise I have never been permanently banned. My profile was cleared last week too. Why are you butthurt my Kurdish Zaza troll?
 
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Wait a second, lol, I am not that old to have watched WWE on videotapes. In my early/mid 20's. I already told you that I do not endorse WWE but at the same time I consider it pretty much harmless. At least the shows in KSA so far. I am quite flexible. There won't be any naked female WWE in KSA (lol) or some plots where Muslims are depicted as terrorists. I am this ignorant about the WWE that I have no clue about what you are even talking about.

As for AKON, there was not any vulgarity in that concert and quiet frankly people are already listening to Western music, including rap. I don't know if most or the opposite of scholars inside KSA are against or in favor of music and frankly it does not interest me much. If every Islamic empire had music and every Muslim country has a music industry (KSA too with traditional songs and a mix of traditional and modern) then it seems to me that most Muslims agree with my viewpoint.

Well, I believe in an inclusive Islam in regards to women and if something could be done 1400 years ago at the time of the Prophet (saws) what is the excuse today?

There are always good and bad apples. I have to say that the scholars of today, by large, do not really measure up with the scholars of the old. Scholars should serve as guidance for Muslims and a state (IMO) should have a state-regulated clergy like in KSA so not every scholar can issue their own fatwas about everything between east and west. They should not be put on a pedestal like it is done in Christianity with Popes, bishops, cardinals and what not.

If you say you are ignorant about wwe then do you think it is wise to defend it being brought to saudi arabia? These things don't happen all at once bro, they'll bring in the male wwe matches but sooner or later, you will probably open up to female matches somewhere down the line too.

Bro I really doubt any of Akon's songs concern him singing about only butterflies and rainbows. He's into gangster rap and I imagine most of his songs have some inappropriate things. Why give someone like him a platform and allow more people to listen to his music? It literally makes no sense. Why encourage your people to listen to someone like that? If down the line your kids act like wnabee gangster then you'll only have yourself to blame.

Something being present in muslim societies does not mean it's right. Many Muslim rulers have drank alcohol in south asia but it doesn't mean we accept it. You have to accept and reject things as Islam says, not by the actions of some people in Muslim societies.

Do you think inclusive Islam is pro wwe or gangster rap?

I'm not arguing over some women's prayer row situation. I have already said that I would accept either way.

State regulated scholarship is a bad idea - you end up in situations like where leading Imams openly support America in Makkah purely because MBS has ordered them to do it... It leads to nothing more than enhanced control of society. Muslim society in general today does not match up to the society's of old, not scholars, not rulers, not the common people. We Muslims do not put scholars on a pedastal like Christians do. Maybe religious shia do that with ayotollahs but that certainly isn't the case with sunnis.
 
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Bro I really doubt any of Akon's songs concern him singing about butterflies and rainbows. He's into gangster rap and I imagine most of his songs have some inappropriate things. Why give someone like him a platform and allow more people to listen to his music? It literally makes no sense. Why encourage your people to listen to someone like that? If down the line your kids act like wnabee gangster then you'll only have yourself to blame.

Something being present in muslim societies does not mean it's right. Many Muslim rulers have drank alcohol in south asia but it doesn't mean we accept it. You have to accept and reject things as Islam says, not by the actions of some people in Muslim societies.

Do you think inclusive Islam is pro wwe or gangster rap?

I'm not arguing over some women's prayer row situation. I have already said that I would accept either way.

State regulated scholarship is a bad idea - you end up in situations like where leading Imams openly support America in Makkah purely because MBS has ordered them to do it... It leads to nothing more than enhanced control of society. Muslim society is general today does not match up to the society's of old, not scholars, not rulers, not the common people. We Muslims do not put scholars on a pedastal like Christians do. Maybe religious shia do that with ayotollahs but that certainly isn't the case with sunnis.

Nobody is encouraging anyone of anything. People can go to concerts of local Saudi Arabian musicians, Arab ones or international ones regardless of genre whether rap or classical music. Or opera. All now the norm in KSA. There were concerts in KSA pre-1979 as well.

I worry about what I am doing and not what others do. If others want to watch harmless WWE with their kids, friends or alone, they can do that. If they don't want to they stay at home. It's not like millions enter those stadiums to watch WWE. We are talking about a few 10'000s of people many of which are expats as well. Nor is it "encouraged". Not anymore than buying the newest game (I am not a gamer) in a store is.

Likewise with music. If you don't want to listen to music, you are free to not do that. I do and enjoy it greatly whether Arabic or non-Arabic. To me it is art. I don't listen to gangster rap as I don't relate to that culture or genre. But some of those songs might have good beats.

No it is not. That has always been the case in the Muslim world. Why do you think a position such as Caliph was created? If there was zero regulation of clergy you would create a mess an open a pandora box as described. There being a state clergy does not prevent clerics that are not part of that state clergy from emerging. At least in KSA: Well, then you agree with me on the rest.
 
