Sarkozy challenges Turkey to face its history

[RedBeard]

According to Turkish media

Today, the Mexican Senate adopted a resolution recognizing genocide committed by Armenians in Khojaly. They have commited a genocide over the Azeri population there in 1992 just like they did in the 1913 era.

Excellent timing!

Thank you, Mexico.

 

[idune]

Turkey has and should fight French interference and bully. But it is also questionable why Turkey went along with French to commit mass killing if not genocide in Libya? We all know by now what atrocity French led NATO forces had committed in Libya in the name of protecting civilians. And it was eye opening how Turkish govt supported it. Now French is back stabbing its partner.

Its puzzling why Turkish (perhaps I do not know enough of internal Turkish criticism) people are not voicing their opposition to be part of EU, which is failing. Why Turkish people did not oppose western/French atrocity that killed thousands of Libyans?

 

[RedBeard]

Turkey has and should fight French interference and bully. But it is also questionable why Turkey went along with French to commit mass killing if not genocide in Libya? We all know by now what atrocity French led NATO forces had committed in Libya in the name of protecting civilians. And it was eye opening how Turkish govt supported it. Now French is back stabbing its partner.

Its puzzling why Turkish (perhaps I do not know enough of internal Turkish criticism) people are not voicing their opposition to be part of EU, which is failing. Why Turkish people did not oppose western/French atrocity that killed thousands of Libyans?

Only humanitarian mission, aid to Libyans, wounded libyans were moved to Turkey treated in our hospitals. Turkish navy evacuated some 25.000 Turks and other nationals from Libya.

 

[Saithan]

Turkey has and should fight French interference and bully. But it is also questionable why Turkey went along with French to commit mass killing if not genocide in Libya? We all know by now what atrocity French led NATO forces had committed in Libya in the name of protecting civilians. And it was eye opening how Turkish govt supported it. Now French is back stabbing its partner.

Its puzzling why Turkish (perhaps I do not know enough of internal Turkish criticism) people are not voicing their opposition to be part of EU, which is failing. Why Turkish people did not oppose western/French atrocity that killed thousands of Libyans?

Turkey did not participate in the bombing etc. missions in libya, if you try just a little bit, you'll be able to google a lot of articles about Turkeys part.

My question to you is rather this. Are you simply ignoring that turkey did not participate same way as French, Denmark, UK, and just focusing on the fact that NATO went into the mission and thus your trail of logic can only conclude that Turkey is just as guilty as French, Denmark etc. ?

That thing with only looking at one side of history is what the west does, and are very good at it. Nowhere is it mentioned that during WWI Turks also died in the fight against Armenian bands that joined the russians.

What about the arab league what are they guilty of ?

 

[Azatavrear]

have the law been passed?

the way those stupid french politicians make us look, i wish we had made that "genocide" and wiped every single Armenian of the face of earth!

tipi sikilmis herif!

I thought Turkey did very well.....you wiped out just about the whole Armenian population from their historic lands. You should be proud of that no?

 

[turkaholic]

I thought Turkey did very well.....you wiped out just about the whole Armenian population from their historic lands. You should be proud of that no?

Right genius. You were just sitting on your sorry azzes while we were fighting a world war, and just for a change, we started killing Armenians... I wonder if the killings were due to you low life mofos backstabbing the Turks, forming gangs, and allying with the Russians.

 

[RedBeard]

FM to Turkish envoys: Speak out to Armenians against genocide claims

Turkey's Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoglu addresses the opening ceremony of the Turkish Ambassadors Summit in Ankara on Dec. 23, 2011.​

​

23 December 2011 / TODAYSZAMAN.COM,


In the face of approval of a bill by the French parliament that penalizes denial of Armenian “genocide” in France, Turkish Foreign Minister Ahmet Davutoğlu has urged Turkish ambassadors to speak out to every single Armenian around the world against the “bigotry of France.”


Addressing Turkish ambassadors serving overseas on the first day of a week long Foreign Ministry conference organized to conduct a comprehensive review of Turkish foreign policy and recent developments in international politics, Davutoğlu slammed France over the approval of the bill that makes denial of the alleged Armenian genocide a crime punishable by a one-year prison sentence and a fine of 45,000 euros.

“We will go and talk to every single Armenian against the bigotry stance France has taken. We will tell them how France and other countries create trouble among us,” Davutoğlu said.

