Restructuring the ISI

[[Pakistani]-evilX]

^^ The ISI has more civilians then it has uniformed personnel.

i was refering to our friend 'F86 Saber ' , i know but on higher ranks, its just generals and brig from army which is not good, civilians should be given a chance.

 

[Vassnti]

I remember talking to someone who said that the information received and carried by the ISI is sometimes so sensitive that it is for eyes of Chief of Army Staff only and involving civilians would mean opening up the most crucial secrets of Pakistan. .

Interesting statement, so by civilians you would mean politicians?So the COAS is the only one who really knows what is happening in Pakistan, sort of hard to be "out of politics" if you control the flow of information.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

civilians should be given a chance.

If they have the necessary qualifications then I do not see why not.

I still think that a commission comprising the senior military leadership, opposition and governing political leadership (weighted equally for all three) should shortlist candidates to head the ISI and other military institutions. This way every side will have its concerns over any particular candidate considered, and the eventual candidate would hopefully be acceptable to all stakeholders.

 

[53fd]

The only thing which need to change is the Political Wing within the ISI needs to be dismantled and the ISI to concentrate not just on the REAL enemy India in India but also within the region and actively undermine it is every possible way..........a similar way the Indian RAW is doing, and those Indians who will undoubtedly say they dont, then need to consider dismantling the RAW altogether as no intelligence agency would not do the same.....Our ISI needs to be allowed to be much more pro-active in its projects........

The US tried to weaken the ISI before by trying to put it under the control of the Interior Ministry. Nations that hate the ISI want to weaken it, coming with all kinds of conspiracy theories against it.

 

[Haseebullah]

i was refering to our friend 'F86 Saber ' , i know but on higher ranks, its just generals and brig from army which is not good, civilians should be given a chance.

I understand your reasoning,and as Agnostic Muslim said most of the ISI agents are civilians then uniformed personals.
But in this debate of yours do not forget the role and the sole purpose of its establishment.As the name suggests ISI"Inter Services Intelligence",It was formulated not for internal security not for espionage but for the simple reason of intelligence collaboration between the three armed forces"PN,PAF and PA".If you are asking to give it's command to the civilians than the purpose of it's formation will be lost.Now we wouldn't wanna repeat the whole blunder in 1948 and then reformulate the ISI would we.That's the reason the chain of command stays with the army,navy or Air force.By the way Federal Intelligence Bureau is responsible for the internal security just like Federal Investigation Bureau of USA.It's not ISI's fault if they couldn't make the headline except for the instance when their office got attacked.

 

[Haseebullah]

The US tried to weaken the ISI before by trying to put it under the control of the Interior Ministry of Pakistan. Nations that hate the ISI want to weaken it, & are coming with all kinds of conspiracy theories against the ISI.

Hate?More like "feel threatened" by ISI's wrath!

 

[American Eagle]

You may want to read direct media quotes of Taliban leadership proclaiming for months now that they are the paramilitary for use, off and on, inside Kashmir. These Taliban statements go back about two years now to present.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

You may want to read direct media quotes of Taliban leadership proclaiming for months now that they are the paramilitary for use, off and on, inside Kashmir. These Taliban statements go back about two years now to present.

Would you mind posting them? Because I am not aware of any credible information indicating either Afghan Taliban or Pakistani Taliban (TTP) involvement in IoK at any significant level.

 

[Xeric]

^^ They are in the habit of mixing up every Pathan, Afghan and Taliban. Surprisingly they dont even bother to differentiate Arab and Tajik members of AQ. This confusion is to an extent now that some even use the term Pakistani inter-changeably with Talibans. No wonder they see a Pathan Taliban among Kashmiri freedom fighters.

 

[SQ8]

^^ They are in the habit of mixing up every Pathan, Afghan and Taliban. Surprisingly they dont even bother to differentiate Arab and Tajik members of AQ. This confusion is to an extent now that some even use the term Pakistani inter-changeably with Talibans. No wonder they see a Pathan Taliban among Kashmiri freedom fighters.

I call it the "everything east of the suez , is bad" syndrome..

 

[F86 Saber]

I agree with the part for not handing over the Institute to the ministries but that doesnt mean that it shouldnt allow talented civilians on board, if ones sole purpose is to serve in intelligence, does that mean one must join PA/ PN /PAF/ FIA / Police........and who said that civilians can't follow the orders or keep the secrecy, thats a totaly wrong implications, you just need to find the right people for the job,
care to explain how other intelligence agencies around the world recruit their agents? , not everyone was recruited from army

I think i need to rephrase my first sentence, I didn't mean civilians should not be allowed to join ISI, my point was that the overall administration should remain with the army because it is the most disciplined organization in Pakistan. And for a department as sensitive as ISI the discipline of the army is required while hiring and training even the clerical and lower staff to maintain secrecy and confidentiality of information

 

[nirreich]

I understand your reasoning,and as Agnostic Muslim said most of the ISI agents are civilians then uniformed personals.
But in this debate of yours do not forget the role and the sole purpose of its establishment.As the name suggests ISI"Inter Services Intelligence",It was formulated not for internal security not for espionage but for the simple reason of intelligence collaboration between the three armed forces"PN,PAF and PA".If you are asking to give it's command to the civilians than the purpose of it's formation will be lost.Now we wouldn't wanna repeat the whole blunder in 1948 and then reformulate the ISI would we.That's the reason the chain of command stays with the army,navy or Air force.By the way Federal Intelligence Bureau is responsible for the internal security just like Federal Investigation Bureau of USA.It's not ISI's fault if they couldn't make the headline except for the instance when their office got attacked.

Possibly, the ISI's main disadvantage is its directing mostly by operational officers who were involved in intelligence or military missions. As a result, the ISI command prefer to influence Pakistan's strategic environment through intelligence operations (in Afghanistan and India) rather than concentrate on intelligence support to military operations.

The reorganisation of the ISI following the beginning of the Afghan War after 9/11 should have been answering this problem with the construction of the new section of counter-terrorism, known as DG (CT). However, the influence of special operation advocates in the ISI seems still to be overwhelming. Reassign civilians into the organisations will not make a different without strengthening the elements in ISI which are not part of the combative activity of the agency.

 

[Pioneerfirst]

ISI is one of the best Intellegence agencies.The CIA has come to clear defeat after investing billions.THey want ISI to work for them as it did in cold war era.But as CIA itself is hiding and supporting Pakistans enemies in Afghanistan so it is not possible to that earlier extent.so they create propagenda against ISI at all they have investments in media,press etc.

 

[SR 71 Blackbird]

The only thing which need to change is the Political Wing within the ISI needs to be dismantled and the ISI to concentrate not just on the REAL enemy India in India but also within the region and actively undermine it is every possible way..........a similar way the Indian RAW is doing, and those Indians who will undoubtedly say they dont, then need to consider dismantling the RAW altogether as no intelligence agency would not do the same.....Our ISI needs to be allowed to be much more pro-active in its projects........

ISI might get dismantled while doing this to a organization which is 6 times in budget & 2 times in manpower.

 

[Patriot]

ISI might get dismantled while doing this to a organization which is 6 times in budget & 2 times in manpower.