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Russia tries to stave off US in Indian defence market

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Russia remains India’s largest defence supplier but the United States is slowly catching up with a string of major deals in the recent past. Russian experts are, however, confident that Moscow’s long-term strategic relationship with New Delhi will keep the defence equation in Russia’s favour

India is among the leaders in terms of defence purchases. New Delhi is expected to increase its defence budget by 54 percent by 2021 to $200 billion, according to IHS Jane’s. New Delhi wants its domestic defence industry to be able to produce the full range of advanced high-tech weaponry that its armed forces might require.

It is no secret that New Delhi and Beijing have long regarded themselves as not only regional but global leaders. That is why they want to measure up to the United States as opposed to their regional neighbours in terms of their defence capability. Witness, for example, their energetic efforts to develop an aircraft-carrying capability and strategic nuclear forces, as well as their ambitious space militarisation programmes.

Given the fact that India has a big defence budget, the country has become a strategically important market for the global arms and ammunition industry. This has made America bend over backwards to win important contracts in India. In 2011, Washington went as far as dropping several Indian defence companies and institutions – including the Defence Research and Development Organization (DRDO) and the Indian Space Research Organization (ISRO) – from its weapons export control list.

The United States hopes the move will help it to forge closer defence industry cooperation with India. It is even prepared to invite New Delhi to take part in the development of the F-35 light 5th-generation fighter, and to share the technology for the Apache, its most advanced attack helicopter. Washington hopes that these inducements will be enough to wrest a large chunk of the Indian defence market from Moscow, which has long been India’s strategic partner.

The Europeans, meanwhile, have not been idle, either. France’s Dassault Aviation has won a $12 billion Indian tender for 126 light fighter jets, and agreed to launch their production under licence in India. European companies are also bidding for a South Korean Air Force contract, offering similar terms.

“This was only to be expected,” says Ruslan Pukhov, head of the Center for Analysis of Strategic and Technologies (CAST). “We have grown used to the idea that India buys lots of cheap Russian weaponry. But Indian GDP has been growing at a 9 percent rate in recent years; the country now has the money to spend, and it wants to buy advanced systems. We have many gaps in our high-tech product range. As a result, the Indians are turning to European and American suppliers.”

Moscow has already lost the Indian tender for transport aircraft. It offered the Il-76 model, but the Indians opted instead for the C-130J-30 Super Hercules. New Delhi has paid almost $1 billion for a batch of six planes; the figure is astronomical, especially given that the Il-76 would have cost them a lot less. But it appears that price was not the only consideration; the Indians must have taken into account the outcome of the Russian-Chinese contract for 40 Il-76 transports signed back in 2005.

Russia promised to supply the aircraft for a total of $1 billion, but never managed to build them. None of the Russian aerospace companies has actually managed to launch mass production of the Il-76 model. Moscow probably hoped to use the deposit paid by China to move the existing Il-76 production facilities from the Tashkent plant in neighbouring Uzbekistan to its own aerospace production complex in Voronezh, and then to Ulyanovsk – but it appears that the plan fell through for some reason.

Russia has also lost several other foreign contracts for fighter jets and attack helicopters, and for similar reasons. Its Mig-35 fighter and Mi-28N helicopter are superior to anything Russia’s competitors have to offer in terms of sheer performance. But there is only a single existing prototype of the MiG-35. The Mi-28N has entered mass production, but the new model is still struggling with teething technical problems. Clearly, India does not want to pay for a product that is not quite ready for prime time. It has already made that mistake, and on more than one occasion; suffice is to recall the contracts for the Uragan SAM systems, which are used on India’s Talwar-class frigates; the Smerch multiple-launch rocket systems; and the Vikramaditya aircraft carrier. Another example is the Nerpa nuclear-powered submarine. Moscow agreed a lease deal for the sub with the Indians several years ago, but the delivery date was pushed back on several occasions [before the submarine was finally delivered in 2012].

Anatoliy Isaykin, head of the Russian defence export intermediary Rosoboronexport, insists, however, that things are not all that dire. He says that the Asia-Pacific now accounts for more than half of the company’s deliveries. In recent years Russia approved about $7 billion worth of export loans under weapons contracts. This has enabled Rosoboronexport to sign new deals with Myanmar, Malaysia, Indonesia, Sri Lanka and Vietnam.