Noting that the French Assembly had dictated how Europeans should think about the alleged Armenian genocide, Davutoğlu added, “This is no different than dictatorships in the Middle East.”

“I am appealing to European intellectuals. Protect your values. We will already raise our voice. We will go and say we do not recognize [the alleged genocide] wherever this is legally forbidden. We will raise our voice at the European Parliament. If Europeans do not protect these values, we will,” the Turkish minister said.

“It is France that is now being tested, not Turkey. The French Senate is being tested,” he added.

The highly controversial bill was approved by the French National Assembly on Thursday despite strong protests from Turkey. The bill still needs Senate approval, but once it passed the lower house, the Turkish government ended bilateral political and economic contact, suspended military cooperation and ordered his country's ambassador home for consultation. Turkey argues that France is trampling freedom of expression and that French President Nicolas Sarkozy is on a vote-getting mission before the April presidential elections.

Davutoğlu said the measures against France announced by Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdoğan are only initial measures, signaling that Ankara will introduce additional sanctions. “We have nothing in our history to shy away from. We draw our strength from our history,” he declared.

FM to Turkish envoys: Speak out to Armenians against genocide claims

 

[RedBeard]

Gül urges France to withdraw from Minsk Group if genocide bill enacted

President Abdullah Gül​

23 December 2011 / TODAYSZAMAN.COM


Turkish President Abdullah Gül has said France should withdraw from the Minsk Group if a bill recently approved by the French Assembly that aims to penalize denial of the alleged Armenian genocide becomes law.


France, along with the US and Russia, co-chairs the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe's (OSCE) Minsk Group, which has been trying to settle the Nagorno-Karabakh dispute since 1990s but has thus far failed to provide a viable solution to the issue.

Speaking to reporters on Friday, a day after the approval of the highly controversial bill in the French assembly despite strong Turkish opposition, Gül said France should withdraw from the Minsk Group if the bill is approved by the Senate and becomes law because the country will lose its impartial position in the settling of the Nagorno-Karabakh dispute.

Ethnic Armenian separatists, backed by Armenia, fought a war to overthrow Azerbaijani control over Nagorno-Karabakh in the early 1990s at the time of the collapse of the Soviet Union. Separatists also seized land surrounding Nagorno-Karabakh. Turkey closed its border with Armenia in 1993 in support of Azerbaijan during its conflict with Armenia. Turkey backs Azerbaijani claims to Nagorno-Karabakh, which has a large number of ethnic Armenian residents.

Gül also criticized French President Nicolas Sarkozy for “being prejudiced against Turkey.” Recalling that the French president has not responded to Gül's phone calls for days, Gül complained that “heads of state talk to each other even during war time.” He said Sarkozy's stance reveals his prejudices against Turkey.

The lower house of the French parliament voted on Thursday in favor of a controversial bill penalizing the denial of the alleged Armenian genocide, ignoring massive Turkish protests against the measure.

The bill sets a punishment of up to a year in prison and a fine of 45,000 euros ($59,000) for those who deny or "outrageously minimize" the alleged genocide of Armenians in eastern Anatolia during the final years of the Ottoman Empire, putting such action on par with denial of the Holocaust.

The measure now needs to be passed in the senate, the upper house of parliament, before it will come into effect.


Gül urges France to withdraw from Minsk Group if genocide bill enacted

 

[RedBeard]

Sarkozy defends vote, calls on Turkey to respect French views

France's President Nicolas Sarkozy arrives to attend the funeral ceremony for the late former President Vaclav Havel at Prague Castle's St. Vitus Cathedral December 23, 2011. (Photo: Reuters)​

23 December 2011 / TODAYSZAMAN.COM,


French President Nicolas Sarkozy urged Turkey on Friday to respect its views after Ankara suspended political and economic contact with Paris in protest of a bill passed by the French parliament Thursday that criminalizes denial of Armenian genocide claims.


“I respect [the] beliefs of our Turkish friends. Turkey is a great country, great civilization, but the Turks should also respect our beliefs,” Sarkozy told the French press on the sidelines of a funeral for former Czech President Vaclav Havel in Prague. His remarks were published in Turkish by the Anatolia news agency.

“France does not teach anyone a lesson, but it does not want to be taught a lesson either. France sets its policies in a sovereign matter,” he added, asserting that his country does not need permission from other states when deciding its policies. “France has beliefs and respect for human rights, memories,” he said.