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Nobody is encouraging anyone of anything. People can go to concerts of local Saudi Arabian musicians, Arab ones or international ones regardless of genre whether rap or classical music. Or opera. All now the norm in KSA. There were concerts in KSA pre-1979 as well.

I worry about what I am doing and not what others do. If others want to watch harmless WWE with their kids, friends or alone, they can do that. If they don't want to they stay at home. It's not like millions enter those stadiums to watch WWE. We are talking about a few 10'000s of people many of which are expats as well. Nor is it "encouraged". Not anymore than buying the newest game (I am not a gamer) in a store is.

Likewise with music. If you don't want to listen to music, you are free to not do that. I do and enjoy it greatly whether Arabic or non-Arabic. To me it is art. I don't listen to gangster rap as I don't relate to that culture or genre. But some of those songs might have good beats.

No it is not. That has always been the case in the Muslim world. Why do you think a position such as Caliph was created? Well, then you agree with me on the rest.

If the government is pushing certain things and allowing certain musicians into the country then that is nothing more than soft encouragment bro. Like I keep saying, it doesn't matter what people did 40 years ago or 400 years, they would be wrong then and they are wrong now.

You should worry about others do. We are Muslim. We enjoin good and we forbid evil, if we stop doing that then there are consequences for our behaviour. Leaving others to do whatever they please is an alien concept, it's literally a western liberal concept.

Most of the people who assumed the office of Caliph were not scholars. Some of them even severely punished renouned scholars for not following their command (e.g. Ahmed Ibn Hanbal publicly lashed). We greatly respect scholars for they are the inheritors of the Prophets (peace be upon them all) but most of us certainly don't hold them on a pedestal like the Christians do.
 
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Those were done by Arabs and Berbers (Barbary Pirates) of modern-day Morocco and Algeria. Not Turkic people. It is even described in your link in detail. So point still stands.

No, I am talking about Arabs having European slaves already 1000 years prior (before Islam too).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_slave_trade

Speaking about Vikings and Arabs.

https://www.thenational.ae/world/wh...new-discovery-suggests-ancient-links-1.125718

As a result, most Christian slave merchants focused on moving slaves from non-Christian areas to Muslim Spain, North Africa, and the Middle East, and most non-Christian merchants, although not bound by the Church's rules, focused on Muslim markets as well.[13][14][15][16] Arabic silver dirhams, presumably exchanged for slaves, are plentiful in eastern Europe and Southern Sweden, indicating trade routes from Slavic to Muslim territory.[20]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_medieval_Europe

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saqaliba

Saqaliba = European slaves, mainly Slavic but not only.
First of all, being proud of enslaving people is disgusting. It doesn't matter who we're talking about. Making human beings a slave is a crime.

In addition, you have no clue whatsoever about Ottoman identity politics and identity dynamics. Throughout the Ottoman history, people - yes, even Arabs - referred to themselves as Turks to show their loyalty and sense of belonging. Btw, I don't give a **** about the Ottoman Empire and past glory.

Fun fact for you:
That's the reason why your beloved 5000p0p0p0000 million strong Arab Latin community is addressed as Turks in Brazil even though they're Arab. They migrated during the Ottoman period mainly.

And according to your racist logic, @waz is a dirty Pakistani who cannot be seen as British because of his genes, appearance and heritage.

@waz

He is calling me (Turkish) a Kurd because he believes it's an insult to me due to his racist mindset. We like you a lot - especially the PDF Turks - but that guy is racist in every possible way we can imagine. And he needs to learn that this has no space here. He literally wrote that the women of German Turks are whores. This cannot be accepted.
 
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If the government is pushing certain things and allowing certain musicians into the country then that is nothing more than soft encouragment bro. Like I keep saying, it doesn't matter what people did 40 years ago or 400 years, they would be wrong then and they are wrong now.

You should worry about others do. We are Muslim. We enjoin good and we forbid evil, if we stop doing that then there are consequences for our behaviour. Leaving others to do whatever they please is an alien concept, it's literally a western liberal concept.

Most of the people who assumed the office of Caliph were not scholars.

KSA is not North Korea. You are not forced to attend local Majalis, you are not forced to attend the mosque (shops, almost all, of course hospitals, police stations, vital state institutions do not close) but you are not forced to attend the mosque. You might be looked down upon by same who do but that is about it. You won't be rounded up and forced to go.

So when KSA opens up for more entertainment much alike pre-Sahwa era, it is not about forcing or "pushing". It is about given people that opportunity if they want to under regulated conditions.

