SAC - FC-31 Grey Falcon Stealth aircraft for PAF : Updates & Debate

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

The Air Chief stated Pakistan will have an aircraft ready in 5 years time and that China is going to provide technical assistance to the aviation sector in Pakistan. From where i see it, the only way the project will bear an aircraft in 5 years is if PAF has bought the rights to J-31 or is acquiring full ToT for the J-31 and will subsequently produce its own aircraft. There is no way that Pakistan with limited resources will be able to 1)learn how to design and aircraft let alone a 5th gen one, 2) learn how to design, manufacture, and mass produce a modern jet engine, 3)develop top notch avionics including radar, ECCM, ECM ect.

What it could do is scrounge up enough money to acquire the project en whole like Turks did with ATAK and get the chinese to teach them as they go. That is still a great option /accomplishment, and has been the pattern with Azmat FAC, Zarb, Buarraq UAV and Barq Missile. They buy the production rights and develop their own variants by the second generation of the system. The chinese infact started the exact same way. Infact the JF-17 is the first aircraft completely built in Chinese know how (J-10 has clear Lavi design themes albeit may only have been a stepping stone).

The ACM could have also meant first prototype (or demonstrator) in 5 years.

 

[Tank131]

The ACM could have also meant first prototype (or demonstrator) in 5 years.

Be it prototype, tech demonstrator or production model, i think the critques all hold true. I honestly believe that the best way forward for AvDI in Pakistan is to acquire the rights for J-31 and gain the technical know how to build aircraft through this. Then develop your tech based on the variations and modifications you make to the existing systems. The Chinese did the exact same thing acquiring Mig-19 and developed that into the venerable F-6 and A-5 and FT-6. They took the Mig-21 amd made the F-7, JL-9 and even gave a basis for the J-8.

Pakistan can take the J-31, make it the FC-31 and give rise to a new variation of the aircraft.

 

[The Accountant]

The ACM could have also meant first prototype (or demonstrator) in 5 years.

I think we can't even produce demonstrator model in 5 years ... 5 years will be consumed only in the establishment of infrastructure required ... In JF17 the design research was done by Chinese whereas Pakistani's input was mostly towards the performance criterias ... 3 years back we were even running to Chinese to redesign our Mirage rebuild factory into thunder's R&M factory ... As of now our capabilities are very limited

 

[Khadim e Darul Ehsaan]

Dnt know why our todays jet have very low ground clearance, jf17 has very small height from ground likewise j31 has even more smaller :-/

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Dnt know why our todays jet have very low ground clearance, jf17 has very small height from ground likewise j31 has even more smaller :-/

But FC-31 also has an internal payload bay, so the lower ground clearance isn't an issue as the munition will in reality be stored well above that (within the bay).

 

[messiach]

Good. Cat is finally out @Quwa

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

Good. Cat is finally out @Quwa

Still some uncertainty. The PAF has two routes: (1) Accelerate with an off-the-shelf FC-31 purchase with local licensed manufacturing of airframe and platform access for custom subsystem and weapons integration. (2) Original design (in collaboration with China), which enables for investing in Pakistan's design and R&D capacities.

While (2) is certainly riskier and requires more time, but it will result in raising human capital, establishing R&D infrastructure, etc that will come in handy for the very long-term. (2) also means a chance for Pakistan to own most of the IP and to profit off it the most.

 

[kurutoga]

Originally design is just too expensive. Minimal 5 billion USD, plus production cost. Easily a 7-8 billion project. Almost one full year of Pak defense budget.

 

[MastanKhan]

Dnt know why our todays jet have very low ground clearance, jf17 has very small height from ground likewise j31 has even more smaller :-/

Hi,

That is a very important question that you asked---.

The Paf screwed up big time---it did not realize that it would have Ra'ad missile in its inventory down the road when it designed the JF17---.

But it should have known about it---just like the F16---the original design never had enough space under the belly for a large missile---like the Mirage's.

 

[Thorough Pro]

I am sure you pulled these 7-8 billion Dollar figure from your Dollar an hour stinky indian arse

Originally design is just too expensive. Minimal 5 billion USD, plus production cost. Easily a 7-8 billion project. Almost one full year of Pak defense budget.

 

[araz]

I am sure you pulled these 7-8 billion Dollar figure from your Dollar an hour stinky indian arse

That was an uncalled for statement. The fact remains that unless work has been ongoing for the last 5-10 years, or PAC has bought the rights to local production of J31, the time line seems a bit too good to believe. HOwevewr, the two provisos which I have pointed out may well be why Madam Messiach has pointed to the cat being out of the bag.PAF has a history of collaboration with CATIC which may be where one needs to look for for our next production. The extent of collaboration will also be a massive input from the Chinese although as compared to JFT it may well be slightly less. The engine remains a problem unless the Chinese are making tangible headway into mastering the engine technology. So quite a few hurdles to cross still.

 

[Akasa]

Good. Cat is finally out @Quwa

Any insight from your end as to what Project Azm involves? FC-31 or a clean-sheet design?

 

[帅的一匹]

 

[UniverseWatcher]

View attachment 442226

what a beauty

 

[帅的一匹]

what a beauty

Next I want it the same paint job as J20.