Saab keen to partner with India for next version of Tejas

[Centurion2016]

Why why why.....

The world is moving to 5th generation

Why why.more foreign fighters..Of fourth generation era..to license build in India..

By the time India signs deal and start sixth generatikn will have started.

 

[WhyCry]

IAF will only go for one kind of single engine aircraft. That has been repeated numerous times. If its not tejas then its dead.

Gripen can fill the gap but it will be at the cost of tejas. To be fair india cannot make the mk2 better than gripen. So why tejas? India will have to learn from its fair share of mistakes that what works and what does not. This is eventually going to be a major help in AMCA. Saab can actually help in AMCA than in mk2.

Why gripen? Gripen gives an easy way out of the dwindling count of aircraft. In addition, saab can have a MII partner of other projects as well. It is still not an MMRCA but a replacement for mig -21, 27

Why rafale? Its the best candidate except the cost. Just to simplify, the flyaway cost + r&d cost = total cost of aircraft.
The r&d cost itself is $120 million in case of rafales. Hence, the whole issue. This will choke the other programs and an industry that hasn't seen the light of the day. For 126 rafales, all of tejas, AMCA and pak fa are on the line.

Why FA18-SH ? Uses the same engine as tejas, amca. A future development of better thrust or reliability already proposed by GE. Needs development (saab can join as well). Capable of catapault and EMALS(to be done on ford class super carrier). USN main stable. Highly influenced by F15.

Not included is f15 se. I wish it was offered

 

[GURU DUTT]

IAF will only go for one kind of single engine aircraft. That has been repeated numerous times. If its not tejas then its dead.

Gripen can fill the gap but it will be at the cost of tejas. To be fair india cannot make the mk2 better than gripen. So why tejas? India will have to learn from its fair share of mistakes that what works and what does not. This is eventually going to be a major help in AMCA. Saab can actually help in AMCA than in mk2.

Why gripen? Gripen gives an easy way out of the dwindling count of aircraft. In addition, saab can have a MII partner of other projects as well. It is still not an MMRCA but a replacement for mig -21, 27

Why rafale? Its the best candidate except the cost. Just to simplify, the flyaway cost + r&d cost = total cost of aircraft.
The r&d cost itself is $120 million in case of rafales. Hence, the whole issue. This will choke the other programs and an industry that hasn't seen the light of the day. For 126 rafales, all of tejas, AMCA and pak fa are on the line.

Why FA18-SH ? Uses the same engine as tejas, amca. A future development of better thrust or reliability already proposed by GE. Needs development (saab can join as well). Capable of catapault and EMALS(to be done on ford class super carrier). USN main stable. Highly influenced by F15.

Not included is f15 se. I wish it was offered

few things

1. IAF needs a single engined fighter only for point defnce and twin engined for every other role

2. LCA is still 20% cheaper than the half price of grippen while almost as good as grippen

3.Grippen is not coming cause at that matter USA is ready to "deep upgrade" MLU its Blk 30/40/52 F16 to latest F16V level with all the maintainence tooling and overhaul facilities ... so why not F16V instead of grippen ?

4.rafale is coming and in very big numbers for both IAF and IN AF

5.F16V has trumped F-A-18 E/F on MODS radar deu the fact LM is ready to partner with indian co's while boieng wants to go alone

baaki lagge raho

 

[WhyCry]

few things

1. IAF needs a single engined fighter only for point defnce and twin engined for every other role

2. LCA is still 20% cheaper than the half price of grippen while almost as good as grippen

3.Grippen is not coming cause at that matter USA is ready to "deep upgrade" MLU its Blk 30/40/52 F16 to latest F16V level with all the maintainence tooling and overhaul facilities ... so why not F16V instead of grippen ?

4.rafale is coming and in very big numbers for both IAF and IN AF

5.F16V has trumped F-A-18 E/F on MODS radar deu the fact LM is ready to partner with indian co's while boieng wants to go alone

baaki lagge raho

Agree with 1st.

2. True for mk1 but not for mk2. they are estimated to be at 55 mil compared to swedens 85 mil. Both in USD

3. Design hasnt changes with f16s except conformal fuel tanks. Pakistan has access to block 52 but can have at access at later date. But they do have knowledge of the same at this moment.