You considering music wrong, is YOUR opinion. We already agreed that there are different viewpoints of music in Islam. I don't know why we are discussing KSA here when practically every Muslim country is doing the same and "much worse" too. I don't know with Afghanistan though, Somalia or such countries. Maybe those countries are your ideal, they are surely not mine.

I can do whatever, at the end of the day it is up to the individual himself. I cannot force him or her to do what I believe in. I don't like WWE but I cannot force another person to not like it or not watch it.

I told you the day I see what is going on in countries like Turkey where prostitution is legal, where hordes of foreigners (Arabs included) go there for cheap holidays to have "fun" (no need to say more), when alcohol (beer) is sold on a massive scale and produced locally, I will then stop up and say, hey, this is not exactly an ideal of a society. Until the, what we are discussing, is absurdities.

No, but most were well-learned Islamic scholars in particular the 4 Rightly Guided Caliphs and Caliphs of the Umayyad and Abbasid dynasty (many of them at least). Anyway the point was that this position was created so not everyone would fight for leadership similar to why there are state clergy's to have some type of regulation and discourse and not 1000's of different opinions and fatwas.

Anyway, what are you personally doing to prevent all that evil in the UK and the many Muslims that engage in it in the UK? I mean KSA is the last country you should be worrying about honestly.

First of all, being proud of enslaving people is disgusting. It doesn't matter who we're talking about. Making human beings a slave is a crime.

In addition, you have no clue whatsoever about Ottoman identity politics and identity dynamics. Throughout the Ottoman history, people - yes, even Arabs - referred to themselves as Turks to show their loyalty and sense of belonging. Btw, I don't give a **** about the Ottoman Empire and past glory.

Fun fact for you:
That's the reason why your beloved 5000p0p0p0000 million strong Arab Latin community is addressed as Turks in Brazil even though they're Arab. They migrated during the Ottoman period mainly.

And according to your racist logic, @waz is a dirty Pakistani who cannot be seen as British because of his genes, appearance and heritage.

@waz

He is calling me a Kurd because he believes it's an insult to me due to his racist mindset. We like you a lot - especially the PDF Turks - but that guy is racist in every possible way we can imagine. And he needs to learn that this has no space here. He literally wrote that the women of German Turks are whores. This cannot be accepted.

I created a thread about the topic of Arab trade slave and everyone that participated, even a Nigerian, agreed with all of my points. I don't know where "proud" comes from either. Only in your head. That was the norm of the time and every empire and people did it.

Secondly no, Arabs never identified as Turks. That is some Mustafa Kemal propaganda. Not even the elite in the Ottoman society identified as Turks.

I am posting this only because you are writing lies.

Even within the Ottoman Empire, the term "Turk" was sometimes used to denote the Yörük backwoodsmen, bumpkins, or illiterate peasants in Anatolia. "Etrak-i bi-idrak", an Ottoman play on words, meant "the ignorant Turk".[26]

Özay Mehmet wrote in his book Islamic Identity and Development: Studies of the Islamic Periphery:[27]

“ The ordinary Turks [Turkmen, or Yörüks] did not have a sense of belonging to a ruling ethnic group. In particular, they had a confused sense of self-image. Who were they: Turks, Muslims or Ottomans? Their literature was sometimes Persian, sometimes Arabic, but always courtly and elitist. There was always a huge social and cultural distance between the Imperial centre and the Anatolian periphery. As Bernard Lewis expressed it: "In the Imperial society of the Ottomans the ethnic term Turk was little used, and then chiefly in a rather derogatory sense, to designate the Turcoman nomads or, later, the ignorant and uncouth Turkish-speaking peasants of the Anatolian villages." (Lewis 1968: 1)
In the words of a British observer of the Ottoman values and institutions at the start of the twentieth century: "The surest way to insult an Ottoman gentleman is to call him a 'Turk'. His face will straightway wear the expression a Londoner's assumes, when he hears himself frankly styled a Cockney. He is no Turk, no savage, he will assure you, but an Ottoman subject of the Sultan, by no means to be confounded with certain barbarians styled Turcomans, and from whom indeed, on the male side, he may possibly be descended." (Davey 1907: 209)​

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Turkism

Ottoman culture was more Arabic than anything remotely "Turkic". That is not even worthy of a discussion so you are telling me that Arabs marginally impacted by Anatolia let alone Istanbul somehow after millennia of being Arabs and belonging to the most influential culture of the region, suddenly started to identify as Turks while not speaking a single word of Turkish. Speaking about Turkish, your language was changed completely in the past 100 years. From an almost Arabic dialect to this new language. Ottoman Turkish was more Arabic than Turkic as well so what are you even talking about? Nice try, again, lol. Ottoman = Turkic. What a logic, when most Ottoman citizens were ARABS and the culture was much more Arabic than Turkic for obvious reasons as was the lands and that lands history. Whatever.

