Russian Politician Wants Liaoning Aircraft Carrier Back That China Purchased From Ukraine

[kingQamaR]

I'm aware of the Batch 3 entering into the serial production but not sure about the Batch 4 though

According to a May 2021 report by The Diplomat, some 50 units of the jet are currently in operation. The J-15 is China's first carrier-borne fighter jet, meaning that it was primarily designed for China's growing fleet of aircraft carriers

Take a look at the J-15 fighter jet, the $61 million copy of a Soviet plane picked to wage war from China's aircraft carriers

Chinese J-15 fighter jets on the deck of the Liaoning aircraft carrier during military drills in the Yellow Sea, off China's east coast.Contributor/AFP/STR/China OUT/Getty ImagesChina's touts the J-15 as its first locally made carrier-borne fighter jet.The jet is an unlicensed copy of a...

www.businessinsider.in

That 003 China aircraft carrier is suppose to defend the Taiwan strait., not used as an offensive weapon to project power half way across the world like American warships. It would have been too risky to develop a whole new generation of engine plus catapult system plus new layout all in one go so this step by step approach was the safer bet

 

[doorstar]

May I ask, what's your intention with this post and thread? You post a simply ridiculous story from an Ultra-nationalist Russian idiot and immediately start to bash the Chinese for stupid things!
May I remind you to take a look at this mess and then start thing stones while sitting in a glass-house?

So much on being "behind"!

View attachment 910241




With a carrier force that is not worth the name of a carrier force, a carrier that was barely out at lea, with pilots barely achieving operational carrier-borne experiences on a fighter the IN itself want to get rid off!??

Wow

isn't this super duper carrier being moved around with the help of 6 towing barges/tug boats?

tejas of the oceans

 

[Deino]

isn't this super duper carrier being moved around with the help of 6 towing barges?

tejas of the oceans

I think we should be fair! All other carriers including the Fujian were towed out of their dock for the first moment hitting the waters or their first cruise, as such this is unfair.

My point however is that he uses wrong, dated and false data from unreliable sources, is not up do date and tries to sin an IMO plain stupid story.

 

[S10]

Indian navy pilots can actually land fighters on the deck of aircraft carrier. As opposed to PLAN that has needed Russian pilots to do deck landings on its flat-tops. Some humility is indeed in order....

This is what Indians actually believe. It's as rich as their Galwan claims and Modi having 56" chest.

Truly Jai Hind!

 

[Beast]

"India has decades of experience operating carrier aviation forces while China is still learning,” said John Bradford, the Singapore analyst
View attachment 910239

LOL... And when is Singapore operating an aircraft carrier before. You ask a dog for comment and it must be valid, right?

 

[Solidify]

The venerable Vikrant was but an LHD, a hand-me-down vestige of a faded empire.

New one's diesel electric and not the largest displacement vessel but still good. One should view Indian carriers as semi-expeditionary but mostly coastal defence motherships essentially. Their role is not to fight and sustain a war effort 10s of thousands of miles away.

Pak, much smaller coast line, no immediate threats (apart from us Gangus lol) so their requirements are different, your sub program is well thought out. Going for SSBNs will earn you further sanctions and the ire of the (((shot callers)))

Pak have enough deterrent capability as is, and are being propped up by the Dragon in other more conventional capabilities.. militarily you guys are ok imo. Could do with a carrier at some stage and threaten our Konkan or try to take the Lakshadweeps again in the future someday.. but be ready, coz we ready

Well Pak Navy has deterrent capability.
For Pak Navy its Do or Die situation, what they say "damn if don't damn if you do", something like catch-22.

But just to point out The INS Vikrant carrier is mighty powerful ship with tons of fire-power. I am just day dreaming of Pak Navy owning one day (not likely in future the way current things are) an aircraft carrier, I can only imagine how far in length of aggression to other Mid-East nations it would influence. But dreams are just dreams. Pak Air Force said we have enough aircraft to infiltrate deep into Tel Aviv without aircraft carrier. Actually that makes sense not to overspend on aircraft carrier battle group unwanted expense. Than to utilize sophisticated Aircraft with air refuel penetrate deep into targets somewhere in Mediterranean Sea.

