Russian outrage over vile cartoons show there is NO ultimate freedom of speech

[xenon54 out]

U espouse values of secularism. U r a proponent of such values in turkey , a historic muslim land. SO obviously as a muslim i want to point out the hypocrisy of seculars and their western masters.

Turks are happy with secularism seeing the madness going on in ME.

As i said u can ignore my tags if u want to or u can try learning a thing or two. No harm in it , is there?

What should i learn from your recent tags? That you call me a secular bigot or other name callings?

Btw if u don't mind replying to this post , would u support a islamic blasphemy law in turkey?

There is a law in Turkey that is banning the insult of Atatürk, the President/Prime minister or religious figures, also a ban of insulting the religious feelings of a group Such as Muslims Christians or Jews etc. which is also in the category of hate crime.
Im absolutely ok with this but a blasphemy law in the sense of Sharia to behead or to stone people is a no go, you will hardly find anyone in Turkey who would favor this practice.

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

U r being disingenuous here. Every society has its red lines and social taboos . The red lines may or may not be defined in law.

- 9/11 victims can not be mocked in US and neither can their blood thirsty soldiers who die in foreign lands they drop bombs on.
- U can't criticize the fallen soldiers of any western country in western lands.

You can mock 9/11 victims..where does it say you can't??
You can criticize dead soldiers. In fact some obnoxious group hangs out at their funerals just to do it.

 

[I S I]

My what?

He meant Deep Pu..y



/jk

 

[jaunty]

Freedom of speech gives people the right to feel outraged and express that in a peaceful manner. It however does not give you the license to take a gun and kill people.

 

[Jf Thunder]

My what?

display picture, your avatar

 

[xenon54 out]

display picture, your avatar

Its the same since i have joined?

 

[haviZsultan]

luffy has a clear agenda so I won't uselessly respond to this thread. But we gave mullahs their space and they lost us east Pakistan. Íf religion only could be a glue for us it ended there and @Luffy 500 your own country is proof of that. As I said there are other factors like cultural/ethnic identity autonomy and equal rights to be considered too. Allah told us to use our brain (in short think for ourselves) and that using our brain led to the concept of secularism which our early leaders accepted. The problem came when Abdul Wahab types tried to give a different conservative color to our religion.

As a result of their orthodox doctrine people (Muslims) have come to view secularism as not only decadent but a policy completely against Islam which is untrue. We are wallowing in our own imposed barriers today. We do not give our people the gift of freedom.

 

[nForce]

luffy has a clear agenda so I won't uselessly respond to this thread. But we gave mullahs their space and they lost us east Pakistan. Íf religion only could be a glue for us it ended there and @Luffy 500 your own country is proof of that. As I said there are other factors like cultural/ethnic identity autonomy and equal rights to be considered too. Allah told us to use our brain (in short think for ourselves) and that using our brain led to the concept of secularism which our early leaders accepted. The problem came when Abdul Wahab types tried to give a different conservative color to our religion.

As a result of their orthodox doctrine people (Muslims) have come to view secularism as not only decadent but a policy completely against Islam which is untrue. We are wallowing in our own imposed barriers today. We do not give our people the gift of freedom.

mullahs lost you East Pakistan ? I stopped reading after that.

 

[Luffy 500]

You can mock 9/11 victims..where does it say you can't??
You can criticize dead soldiers. In fact some obnoxious group hangs out at their funerals just to do it.

View attachment 270689

The american islamic scholar who wrote this article said this. He said its a social taboo. And it also makes sense. Most western citizens have high regard for their soldiers invading muslim lands and their politicians use that sentiment very well. Tell me what would happen if a muslim mock dead US soldiers? Imagine the hysteria that the media would create against muslims? People like donald trump could ride on that hysteria to the white house.

luffy has a clear agenda so I won't uselessly respond to this thread. But we gave mullahs their space and they lost us east Pakistan. Íf religion only could be a glue for us it ended there and @Luffy 500 your own country is proof of that. As I said there are other factors like cultural/ethnic identity autonomy and equal rights to be considered too. Allah told us to use our brain (in short think for ourselves) and that using our brain led to the concept of secularism which our early leaders accepted. The problem came when Abdul Wahab types tried to give a different conservative color to our religion.