That is only due to ignorance of locals. However nobody calls them that today. They call them Arabs which they are. Many Europeans think that every Muslim is an Arab as well so what is that supposed to prove? Nothing.

No racism at all but nice insult of @waz . As for racism, don't even go there given the history of the Turkish state. Do I need to say more than the fact that millions (majority of the population) were forcibly assimilated and had to adopt Turkish surnames while every language that was not Turkic was banned? Yet to this day (despite all this) the ancient Turkish Arab community (predates the Turkic migration) still speaks Arabic by large. As for racism, only Turks on PDF call for the deportation of an entire people (Syrians) in a conflict that they have been deeply involved in. When Arab users start talking about deporting all foreigners, expats, Iranians, Pakistanis, Indians, Turks, Bangladeshis, Afro-Arabs, Europeans and what not we can talk.
 
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KSA is not North Korea. You are not forced to attend local Majalis, you are not forced to attend the mosque (shops, almost all, of course hospitals, police stations, vital state institutions do not close) but you are not forced to attend the mosque. You might be looked down upon by same who do but that is about it. You won't be rounded up and forced to go.

So when KSA opens up for more entertainment much alike pre-Sahwa era, it is not about forcing or "pushing". It is about given people that opportunity if they want to under regulated conditions.

You considering music wrong, is YOUR opinion. We already agreed that there are different viewpoints of music in Islam. I don't know why we are discussing KSA here when practically every Muslim country is doing the same and "much worse" too. I don't know with Afghanistan though, Somalia or such countries. Maybe those countries are your ideal, they are surely not mine.

I can do whatever, at the end of the day it is up to the individual himself. I cannot force him or her to do what I believe in. I don't like WWE but I cannot force another person to not like it or not watch it.

I told you the day I see what is going on in countries like Turkey where prostitution is legal, where hordes of foreigners (Arabs included) go there for cheap holidays to have "fun" (no need to say more), when alcohol (beer) is sold on a massive scale and produced locally, I will then stop up and say, hey, this is not exactly an ideal of a society. Until the, what we are discussing, is absurdities.

No, but most were well-learned Islamic scholars in particular the 4 Rightly Guided Caliphs and Caliphs of the Umayyad and Abbasid dynasty (many of them at least). Anyway the point was that this position was created so not everyone would fight for leadership similar to why there are state clergy's to have some type of regulation and discourse and not 1000's of different opinions and fatwas.

Anyway, what are you personally doing to prevent all that evil in the UK and the many Muslims that engage in it in the UK? I mean KSA is the last country you should be worrying about honestly.

Never said it was north korea bro.

I keep telling you, it doesn't matter what the era is. Some acts will always be wrong.

The music haram thing is probably the opinion of most saudi scholars I imagine. And whether Akon is haram, that may be the opinion of maybe all saudi scholars if they learned about the guy.

We are discussing Saudi Arabia because this is a thread about Saudi Arabia. This isn't a thread about Afghanistan or Somalia.

Turkey didn't become like that in a day. These things take time, you do one haram thing then another then another... and so on. That works the same way with societies and countries too.

Sure you cannot force but certainly your government can either ban something or allow it. In this case it's chosen to encourage it in society instead.

I don't think most of them were well-learned Islamic scholars and it ended up becoming more of a hereditary thing amongst the ummayads and abbasids. Yes many of were righteous I agree but doesn't mean most were scholars.

There actually aren't 1000s of different opinions on topics though. That's not how scholarship works, you're making seem like it's really vague or something. Many good muslim scholars would run away from government positions. I think either Imam Malik or Imam Abu Hanifa refused a government position and was punished for their refusal. Government regulation of Muslim scholars is not the way. I would only think of doing that in very few situations like if someone is propagating kufr or some serious kind of misguidance.
 
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take out oil and you are in bottom 10

Saudi has no other industry
 
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Never said it was north korea bro.

I keep telling you, it doesn't matter what the era is. Some acts will always be wrong.

The music haram thing is probably the opinion of most saudi scholars I imagine. And whether Akon is haram, that may be the opinion of maybe all saudi scholars if they learned about the guy.

We are discussing Saudi Arabia because this is a thread about Saudi Arabia. This isn't a thread about Afghanistan or Somalia.

Turkey didn't become like that in a day. These things take time, you do one haram thing then another then another... and so on. That works the same way with societies and countries too.

Sure you cannot force but certainly your government can either ban something or allow it. In this case it's chosen to encourage it in society instead.

I don't think most of them were well-learned Islamic scholars and it ended up becoming more of a hereditary thing amongst the ummayads and abbasids. Yes many of were righteous I agree but doesn't mean most were scholars.