Moscow is determined to keep its share of the Indian defence market and to retain its status as the world’s second-largest defence exporter. Last year Rosoboronexport signed $17.6 billion worth of new contracts, which represents an increase of 150 percent compared to 2011. The company’s portfolio of contracts has reached an impressive $37.3 billion.

Russia tries to stave off US in Indian defence market | idrw.org
 
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the main problem the forces have with Russian equipment is cost escalations and after sales services. if the Russians were to improve this there would not be such a problem.
 
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India is among the leaders in terms of defence purchases. New Delhi is expected to increase its defence budget by 54 percent by 2021 to $200 billion, according to IHS Jane’s. New Delhi wants its domestic defence industry to be able to produce the full range of advanced high-tech weaponry that its armed forces might require.

is indian defence budget now around $130 billion ? :blink: or around $40 billion ? :undecided:
 
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is indian defence budget now around $130 billion ? :blink: or around $40 billion ? :undecided:

Incorrect information, the budget for the armed forces is around 40 billion dollars+, so this projection is incorrect. It is incorrect even if one includes the separate budget for the para-military forces and CAPFs.

So no, by the 2021 at best the budget may stand at 100-120 billion dollars, 200 billion dollars is a pipe dream in that time frame unless we want to raise the share of the defense budget to 4.5 percent or so from the current 2.5 percent of the GDP.
 
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is indian defence budget now around $130 billion ? :blink: or around $40 billion ? :undecided:

Incorrect information, the budget for the armed forces is around 40 billion dollars+, so this projection is incorrect. It is incorrect even if one includes the separate budget for the para-military forces and CAPFs.

So no, by the 2021 at best the budget may stand at 100-120 billion dollars, 200 billion dollars is a pipe dream in that time frame unless we want to raise the share of the defense budget to 4.5 percent or so from the current 2.5 percent of the GDP.

its shows that frm 2013-14 to 2020-21 = 200$ for purchase of weapons... not abt all over defense budget in that year of 2020-21..
 
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This is good- competition forces people to up their game. The Russians have gotten lazy and pampered in the Indian defence market and have thus let cost escalations and time delays come about. The US has shown India what results it should expect from everyone- on time and on budget deliveries of quality products . Russia needs to step up instead of trying to subvert the Indian defence procurement process by attacking the life-cycle cost analysis done by India or by demanding more govt-govt deals instead of open tenders (which they keep losing).

The Russian's mindset is still stuck in the times of the USSR and they think that their historic relationship with India will continue to lead to success on this front- it WILL NOT.
 
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Only on PPP terms... but its BS to use PPP for a nation that imports most of its stuff.

OT: Hopefully this competition will make the Russians work harder.... decades of communism still show their effect :rolleyes:

its shows that frm 2013-14 to 2020-21 = 200$ for purchase of weapons... not abt all over defense budget in that year of 2020-21..

Incorrect information, the budget for the armed forces is around 40 billion dollars+, so this projection is incorrect. It is incorrect even if one includes the separate budget for the para-military forces and CAPFs.

So no, by the 2021 at best the budget may stand at 100-120 billion dollars, 200 billion dollars is a pipe dream in that time frame unless we want to raise the share of the defense budget to 4.5 percent or so from the current 2.5 percent of the GDP.

is indian defence budget now around $130 billion ? :blink: or around $40 billion ? :undecided:
By 2020/22 the Indian defence budget will be anywhere from $110BN-170BN depending on the next decade's economic growth rate. By 2030 the Indian defence budget will be $250-270BN easily- if not more.
 
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In the coming years Russian share would drop drastically as Western nations are willing to sell their high tech arms system to india. Also our indigenous arms industry is developing steadily.
 
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Russian Military complex needs a Putin or Stalin :P as a leader to pull their pants and deliver on time with no shortcomings on spares and coming clean on every price escalation.
 
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its shows that frm 2013-14 to 2020-21 = 200$ for purchase of weapons... not abt all over defense budget in that year of 2020-21..