Turkey categorically rejects charges of genocide, saying deaths occurred on both sides when Anatolian Armenians revolted against the Ottoman Empire for independence during World War I in collaboration with the invading Russian army. Turkish leaders vowed to bring to the fore French atrocities in Algeria and other countries on international platforms after Thursday's vote.

Turkey is already frustrated with Sarkozy because of his staunch opposition to its stalled European Union bid and his apparent rivalry with Turkey for a preeminent role in Middle Eastern politics.


Sarkozy defends vote, calls on Turkey to respect French views

 

[RedBeard]

Turkey's Erdoğan: French vote reveals gravity of hostility towards Muslims

Turkish Prime Minister Erdoğan shows a copy of a 1526 letter sent by Ottoman Sultan Süleyman the Magnificent to French King Francis I in response to the French king's request for help after being captured by the Spanish King Charles V during the Battle of Pavia. (Photo: AA)​

23 December 2011 / TODAYSZAMAN.COM,


Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdoğan has said Thursday's French vote on a bill that criminalizes the denial of the 1915 mass killing of Armenians by Ottoman Turks as genocide has clearly revealed the gravity of hostility against Muslims in France and Europe.


“The vote in France, where there are nearly 5 million Muslims, clearly showed that the extent of racism, discrimination and anti-Muslims sentiments has reached dangerous levels,” Erdoğan said on Friday at a conference on "Change in Muslim Societies and Role of Women" in İstanbul.

Accusing French President Nicolas Sarkozy of “trying to win [April's presidential] elections over hostility towards Turks and Muslims,” Erdoğan said Thursday's vote is meaningful in that the bill was approved with only 55 lawmakers in attendance, out of 577 in total.

“Mr. Sarkozy cannot find genocide in the history of Turkey. Once he looks into Turkish history, he cannot find anything other than Turks' tolerance, help and compassion,” Erdoğan said.

The Turkish prime minister also read excerpts from a 1526 letter sent by Ottoman Sultan Süleyman the Magnificent to French King Francis I in response to the French king's request for help after being captured by the Spanish King Charles V during the Battle of Pavia. The Ottoman sultan said in the letter he would help the French king.

Erdoğan said he had earlier presented a copy of Süleyman's letter to Sarkozy. “I think he did not read it.”

Erdoğan also accused Paris of committing “genocide” in Algeria, a former colony. “France massacred an estimated 15 percent of the Algerian population starting from 1945. This is genocide,” he said. “They were mercilessly martyred,” he said, adding that Algerians were burned in ovens.

Erdoğan also said President Sarkozy's father might have direct knowledge about the French “massacres” in Algeria.

“If the French president, Mr. Sarkozy, doesn't know about this genocide he should go and ask his father, Paul Sarkozy.”

“His father served in the French Legion in Algeria in the 1940s. I am sure he would have lots to tell his son about the French massacres in Algeria,” the Turkish premier said.

French legislators passed a bill making it a crime to deny that the mass killings of Armenians by Ottoman Turks nearly a century ago constituted genocide despite Turkish opposition.

The bill drew strong criticism from Turkey, which denies the genocide label and insists the 1915 massacres occurred during civil unrest as the Ottoman Empire collapsed, with losses on both sides.

The French bill still needs Senate approval.

Opposition supports sanctions against France

Meanwhile, Turkey's main opposition party has also pledged full support to the government in its campaign against France. Republican People's Party (CHP) leader Kemal Kılıçdaroğlu said on Friday that his party sees the issue as a “national problem” and will act in cooperation with the government on this matter. “France should get rid of this shame,” he said referring to the bill.

He said he voiced his support on measures against France during a visit he paid to Erdoğan on Wednesday.


Turkey's Erdo

 

[NeutralCitizen]

Russia Alone holds the keys for Azerbaijan to take karabakh, In the end Azerbaijan will go with Russia.

 

[TrMhMt]

Russia Alone holds the keys for Azerbaijan to take karabakh, In the end Azerbaijan will go with Russia.

Yes you are right ...

 

[Gaara]

I thought Turkey did very well.....you wiped out just about the whole Armenian population from their historic lands. You should be proud of that no?

When Seljuks came to Anatolia and beated Byzantine Empire at the war of Malazgirt in 1071, those historical lands' governance were passed to Turks. Armenians and Turks lived in those historical lands together for almost 800 years.