There actually aren't 1000s of different opinions on topics though. That's not how scholarship works, you're making seem like it's really vague or something. Many good muslim scholars would run away from government positions. I think either Imam Malik or Imam Abu Hanifa refused a government position and was punished for their refusal. Government regulation of Muslim scholars is not the way. I would only think of doing that in very few situations like if someone is propagating kufr or some serious kind of misguidance.

We are honestly wasting our time. You have your views and I have my views that happen to be supported by most scholars and the ground realities in KSA and much more so the remaining Muslim countries. I told you when I would get worried if MbS tried to imitate certain practices common in many Muslim countries of the region. Let us return to the topic of this thread which is KSA's economy. If you want to create a thread about harmless WWE in KSA or Akon giving 1 concert, please do so on the Arab section. Or in the Arabic coffee shop thread. Maybe more Arab users (the few that remain) will join this discussion.

take out oil and you are in bottom 10

Saudi has no other industry

Do you do anything else than posting retarded and non-factual one-liners and showing your inferiority complexes towards Arabs? How does it feel to bullshit this much and making a laughing stock out of yourself?

@The SC @Wilhelm II @dani92 guys check this "genius" out.


Oiling the wheels on a road to success
Nature volume 532, pages S13–S15 (28 April 2016) | Download Citation

With the benefit of a sustainable plan and the funds to back it, Saudi Arabia is aiming high.

Saudi Arabia's scientific development may be in its infancy, but the oil-rich Kingdom is making strides in terms of research investment and publication — with a clear ambition to one day join those in the highest echelons.

532S13a-i1.jpg

KAUST students embark on a new school year with a commencement ceremony. The relatively new university has quickly made an impact on the Nature Index. Image: KAUST

In 2012, Saudi Arabia had a weighted fractional count (WFC) of 52.84 in the index, sitting behind Turkey, Iran, Mexico, Chile and South Africa. In four years it rose 86.8% to reach a WFC of 98.67, leapfrogging all these countries to compete with Chile and Argentina globally. Saudi Arabia ranks at number 31 in the world in terms of WFC — up from 39 in 2012.

The country has risen even higher in specific subject areas. In chemistry, for example, it has surpassed countries with a strong scientific impact like Finland and Ireland, with its WFC rising to 66.54, achieving almost a three-fold increase from its position in 2012.

Institutionally, the country's leading science hub King Abdullah University of Science and Technology (KAUST) made an impressive leap in its WFC between 2012 and 2015, carving a place for itself to compete with American and European research powerhouses.

In just four years, its WFC has risen to become higher than those of prestigious institutions including the European Organization for Nuclear Research (CERN), Brookhaven National Laboratory (BNL), the University of Georgia, United States, and Dresden University of Technology, Germany, to name a few. The output of all of these institutions dwarfed KAUST's in 2012, but KAUST's impressive trajectory since then has seen its WFC shoot to 72 in 2015, overtaking these heavy-hitters.

The country's science development ambitions have been backed by action. Since 2008, the country has embarked on a multi-tiered strategy that will see the Kingdom overhaul its science infrastructure, build high-spec labs, secure grants for research in priority areas in applied science, and link science to industries that drive the economy.

The strategy, broken into four stages to be implemented by 2030, aims to eventually “see Saudi Arabia become a leader in Asia and give it an economic power based on science,” says Abdulaziz Al-Swailem, vice president of scientific research support at King Abdulaziz City for Science and Technology (KACST).

532S13a-i2.jpg

The Saudi Human Genome Project will sequence 100,000 human genomes to conduct biomedical research in the Saudi population. Image: Fayez Nureldine/AFP/Getty Images

Saudi Arabia's march to the top Saudi Arabia's efforts to boost its scientific research have been paying off, with its output in the Nature Index (WFC) rising steadily over the years. The two graphs below highlight Saudi Arabia's rise compared to other nations, both overall and for chemistry.

Overall output In 2012 Saudi Arabia's overall output in the index was below all the countries shown, but continuous efforts have seen the Kingdom's WFC rise to overtake them all in 2015.

532S13a-g1.jpg

Chemistry More marked than its overall rise, Saudi Arabia has made great strides in chemistry. After accelerated growth, which saw the Kingdom's chemistry WFC triple since 2012, it has outshone many larger players in the field in 2015.

532S13a-g2.jpg

The Kingdom's science investments focus on applied research that feeds directly into the country's industrial interests, particularly the oil and energy sector. But even in its strong subjects, chemistry and the physical sciences, Saudi Arabia's WFC remains modest compared to big players in Asia like China, Japan and South Korea.

“Saudi Arabia could look to some successful emerging economies for inspiration.”

To truly swim comfortably with these bigger fish, Saudi Arabia may benefit from looking at successful emerging economies in Asia.

One inspiration could be India. In addition to multi-disciplinary scientific and technical advancements that have improved its output in the index from 736.5 to 901.4 in the past four years, the subcontinental giant has joined the exclusive club of countries that have launched successful space missions.