As far as war conflict with India & Pakistan are concerned, I don't think either nation can :
afford expenses
tolerate War rhetoric
harm unwanted "poor man" over for a "Rich politicians word"
fight over petty differences with turning the conflict into Armageddon for no reason
Nuclear threat over each other, just like USA - Russia cold war

 

[GiantPanda]

So what have we learn in this thread?

1) India has not had an operational carrier for two years

2) No Indian pilot had flown off a ship's deck in two years

3) Indian posters need to use videos of Russian pilots validating Vikramaditya to show night takeoffs

4) Five of 45 MiG-29Ks have crashed in the last four years -- despite having no carrier in two of those years.

And here's one more:

The new Indian carrier Vikrant, despite needing 20 years to build, is horridly designed with launch positions on the angled deck blocking recovery.

 

[vi-va]

This is a good example of how copying someone's homework doesn't mean you understand the material. The US carriers that use EM catapults are nuclear powered, meaning there is almost an unlimited amount of electrical power available and makes sense. Nuclear-powered Ford and Nimitz-class ships have much more free storage capacity so they can store more jet fuel, weapons, and so on. While the Chinese carrier is fossil fueled so it normally would have an excess amount of steam and therefore should use steam catapults instead. The EM cats require vast amounts of electricity, meaning you'll be stressing the boilers to drive generators for electricity (losing efficiency) to use the cats. This will limit the sortie rates and cause more frequent fuel replenishment (thus limiting range or station time). This carrier is far from being operational anytime soon. The Chinese do have experience with carrier operations they have been for the past 10 years. But going from a ramp style to a catapult launch system is a very large step and one they are not familiar with.
US navy has been using catapult launch for decades and are the best in the world in carrier operations. Not just in ship board operations but also in aviation operations. China's propulsion technology is still several generations behind

Silly post. Just don't comment on something you don't understand at all.

 

[Beast]

So what have we learn in this thread?

1) India has not had an operational carrier for two years

2) No Indian pilot had flown off a ship's deck in two years

3) Indian posters need to use videos of Russian pilots validating Vikramaditya to show night takeoffs

4) Five of 45 MiG-29Ks have crashed in the last four years -- despite having no carrier in two of those years.

And here's one more:

The new Indian carrier Vikrant, despite needing 20 years to build, is horridly designed with launch positions on the angled deck blocking recovery.
View attachment 910463

No no... Indian will just claim just becos they have experienced using carrier for real operation in 1961 is enough to overwrite constant proper training, technology and proficient in operating a real combat capabilities of the PLAN carrier fleet.

 

[walterbibikow]

Five of 45 MiG-29Ks have crashed in the last four years -- despite having no carrier in two of those years
View attachment 910463

India, France To Sign Deal For Rafale-M Fighters In March During Macron's Visit To New Delhi - French Media

A contract for over 26 Rafale-M Marine fighters could be signed during French President Emmanuel Macron's visit to India in March 2023

eurasiantimes.com

The new Indian carrier Vikrant, despite needing 20 years to build, is horridly designed with launch positions on the angled deck blocking recovery

The design of Vikrant started in 1999 while the Chinese ships are rooted in 1970s Soviet technology.
The Vikrant's got a wider flight deck (due to the island placed on the extreme corner). Furthermore the vikrant was envisioned as a STOBAR aircraft carrier and built for this. The visible advantages would be the wider and more spacious flight deck, and the design of the superstructure in the vikrant, which seems to be a cleaner layout which might result in a lower RCS.

 

[Beast]

India, France To Sign Deal For Rafale-M Fighters In March During Macron's Visit To New Delhi - French Media

A contract for over 26 Rafale-M Marine fighters could be signed during French President Emmanuel Macron's visit to India in March 2023

eurasiantimes.com

Wow, pulling another snake charmer prediction which never finalized anything. When will it be delivered even signed? 2030? LOL.

 

[walterbibikow]

No no... Indian will just claim just becos they have experienced using carrier for real operation in 1961 is enough to overwrite constant proper training, technology and proficient in operating a real combat capabilities of the PLAN carrier fleet.