As a result of their orthodox doctrine people (Muslims) have come to view secularism as not only decadent but a policy completely against Islam which is untrue. We are wallowing in our own imposed barriers today. We do not give our people the gift of freedom.

I answered your non-sense yesterday but sadly secular PDF took down that thread.

U are a classic case of a intellectually colonized liberal who is also shamelessly dishonest. This thread is abt secular liberal hypocrisy regarding "freedom of speech" NOT 71.

71 occured due to politics and resources NOT religion. Secular rulers of W.PAK couldn't share power with secular rulers of E.PAK and a foreign power took advantage of that. Till today both PAK and BD 3rd rate secular shitholes ruled by intellectually colonized liberals like u. What has "mullahs" got to do with it? 71 is a fallacious argument for secularism.

U have absolutely 0 knowledge of islam. U suffer from inferiority complex and take everything western as the gold standard of judging right & wrong. Secularism is clear cut kufr since it give precedence to man-made law over Allah's law. Its an unique european concept based on their unique socio-political experience with a paganized intolerant christianity. It has nothing to do with islam and muslims. Secularism is a religion of post-christianity Europe and the west , with its own creed and rituals. What r u doing trying to superimpose such kufr on islam and muslim? Fact of the matter is that U don't care abt the ABCs of islam or what the muslim community hold dear. U r a classic example of a bigot who wants to force his views on others.

Btw Muhammad ibn ‘Abd al-Wahhaab (may Allaah have mercy on him) was one of the foremost scholar of 18th century. Allaah helped him to sow the seeds of Tawheed throughout the Arabian Peninsula and put an end to all kinds of shirk. Only anti-islamic bigots and intellectually colonized western slaves have a problem with such muslim personalities.

 

[24 Hours]

Mocking/insulting US troops and the events of 9/11 is allowed, it's just a social taboo. There is no law against that. Even burning the US flag is legal. Just don't expect to have many friendly neighbors around once you commit these activities.

 

[raj76]

luffy has a clear agenda so I won't uselessly respond to this thread. But we gave mullahs their space and they lost us east Pakistan. Íf religion only could be a glue for us it ended there and @Luffy 500 your own country is proof of that. As I said there are other factors like cultural/ethnic identity autonomy and equal rights to be considered too. Allah told us to use our brain (in short think for ourselves) and that using our brain led to the concept of secularism which our early leaders accepted. The problem came when Abdul Wahab types tried to give a different conservative color to our religion.

As a result of their orthodox doctrine people (Muslims) have come to view secularism as not only decadent but a policy completely against Islam which is untrue. We are wallowing in our own imposed barriers today. We do not give our people the gift of freedom.

lol east pakistan happened due to u r armys and elites ego why u guys didnt respect the electoral mandate because u r elite and army didnt wanted to be ruled by bengalis (inferior according to u r mindset)

 

[livingdead]

U r being disingenuous here. Every society has its red lines and social taboos . The red lines may or may not be defined in law.

- 9/11 victims can not be mocked in US and neither can their blood thirsty soldiers who die in foreign lands they drop bombs on.
- U can't criticize the fallen soldiers of any western country in western lands.
- Insulting the flag & anthem of france is criminal offense. Also insulting any public servant is considered "offending dignity of the republic".
- "Insulting" ataturk is a punishable offense in turkey.
- In Italy u can't insult the "honor & prestige" of the president.
- U can't even do academic scrutiny of holocaust in europe.
- U can't insult the president of greece. Also u can't insult christianity or any known greek religion in greece.
- Incites to "hatred" before the general public against the hungarian nation is a punishable offense.
- Blasphemy against the roman catholic church is illegal in malta.

Also u have laws against "anti-semitism" is almost all western countries. Not to mention criticizing abominations like homosexuality is a social taboo in the west now.