Like Saudi Arabia, India's leading research institutes focus on chemistry, and their total output currently outstrips their Saudi Arabian counterparts by almost a factor of seven (the latter surpassing 472 in 2015, while the former is 66.5).

India's prowess in chemistry is something that Saudi Arabia can aspire to, considering that working conditions for researchers in the Kingdom are more conducive.

India's science ecosystem is far from perfect. Research funding cannot keep up with inflation and a general slowdown in the country's economy. In addition, commentators from the research community say the funding processes are lengthy, bureaucratic, and provide little feedback when applications for grants are turned down. Meanwhile, Saudi Arabia's healthy stream of oil revenue provides assured funding for the country's state-of-the-art research facilities.

While India has slightly increased spending and dedicated US$1.19 billion for the next fiscal year (2016–2017) for science, it has around 700 universities and 200,000 full-time researchers drawing on the same funding pot. By contrast, Saudi Arabia has pledged an education and training budget of US$50.9 billion for next year, which includes higher education and scientific research. With a total population of just 30 million, it has a much lower number of full-time researchers competing for the available resources.

Another impressive trajectory that Saudi Arabia might look to emulate is that of Singapore, which has a smaller population as well and has managed to climb high in the index. Like the Kingdom, Singapore also has a focus on chemistry research, and it has put together a similar top-down national science strategy for research institutes across the country. Both countries have strong collaborations with top universities around the world and are welcoming of foreign researchers in their efforts to drive innovation.

Mansour Alghamdi, director of the general directorate of scientific awareness and publishing at KACST, is optimistic that Saudi Arabia can bridge the large gap that currently exists in the volume of scientific output between it and such countries as India and Singapore.

“The Kingdom of Saudi Arabia has a clear plan to do so and it has the resources,” he says.

Future growth

An internationally rising star This graph shows KAUST's rise compared to a selection of other institutions*. *Institutions shown are those that were furthest above KAUST in 2012, have experienced overall growth in WFC by 2015 and have been overtaken by KAUST in 2015. For clarity, only 2012 and 2015 data points are shown.

532S13a-g3.jpg

In 2012, Saudi's ranking in research output, with a WFC of 52.8, meant it was comparable with countries like South Africa, Turkey and Iran, all hovering around the 60–70 mark. Its WFC stood way below countries like Mexico, Hungary, Chile, Greece and Argentina.

532S13a-i3.jpg

532S13a-i4.jpg

Saudi Arabian researchers benefit from cutting-edge labs and generous funding that has boosted the country's R&D. Image: Top: KACST; Bottom: KAUST

Four years later, the country's research outlook is very different and it is surpassing countries like Argentina, Mexico and Hungary in the index, and levelling the playing field with Chile. Chemistry research led the country's rapid rise to surpass these countries, but its life sciences and physical sciences WFCs of 8.5 and 31.5 still lag behind.

However, the Kingdom's AC has been steadily growing in these two fields over the past four years, hinting at the ever-increasing significance of international collaborations. It seems that Saudi Arabian researchers are casting their nets ever wider and are participating in publishing more articles, to the detriment of the WFC accredited for these articles.

Though international collaboration has proved fruitful, Saudi Arabia must keep a focus on nurturing home-grown talent, says Nasser Al-Aqeeli, dean of research at King Fahd University of Petroleum & Minerals (KFUPM), based in Dhahran's 'techno valley' in the eastern region of the Kingdom. In the next five years, he says, the country will focus on a programme for national capacity building.

A good first step was the Saudi government's decision to create a large scholarship programme in 2005, arguably the largest in the world, which has seen more than 200,000 young Saudi Arabians studying abroad. This makes Saudi Arabian students in the United States the fourth largest bloc of expatriate students, following those of China, India and South Korea. The government hopes these students will come back and drive a scientific culture in the country.

“Its rise up the ranks depends on a 'self-correcting mechanism' of a slow start to sustainable growth.”

Saudi Arabia is also looking to increase its applied research focus, which is an integral part of the current phase of its national science strategy, while securing good funding for basic research as well. Al-Aqeeli says that Saudi's journey involves what he termed a “self-correcting mechanism” where the country is having a slow start in high-impact research, but a more sustainable one. An eventual future move towards basic research might help Saudi Arabia's research capacity to mature.

https://www.nature.com/articles/532S13a

A few days ago Saudi Arabian students won gold medals in an international physics and science olympiad in Latvia. Will post the article in a few minutes when I find it.