China's navy has had its own share of accidents, including the loss of several carrier pilots. Its navy barely managed to get a full SSBN patrol going after decades of effort, while India completed their first SSBN patrol less than a year after entry into active service. There are probably others that are not publicized, as China does not have a free press

India’s 3rd Generation Nuclear SSBNs starts taking shape – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

India Quietly Launches 3rd Arihant-class Nuclear-powered Submarine, Can Carry 8 Ballistic Missiles: Report - News18

The first SSBN INS Arihant was commissioned in 2016, while the second, though initially launched in 2014, is awaiting commissioning into the Indian Navy.

www.news18.com

Wow, pulling another snake charmer prediction which never finalized anything. When will it be delivered even signed? 2030? LOL.

France's Rafale jets are frontrunner in race for Indian Navy contract

Forward movement by the Indian Navy would mean that the proposal for more Rafale jets for the IAF is also likely to gather speed.

theprint.in

 

[Beast]

China's navy has had its own share of accidents, including the loss of several carrier pilots. Its navy barely managed to get a full SSBN patrol going after decades of effort, while India completed their first SSBN patrol less than a year after entry into active service. There are probably others that are not publicized, as China does not have a free press.

France's Rafale jets are frontrunner in race for Indian Navy contract

Forward movement by the Indian Navy would mean that the proposal for more Rafale jets for the IAF is also likely to gather speed.

theprint.in

Nice excuse from Indian for any of your incompetent. Barely say by who? Those snake charmer fake analyst who only good at chunking out made Indian feel good report. Go ahead and post those junks and make a fool of yourself and India.

Like the hindustic times article which claim INS vikrant is better than Fujian AC or IEP is several generation behind in propulsion system claim by you.

 

[GiantPanda]

India, France To Sign Deal For Rafale-M Fighters In March During Macron's Visit To New Delhi - French Media

A contract for over 26 Rafale-M Marine fighters could be signed during French President Emmanuel Macron's visit to India in March 2023

eurasiantimes.com

The design of Vikrant started in 1999 while the Chinese ships are rooted in 1970s Soviet technology.
The Vikrant's got a wider flight deck (due to the island placed on the extreme corner). Furthermore the vikrant was envisioned as a STOBAR aircraft carrier and built for this. The visible advantages would be the wider and more spacious flight deck, and the design of the superstructure in the vikrant, which seems to be a cleaner layout which might result in a lower RCS.

The Vikrant is better laid out than your harbor queen Vikramaditya which has its island in the middle of the flight deck but it is far less efficient than the Liaoning or Shandong with their much larger decks.

The standbye (short) launch positions of the Liaoning and Shandong are not on the angled deck, leaving it available for recovery:

Both short and positions of the Vikrant are on the angled deck:

Also there are no blast shields on the Vikrant. Its design makes for a far lower rate of launch and recovery and also far more dangerous environment for deck ops.

China can launch two J-15s forward of the island and leave the entire angled deck for recovery and other deck ops:

The MiG-29K even when using a "very short" runway has to launch from the middle of the angled deck besides the island!

This launch was done by a Russian on Vikramaditya (a lot of the videos on carrier ops on Indian carriers featured Russians!) The Vikrant is shorter than the Vikramaditya and the MiG-29K there would have to start from a similar position even for "very short" takeoffs:

 

[walterbibikow]

The Vikrant is better laid out than your harbor queen Vikramaditya which has its island in the middle of the flight deck but it is far less efficient than the Liaoning or Shandong with their much larger decks.

The standbye (short) launch positions of the Liaoning and Shandong are not on the angled deck, leaving it available for recovery:

View attachment 910777

Both short and positions of the Vikrant are on the angled deck:
View attachment 910776

Also there are no blast shields on the Vikrant. Its design makes for a far lower rate of launch and recovery and also far more dangerous environment for deck ops.

China can launch two J-15s forward of the island and leave the entire angled deck for recovery and other deck ops:

The MiG-29K even when using a "very short" runway has to launch from the middle of the angled deck besides the island!

This launch was done by a Russian on Vikramaditya (a lot of the videos on carrier ops on Indian carriers featured Russians!) The Vikrant is shorter than the Vikramaditya and the MiG-29K there would have to start from a similar position even for "very short" takeoffs:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1410548691211984897

Noticebly more space and a longer runway available on INS Vikrant. The island is pushed back right at the edge. Aircraft elevators on the either side in Vikrant unlike just one in the middle on Vikramaditya. Perhaps can house more fighters on deck too. Vikrant has wider rear ig and a well placed tower
Clean and modern design!