But west and their liberal lackeys in muslims lands find problem with Islamic blasphemy laws. Washington and delhi and even their netizens would have no problem if witch hasina arrests random BDs for "insulting" her or her father or insulting bengali nationalism , but u people would find a problem with muslims demanding blasphemy law. SO it all comes down to what west considers sacred. West considers its values sacred and have already established global blasphemy law against insulting sacred symbols of secular nationalism and liberalism. Tell me a country which allows people to burn its flags?

ok... I agree .. should not have said there is no red line..
However I disagree that cartoon should obey all the laws of all foreign countries. As long as they dont break french law, I am with them. Russians can draw their own cartoons if they want.
In my opinion I would rather err on side of freedom of speech than stop people saying it. I have always supported right of anjem chawdhry in UK to express his opinion, because UK law allows it, although I disagree with him completely.

I think US allows burning of their flag, not sure though.

 

[xyxmt]

You can mock 9/11 victims..where does it say you can't??
You can criticize dead soldiers. In fact some obnoxious group hangs out at their funerals just to do it.

View attachment 270689

its different when your own do it than when someone else does it.
French only refused to be a part of war on terror and result was freedom fries and all the vulgarity thrown at them...imagine if they had made fun of people dying in WTC, falling bodies from the towers and making french fries at in fire of twin towers.

 

[Dubious]

Yasir Qadhi

Dr.Yasir Qadhi

In the modern world, nationalism and secularism are indeed the new religions of our times, and their ideals and symbols are considered taboo and sacrosanct. Therefore, one cannot mock those symbols, and 'freedom of speech' simply does not exist for those topics.

Of course, secular nationalism allows actual religiosity to be mocked, and even God and His Prophets are considered legitimate targets, all under the guise of 'freedom of speech'. Yet, just try criticizing the symbols of a nation, or its sacred secular values, or its soldiers, or its citizens who are respected and see how much of a pass 'freedom of speech' will get you.

Here in America, it is simply taboo to criticize or mock the victims of 9/11, or the bravery and dedication of the troops, amongst other topics. In other lands, all peoples have values and individuals who are viewed as being beyond criticism - or, to put it in religious terms, as being sacred. The problem comes when those people who justify insulting religious symbols fail to see their own hypocrisy when they criticize those who mock their secular symbols.

The latest issue of Charlie Hebdo mocks the victims of the Russian plane crash, in extremely vulgar and disgusting cartoons. Obviously, the Russian people and its government responded as any sane, rational human being would: 'Have you no shame?!' And we do not see any mainstream media outlet republishing those cartoons. Nor have world leaders criticized the Russians for their legitimate anger at the publication of such cartoons.

In fact, even Charlie Hebdo has its own taboos! We are still waiting for that magazine to make fun of their own cartoonists who were massacred by terrorists. Do they truly believe in the ultimate freedom to defame all? Then let them draw those deceased colleagues of theirs in the same vulgar manners, naked and in sexually disgusting positions, and poking the same ribald vicious callous humor at their dead memories! But if they do not do so, and they shall never do so, then let them realize the sheer hypocrisy of their claims.

The point is that there is NO ultimate freedom of speech, anywhere in the world, and each and every society has legal prohibitions, and societal barriers, towards certain types of speech. And overall, that is a GOOD thing, and we as Muslims understand that. Our contention is that that same respect, if not more, deserves to be given to all sacred symbols as well.

Russians outraged after Charlie Hebdo cartoons ‘ridicule’ Sinai plane crash — RT News

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@Akheilos @Zarvan @Malik Abdullah @JUBA @monitor

He is a good speaker with a degree and some really good speeches!

 

[Hamartia Antidote]

I think US allows burning of their flag, not sure though.

Totally legal.

its different when your own do it than when someone else does it.
French only refused to be a part of war on terror and result was freedom fries and all the vulgarity thrown at them...imagine if they had made fun of people dying in WTC, falling bodies from the towers and making french fries at in fire of twin towers.

It's not nice but there is no law against being a jerk.

BTW one of the biggest 9/11 conspiracy pages is French.