Saudi foundation wins gold, bronze in European Physics Olympiad

RIYADH: Azan Al-Majnooni and Hisham Al-Maliki, of the King Abdul Aziz and his Companions Foundation for Giftedness and Creativity (Mawhiba), won gold and bronze medals respectively at the European Physics Olympiad (EUPHO) 2019, in Riga, Latvia.
The contest ran from May 31 to June 4, and the Saudi duo were praised for their awards by the secretary-general of Mawhiba, Dr. Saud bin Saeed Al-Mathami.
Al-Mathami stressed that the accomplishments were achieved thanks to government support for the sciences and the foundation. This was the first time the Kingdom had taken part in EUPHO, which hosted 26 other nations.
“This comes as an extension to the march toward achieving the targets of the Kingdom’s Vision 2030 through improving education and building a solid base for a talented generation, capable of realizing the aspirations of a state able to rely on creativity and innovation as a means to achieve,” he said.
The secretary-general added that Saudi Arabia paid great attention to gifted and talented citizens, catering their needs and requirements, upgrading services and programs supporting them, and creating the right environment to grow and develop their abilities.
Al-Mathami underlined that this victory was the result of fruitful and constructive cooperation between Mawhiba and King Abdullah University of Science and Technology and the Royal Commission for Jubail and Yanbu.
EUPHO is an international student contest, first held in 2017 in Estonia, and then in Russia 12 months later.

http://www.arabnews.com/node/1506936/saudi-arabia

Here is a statistic:

As of 2018, Saudi Arabia ranks 28 worldwide in terms of high-quality research output according to the renowned scientific journal Nature.[564] This makes Saudi Arabia the best performing Middle Eastern, Arab and Muslim country.

Saudi Arabia spends 8.8 % of its gross domestic product on education, compared with the global average of 4.6%, which is nearly double the global average on education.[565]


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saudi_Arabia

Courtesy of @The SC

Saudi Crown Prince commends $76.5bn non-oil revenue in 2018

Saudi Arabia’s non-oil revenue has more than doubled between 2014 and 2018 to $76.5bn (SAR287bn), and Crown Prince HRH Mohammed Bin Salman bin Abdulaziz Al Saud said this growth underscores the kingdom’s economic achievements as outlined by the goals of its Vision 2030 long-term diversification programme.

The Crown Prince said Saudi Arabia’s economic and structural reforms are steadily moving to achieve the targets of Vision 2030, which is also accounted for in the 2019 budget. The document was approved by Custodian of the Two Holy Mosques, HRH King Salman bin Abdulaziz Al Saud of Saudi Arabia, on 18 December, 2018.

Calling financial stability a fundamental pillar of economic progress, the Crown Prince said reforms introduced in Saudi Arabia over the last two years have directly contributed to the kingdom’s steady reduction in budget deficit. The kingdom announced a budgetary shortfall for the sixth year in a row as part of its 2019 budget. On 18 December, Saudi announced that its projected 2019 deficit of $36.2bn (SAR136bn) is 32% lower than the corresponding value expected for 2018, $52bn (SAR195bn).

But it is the growth of non-oil revenues that stands out in Saudi Arabia’s 2019 budget announcement. In 2014, non-oil earnings worth $33.9bn (SAR127bn) contributed 12% to Saudi Arabia’s total revenue, and this number has surged to 32% in 2018, when the corresponding figure is valued at $76.5bn. In a statement, Saudi Arabia’s Minister of Finance, Mohammed Al-Jadaan, said this growth is “largely attributed to the continued implementation of economic reforms and initiatives such as value-added tax (VAT) and energy price reforms”.

https://www.constructionweekonline....prince-commends-765bn-non-oil-revenue-in-2018

2017 mind you..


Crowning achievements


1- Saudi Vision 2030

On April 25, 2016, then deputy crown prince put forth the ambitious Vision 2030 project, aimed at pulling Saudi's economy away from its dependence on oil, implementing structural reforms, and opening the country to diversified sources of income and investments.

2-Saudi PMO

Then deputy crown prince was also behind the launching of Saudi National Transformation Plan (NTP) 2020 across 24 government bodies operating in the economic and development sectors, and most importantly having in 2016 initiated the Project Management Office (PMO), which puts certain consultancies in position to bring more efficiency to the public sector, and mediate issues related to government services.

3- Aramco IPO

In October 2016, it was announced that Aramco was selling 5% of its shares for an estimated value of $100bn, based on a $2trn estimation that the government has put out. The sale, orchestrated by then deputy crown prince, will take place in 2018.

4- Saudi women driving

The Saudi crown prince sponsored the Saudi lifting the world's only ban on women driving, with implementation in June 2018 to allow for the proper laws and procedures to take effect. Already, many advertisers, such as Coca Cola have taken advantage of this and put their products behind the wheel as well.

5- Saudi entertainment

Keen on attracting tourists, but also on keeping Saudis in the country instead of seeing them travel away on tourism, the crown prince was behind the idea of launching a $2.7bn entertainment firm heralding a new era for the kingdom that could relax previously stringent rules on movie viewing, and theatre, among others.