At the era of Ottoman Empire, Armenians were not taken into army just like all the non-muslim (gayrimuslim in Ottoman Turkish) nations (millets in Ottoman Turkish) such as Jews, Greeks, Serbians, etc.. They were exempted from being soldiers by paying an insignificant tax. Many of them became statesmen. (There is list below about this) They were also the main craftsmen and tradesmen of the empire with the Jews while the muslim millets of the empire were defending their country in the battle fields. Armenians got richer and richer because they control all the bussiness. Nobody touched their wealths, nobody even thought of touching their wealths. Untill the end of 19th century.

At that time, Ottomans began to feel the pressures of Russians, so-called protector of all Orthodoxes in the world. They systematically armed Armenians who lived in Ottoman Empire and provoked them to fight with local muslims in those lands to weaken Ottomans. Local muslims especially Kurds founded a small army called Hamidiye Brigades to defend themselves.

When the World War I began, the atrocities of Armenians became unbearable. Local muslims asked Ottoman Government, Committee of Union and Progress, (Ittihad ve Terakki Partisi in Ottoman Turkish), to protect them against Russian backed Armenians. However, Ottomans were fighting with Britain and France at the fronts of Baghdat, Cairo, Palestine, Canakkale and Balkans and there were not enough soldiers to send to those historical lands. So, the government passed a law, which we today know with the name of Tehcir Law, ordering the banishment of Armenians to the other Ottoman parts which would be safe for them. But because of the inadequacies of the war many Armenians died and because the reactions of the local muslims many were killed while insufficient soldiers tried to protect them. (Many commanders were executed by the ottoman courts because they had failed to protect Armenians from the local muslims after the incidents, while the war goes on.)

What do we get from what I write? Here is what I get: Armenians who had been treated more than equally by the Ottomans at their strongest times, 16th and 17th century, betrayed Ottomans when the empire got sick. Have you ever asked yourself why Ottoman sultans hadn't banished Armenians while Ottoman Empire was the ruler of the world, while the French king were kissing the *** of Suleyman the Magnificent, while nobody could even think of critizing them for what they had done; but choosed to banish Armenians while their weakest time in their history? The answer is very simple: Armenians betrayed Ottomans who had protected them for centuries.


Here is the list of Ottoman Armenian Statesmen:
----------------------------------------------
Ministers:
Agop Kazasyan Pasha--Minister of Finance (Maliye Bakan&#305
Gabriel Noradunkyan-- Minister of Foreign Affairs (Dışişleri Bakan&#305
Mareşal Garabet Artin Davut - Minister of Communication and Prosperity (PTT ve Bayındırlık Bakan&#305
Ohannes Sakız Pasha- Minister of Treasury (Hazine-i Hassa Bakan&#305
Bedros Hallacyan- Minister of Prosperity (Bayındırlık Bakan&#305
Oskan Mardikyan- Minister of Communication (PTT Bakan&#305
Sakız Ohannes Pasha- Minister of Treasury (Hazine-i Hassa Bakan&#305

Senators:
Mareşal Ohannes Kuyumcuyan
Abraham Erenyan Pasha
Manuk Azaryan

Representatives (Some of 31 people):
Agop Babikyan-Tekirdag
Kegam Dergarabedyan- Mus
Karakin Pastırmacıyan- Erzurum
Vahan Papazyan- Van
Artin Boşgezenyan- Halep
Krikor Zohrep- İstanbul
Bedros Hallacyan-İstanbul
Karabet Tomayan- Kayseri
Nazaret Dagavaryan- Sivas

Armenian Ambassadors:
Dikran Aleksanyan- Brussel Ambassador
Yetvart Zohrab- London Ambassador
Dikran Tıngır- Berlin Ambassador
Garabet Artin Davud- Berlin, Vienna Ambassador
Mareşal Ohannes Kuyumcuyan-Roma Ambassador

Member of State Council (Danistay)
Andon Tıngır Yaver Pasha,
Abraham Yeramyan Pasha,
Mihran Düz,
Bedros Kuyumcuyan.

 

[milvipes]

I though xenophobic bigots like this are only found in the back countries of Alabama, who believe that antagonizing all "colored heathens" is the sacred duty of all good ole' white Christians.
First he threatened to boycott the Beijing Olympics, then the invasion of Libya, and now out all NATO allies (most have their own skeletons in the closets), he singles out Turkiye for castigation. One can't help but to wonder why Christian NATO nations are spared of similar scrutiny.