Thanks for the clarification/correction yaara, I thought they were referring to the figure for a single fiscal year rather than a cumulative figure spread across 6-7 years.
 
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This is good- competition forces people to up their game. The Russians have gotten lazy and pampered in the Indian defence market and have thus let cost escalations and time delays come about. The US has shown India what results it should expect from everyone- on time and on budget deliveries of quality products . Russia needs to step up instead of trying to subvert the Indian defence procurement process by attacking the life-cycle cost analysis done by India or by demanding more govt-govt deals instead of open tenders (which they keep losing).

The Russian's mindset is still stuck in the times of the USSR and they think that their historic relationship with India will continue to lead to success on this front- it WILL NOT.

As expected...when India has U.S as leverage, Indians people can afford to bad mouth Russians and their equipments. I'm wondering sometime if Russian offer China with Su-35 with good faith or just want to pi$$ off and punish India for ungracefull attitude? they have covered India's A$$ since 1971 with military equipment assistance and diplomacy up till now and that how you thanks them?
 
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As expected...when India has U.S as leverage, Indians people can afford to bad mouth Russians and their equipments. I'm wondering sometime if Russian offer China with Su-35 with good faith or just want to pi$$ off and punish India for ungracefull attitude? they have covered India's A$$ since 1971 with military equipment assistance and diplomacy up till now and that how you thanks them?
Please save on the hyperbole. Wanna talk about ungrateful? Post the collapse fo the USSR India has effectively funded the Russian arms industry and has lead to its Renaissance of sorts in the last few years. Indian money and backing has lead to projects like the MKI and MIG-29K to be developed and for the Russian forces to take advantage of this Indian funding ie SU-30SM and RuN orders for MIG-29K. The PAK-FA would almost certainly not have got off the ground without the promise of Indian funds-same goes for the HAL-UAC MTA. Similarly the Yantar shipyards have effectively been re-fit on the Indian dime that had been paid for the Talwar class. And what does India get? Endless cost escalations and delays- name a SINGLE Russian defence sale to India in the last 2 decades that has not faced either issue. Or do you wanna talk about the appallingly high AOG rates and low availability of almost every single Russian-origin a/c/system in Indian service?


Oh bo-hoo, Russia is feeling the heat in a market they, inexplicably, see they "own" or have monoplised?Is India asking anything unreasonable-good quality products delivered on time and on budget?


Excuse me if I don't shed any tears for these fools who think they are still operating in the heydays of the USSR.
 
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Please save on the hyperbole. Wanna talk about ungrateful? Post the collapse fo the USSR India has effectively funded the Russian arms industry and has lead to its Renaissance of sorts in the last few years. Indian money and backing has lead to projects like the MKI and MIG-29K to be developed and for the Russian forces to take advantage of this Indian funding ie SU-30SM and RuN orders for MIG-29K. The PAK-FA would almost certainly not have got off the ground without the promise of Indian funds-same goes for the HAL-UAC MTA. Similarly the Yantar shipyards have effectively been re-fit on the Indian dime that had been paid for the Talwar class. And what does India get? Endless cost escalations and delays- name a SINGLE Russian defence sale to India in the last 2 decades that has not faced either issue. Or do you wanna talk about the appallingly high AOG rates and low availability of almost every single Russian-origin a/c/system in Indian service?


Oh bo-hoo, Russia is feeling the heat in a market they, inexplicably, see they "own" or have monoplised?Is India asking anything unreasonable-good quality products delivered on time and on budget?


Excuse me if I don't shed any tears for these fools who think they are still operating in the heydays of the USSR.

I didn't see you guys complain during almost 3 decades...not only that you guys were chanting the greatness of Russia as strategic ally against China and the west and now start to say bad thing about Russia when you have U.S as leverage? tsk...tsk

And yes you have to pay for developments if you guys want an military equipment to be specific to India such MKI...Russians are not to paid for the development cost of something that they will never use...even American will do the same. Despite of what ever the techincal difficulty, Russia had offered India the finest military equipments that China cound't dream of such PAK-FA :P.
 
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