4. I hope so but the issue is already explained above.

5. FA 18 are due for upgrade but havent been performed yet. F35 is being pursed by marines and they did not order single SH. Growlers were the only enhancement but that too for a specified role. Even if india selects it they need to be upgraded first.

Lage hue hai... Aapki dua se.

 

[zebra7]

Why why why.....

The world is moving to 5th generation

Why why.more foreign fighters..Of fourth generation era..to license build in India..

By the time India signs deal and start sixth generatikn will have started.

Because of the factor called Cost. The Original plan of U.S was 1000 F-22 Raptor, but stoped at less than 200. F-35 was the intelligent project, to bind the NATO, and make them dependent on the U.S control, as before each mission, the software needs to be updated from the Server kept in U.S. With the money invested by several money, U.S in a disguised way keeps developing the next generation Weapons.

So called sixth Gen. aka Stealth IUCAV is the part of the fifth Gen. warfare, a must needed, if needed to face the Stealth enemy i.e which is also equiped with 5th Gen combat plane.

U.S have started working in 7th Gen. plane, and have lead of atleast 2 Decades with the whole world.

In short 4th Gen combat plane is not going to obsolute soon, and would be useful with the upgrades aka 4+ or 4++ gen upgrades.

 

[Centurion2016]

I'm. Confused sorry...

Are India inducting tejas if so how many

Are inducting potentially another singlesteater ie gripen or falcon v if so why and what cost timescale and how any.

Finally if rafale or super hornets again why and how many and timescale

Too much talk too much combat types and way way too late

Su30mki
Mig29
Mirage2000
Jaguar
Tejas
And possible three more types in

Gripen or falcon five
Rafale or hornet s
And fgfa or amca


That is ridiculous and shows no concept or planning just scatter gun approach

 

[zebra7]

1. IAF needs a single engined fighter only for point defnce and twin engined for every other role

IAF had always prefered twin engine. As a matter of facts the most important things that should be understand is that India have maintained, the role based airforce, aka airsuperiority, Air defence, Ground attack, and multirole combat plane, and that should not be compared with the Airforce, with the Multirole combat planes alone.

2. LCA is still 20% cheaper than the half price of grippen while almost as good as grippen

It would be wrong to state that as good as Gripen, but LCA is the one, which is developed by the Indians to fulfill the requirement of the IAF specific.

3.Grippen is not coming cause at that matter USA is ready to "deep upgrade" MLU its Blk 30/40/52 F16 to latest F16V level with all the maintainence tooling and overhaul facilities ... so why not F16V instead of grippen ?

F-16V is the last attempt to get the last order from the global customer. It is however a good product, but US is in search for the partner, which can provide the support and if a market then Sone Pe Suhaga as the US companies are going to be busy with the F-35.

4.rafale is coming and in very big numbers for both IAF and IN AF

Yep no doubt 189 for IAF, and 40+ for Indian Navy

2. True for mk1 but not for mk2. they are estimated to be at 55 mil compared to swedens 85 mil. Both in USD

Cost of the MK-2 should be 45 Million, and could be lowered if produced in number.

5. FA 18 are due for upgrade but havent been performed yet. F35 is being pursed by marines and they did not order single SH. Growlers were the only enhancement but that too for a specified role. Even if india selects it they need to be upgraded first.

US Navy is searching for next generation plane, and it should be the Big, slow bomber without vertical tail. The concept which is Great. U.S wants India, to order F-18, and market that for the Global customer.

 

[Centurion2016]

In the future

Israel will operate three types only

F15,to be upgraded to f15 s
F16sufi and block 52;
And f35,to to replace old f16 blocks

Raf will have just typhoons and f35 both raf and navy.

French rafale only

What is India doing exactly

!

 

[zebra7]

I'm. Confused sorry...

Are India inducting tejas if so how many

Are inducting potentially another singlesteater ie gripen or falcon v if so why and what cost timescale and how any.

Finally if rafale or super hornets again why and how many and timescale

Too much talk too much combat types and way way too late

Su30mki
Mig29
Mirage2000
Jaguar
Tejas
And possible three more types in

Gripen or falcon five
Rafale or hornet s
And fgfa or amca


That is ridiculous and shows no concept or planning just scatter gun approach

No need to get confused

1. LCA MK-1 ordered 120,
2. LCA MK-2 for airforce -- 120 more will be ordered later
3. LCA MK-2 Naval -- 43
4. LCA MK-1 trainer 90 for both IAF and IN

Jaguar Darin 3, Mirrage 2000 UPG, Mig 29UPG will give service till 2030-35

There will be no Gripen or F-16 or F-18 and have been rejected by IAF for good.