6- NEOM + 50 virgin islands

Virgin Group founder Sir Richard Branson announced his intent to invest in a Red Sea project that turn 50 Saudi Arabian islands into luxury tourism destinations, and the $500bn 100% renewable NEOM city by the Red Sea, with SoftBank investing $$billions into the project as well. Both development projects were launched by the crown prince.

7- VOIP

The crown prince approved Saudi Arabia's lifting of its ban on voice calls such as Skype,WhatsApp and other applications, whereas this was not legally possible before, and with it, a new era of open communication was launched.


https://www.ameinfo.com/industry/finance/crown-prince-mohammed-bin-salmans-top-7-achievements

The Wilayat al-Faqih drone praising the Iranian Mullah regime and their "morality police" in another thread (one-liner) again just a few minutes ago.:lol:

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/morality-police-hit-irans-restaurants.622491/page-4

Talk about a troll.
 
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can you stop filling the threat with baseless posts?

what was factually incorrect?

maybe English is not your first language so let me help

"The petroleum sector accounts for roughly 87% of budget revenues, 42% of GDP, and 90% of export earnings"

anything else is just talk

https://www.forbes.com/places/saudi-arabia/
 
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again I understand English is not your first language so let me help

its not 10 years old it says date at the top of the article Dec 2018, how does that equate to 10 years?

total Saudi exports in 2017 were $170 billion according to Forbes 90% is petroleum sector

that means $17 of non-petroleum exports

that puts you behind Libya and Luxembourg, which was just of my original statement

if this was a election it would be called a land slide
 
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can you stop filling the threat with baseless posts?

what was factually incorrect?

maybe English is not your first language so let me help

"The petroleum sector accounts for roughly 87% of budget revenues, 42% of GDP, and 90% of export earnings"

anything else is just talk

https://www.forbes.com/places/saudi-arabia/

That is 10 years outdated data and it is factually wrong as already showcased above and in this thread alone.

KSA is the richest Muslim nation in terms of natural resources AND minerals. One of the richest in the entire world in fact. Those are OUR resources. Oil is just one thing out of dozens that we have been blessed with.

As of 2018, Saudi Arabia ranks 28 worldwide in terms of high-quality research output according to the renowned scientific journal Nature.[564] This makes Saudi Arabia the best performing Middle Eastern, Arab and Muslimcountry.

Saudi Arabia spends 8.8 % of its gross domestic product on education, compared with the global average of 4.6%, which is nearly double the global average on education.[565]


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saudi_Arabia

Saudi Crown Prince commends $76.5bn non-oil revenue in 2018

Saudi Arabia’s non-oil revenue has more than doubled between 2014 and 2018 to $76.5bn (SAR287bn), and Crown Prince HRH Mohammed Bin Salman bin Abdulaziz Al Saud said this growth underscores the kingdom’s economic achievements as outlined by the goals of its Vision 2030 long-term diversification programme.

The Crown Prince said Saudi Arabia’s economic and structural reforms are steadily moving to achieve the targets of Vision 2030, which is also accounted for in the 2019 budget. The document was approved by Custodian of the Two Holy Mosques, HRH King Salman bin Abdulaziz Al Saud of Saudi Arabia, on 18 December, 2018.

Calling financial stability a fundamental pillar of economic progress, the Crown Prince said reforms introduced in Saudi Arabia over the last two years have directly contributed to the kingdom’s steady reduction in budget deficit. The kingdom announced a budgetary shortfall for the sixth year in a row as part of its 2019 budget. On 18 December, Saudi announced that its projected 2019 deficit of $36.2bn (SAR136bn) is 32% lower than the corresponding value expected for 2018, $52bn (SAR195bn).

But it is the growth of non-oil revenues that stands out in Saudi Arabia’s 2019 budget announcement. In 2014, non-oil earnings worth $33.9bn (SAR127bn) contributed 12% to Saudi Arabia’s total revenue, and this number has surged to 32% in 2018
, when the corresponding figure is valued at $76.5bn. In a statement, Saudi Arabia’s Minister of Finance, Mohammed Al-Jadaan, said this growth is “largely attributed to the continued implementation of economic reforms and initiatives such as value-added tax (VAT) and energy price reforms”.

https://www.constructionweekonline....prince-commends-765bn-non-oil-revenue-in-2018

Add to that one of the biggest potentials for growth and in general in the entire developing world hence the Saudi Arabian economy consistently being predicted to be in the top 15 in the future (2030, 2040, 2050). So please continue crying while praising the Iranian Mullah regime "morality police". Wonder which sect that you belong too, lol, hence the bias.

Will you take over with this Mullah troll bro? I simply don't bother with too much stupidity and too many idiotic one-liners like this troll is a master of. @The SC
 
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