FGFA --144 would become our Air Defence/Air superiority fighter plane.
Super Su-30 MKI will become our work horse as Multi Role fighter
AMCA would be the developed for breaching the Air Defence of the Enemy.
Aura Stealth UAV would be doing all risky/dirty work in enemy airspace

Combat hawk and LCA MK-1 would be used for the CAS

 

[GURU DUTT]

In the future

Israel will operate three types only

F15,to be upgraded to f15 s
F16sufi and block 52;
And f35,to to replace old f16 blocks

Raf will have just typhoons and f35 both raf and navy.

French rafale only

What is India doing exactly

!

If MP gets what he wants he wants

LCA MK1A as point defnce and limitred strike role supported by weaponised Hawk

Jaguar D3 deep strike & CAS & rafale as main MRCA for all other roles supported by upgraded M2K and Mig29s and AMCA as and when it comes

for heavy roles/air superiorty its MKI/super sukhoi and PAKFA and FGFA for the future

but if USA gets its way then dont be surprised to see F16V and LCA MK1A for point defnce and strike role

rafale and AMCA for SEAD-DEAD-deep strike role

MKI+ PAKFA/FGFA for air superiorty

 

[zebra7]

In the future

Israel will operate three types only

F15,to be upgraded to f15 s
F16sufi and block 52;
And f35,to to replace old f16 blocks

Raf will have just typhoons and f35 both raf and navy.

French rafale only

What is India doing exactly

!

It is because for small airforce single Multirole aircraft is advantageous.

For a bigger Airforce, The Role specific aircraft for the Air defence/air superirority, Long range Bomber, and Multirole combat plane gives the best advantage. e.g in case of USAF -- F-22 provide the Air Defence, F-35 for Air Strike, F-16/F-18 as Multirole, A-10 for Ground attack and anti armour, B-52 for Ground attack Bomber, and specialized Aircraft for Recce.

 

[Centurion2016]

India cannot be compared to usa

USA is a hyper power the worlds greatest military with global power projection.

 

[GURU DUTT]

India cannot be compared to usa

USA is a hyper power the worlds greatest military with global power projection.

but buying all these is not a luxury for us rather our need as we to be prepared to face a war from two sides in near future by two very potent air forces

 

[zebra7]

India cannot be compared to usa

USA is a hyper power the worlds greatest military with global power projection.

Who is comparing, I gave you an example. Take present Russian Airforce for instance

Mig 29/35 -- Air Defence and Multirole
SU 27/30 SM -- Heavy Air Defence
Su 35 -- Air Strike
Su - 24/25/34 Pullback -- Ground attack Bomber
Su 25/35 -- High altitude Recce
Tu 142 -- Maritime recce and strike

And in future

Pak Fa -- Air Defence
Su -35 -- Strike
Su 34 Pullback/ Pak DA -- Long range Bomber
Su 35 -- Recce
Mig 35 -- Multirole
Su 33 -- Carrier based combat plane

Take Chinese

J-22 -- Air Defence
J-31/Su-35/J16 -- Air Strike
J-10/ Su-27 -- Multirole
J-15 -- Carrier based
Su 30 -- Maritime role
Tu-22m -- Maritime Recce

An Airforce, which have 400 combat plane in its inventory, should stick to Multirole combat plane, which will reduce the infrastucture, training, and spares. Role based combat planes are specialized planes for a specific role but now with the technologies for the Ground attack cheaper Light PGM, kits, and A2G cruise missiles are now available.

For India, IAF wanted to induct Multirole Mirrage 2000 H in large numbers, but due to economics constrain, and unknown reasons, the congress goes for MIG-27, Mig 23, Mig 29 B, Mig 25, and Jaguar IS/IM. A good decission could have been SU-25 instead of MIG-27 with full transfer of technology to HAL for Bomber, Instead of Jaguar IS/IM mark 2 version of Marut, and instead of MIG-23 and MIG-29 B, Mirrage 2000 H in numbers, which could have been easily upgraded to Mirrage 2000 UPG, and could have relief the pressure on the LCA.

 

[Ankit Kumar]

Lol....
I hope they will be first able to deliver Brazil with E/F promise first....