Punitive Air Strikes on Enemy Airbases and Our Options.

[Pakistani Fighter]

https://www.globalfirepower.com/armor-mlrs-total.asp


The previous version of Brahmos is 290km that is before we were part of MTCR. Recently produced versions are 400km

I was referring to stockpile of Ballistic and Cruise Missiles

https://www.globalfirepower.com/armor-mlrs-total.asp

Why do we have such low numbers of MLRS as compared to other nations?
@HRK @Oscar @FOOLS_NIGHTMARE @Dazzler @Rashid Mahmood @Bilal Khan (Quwa)

 

[Zapper]

I was referring to stockpile of Ballistic and Cruise Missiles

https://www.globalfirepower.com/armor-mlrs-total.asp

Why do we have such low numbers of MLRS as compared to other nations?
@HRK @Oscar @FOOLS_NIGHTMARE @Dazzler @Rashid Mahmood @Bilal Khan (Quwa)

If you're looking into a numbers matchup, no country would give out their specific inventory and it's extemely hard to put a close estimate. Even if we have a comparable number of BMs & CMs, consider the land mass, targets, critical installations etc with respect to each other

https://www.armscontrol.org/factsheets/missiles

 

[Basel]

Abandoned points with only enemy combatants make for very attractive ballistic missile targets, the paradigm for defence and offence has undergone many changes since then, I doubt any military planner won't compensate for such new emerging scenarios.

I think it's more to do with keeping things under a certain level of escalation, India uses airforce, the PA uses airforce.
Similarly any new parameters or operations one side utilizes is fair game for the other to do it too.

Ballistic missile usage would be going higher on the escalation ladder than what the leadership on both sides were comfortable with, specially if it's used anywhere other than the LOC.

Both sides are figuring how to fight under the nuclear umbrella.

Both sides know that if conflict went out of control then both will suffer heavily and may lead situation to MAD which no one want to happen.

 

[Zarvan]

A good suggestion.

These kind of MRLs which can fire both guide missiles with around 300 to 400 KM range also unguided ones can take out Air Bases close to our borer. As for those which are far away. For them we need both large number of Fighter Jets with long Range Air to Ground cruise Missiles and also frigates and destroyers which have VLS to fire long range cruise Missiles. They could be very effective for targets based on land. Specially in cities like Mumbai and Goa and Hyderabad and Bengaluru.

 

[BATMAN]

I just pray to Allah may we witness the same feat in our life times as our elders witnessed.

On 27th February 9 Su30 were locked with BVR, this means clean hitting from distance and blame all responsibility on Indians.
On ground Indians surely would have no respite from Kashmiris.
An army with dead chief and commander of front lines would only be like a mad elephant.
Khalid bin Walid won his wars against Persian infidels, with same strategy.
Now we will ever get similar opportunity, is difficult to say.

 

[FOOLS_NIGHTMARE]

On 27th February 9 Su30 were locked with BVR, this means clean hitting from distance and blame all responsibility on Indians.
On ground Indians surely would have no respite from Kashmiris.
An army with dead chief and commander of front lines would only be like a mad elephant.
Khalid bin Walid won his wars against Persian infidels, with same strategy.
Now we will ever get similar opportunity, is difficult to say.

PAFs outstanding performance on the 27th of February this year against India has further strengthened our confidence on our air warriors. I dont have even a shadow of doubt that our professionals are leaps ahead in Tactics,Flying skills,Human machine interface,Faith and Chivalry against our foe.

 

[BATMAN]

PAFs outstanding performance on the 27th of February this year against India has further strengthened our confidence on our air warriors. I dont have even a shadow of doubt that our professionals are leaps ahead in Tactics,Flying skills,Human machine interface,Faith and Chivalry against our foe.

Indeed... it's evident from the missing Indian reaction on field.
I'm simply cherishing the missed opportunity, which will always be missed in times to come.
At the same time, i must say, i would never support any plan, where our officers in-charge are playing with emotions of our pilots and soldiers and sending them in air just to hit empty land and telling them on last moment, don't shoot the locked SU30. When we scratch more, than only excuse we hear is we don't want war.
Consider all the destruction Indians pulled in Pakistan using Afghanistan & iran, how could you not want war, when it's imposed on you.... answer is every one's individual guess.

 

[Basel]

Indeed... it's evident from the missing Indian reaction on field.
I'm simply cherishing the missed opportunity, which will always be missed in times to come.
At the same time, i must say, i would never support any plan, where our officers in-charge are playing with emotions of our pilots and soldiers and sending them in air just to hit empty land and telling them on last moment, don't shoot the locked SU30. When we scratch more, than only excuse we hear is we don't want war.
Consider all the destruction Indians pulled in Pakistan using Afghanistan, how could you not want war.... answer is every one's individual guess.

India did got surprised but make no mistakes they are now preparing and planning for future and Pakistan should also be ready for it.

 

[BATMAN]

India did got surprised but make no mistakes they are now preparing and planning for future and Pakistan should also be ready for it.

They are preparing less, US and Europe are preparing on their behalf.
At this moment multi billion $ world agencies are engineering plans how to tame Pakistan army and obviously it's through politicians and demoralizing public by increasing inflation.
For which we all know whom to thank...

 

[araz]

To the poster who put this up for discussion.
Sir.
What your are premising is a war or a pre war situation. Currently we are in peace times and contrary to the war mongers, at least at the defence and admjn level would like to avail all opportunities within that sphere maximally before moving on.
The admin(civil and military) has certain red lines beyond which it will cross the threshold of war. So far this has not happened.
When it comes to war there are different considerations. The number of airfields, the range of the enemy fighters, the range of your armaments and fighters, and the projected losses vs gains. Generally as an offensive measure you will lose 3 fighters to enemy's one fighter. If you look at the enemy air bases the operational air bases maybe in range but the enemy has long range fighters for a reason( at least 250 MKIs) which it will keep as far away from these bases as it can. You may therefore achieve a victory over a hundred bosons which maybe fodder for your planes in any case. If you lose 50 planes in doing so you have eff3ctively lost /4 of your effective AF( you may want to use M3/5s as well as JFTs for this so you may be able to incur that loss. However to what effect on your enemy remains to be seen. Again if you cause too much damage their nuclear threshold would be crossed.
This translates into a CM/BM type attack at multiple targets. There would need to be a barrage of them to be effective. You also have to cater to the fact that the enemy will also try the same techniques so you will lose fighters on the ground as well.
If I were the adversary and I saw the launch of multiple CM/BMs simultaneously, I would institute the MAD scenario and let loose with all of my might. You dont want to wait to find out whether these are nuke tipped or not.
So this debate becomes a mute point simply because how so ever you analyse the situation unless you are in a position to kill a billion people on both sides there is no such technique that would be effective now.
The only way I see an outcome in your favour is a massive Nuke strike at all key points throughout India and face the consequences afterwards. What that would do to the region in particular and the world in general is too horrific to contemplate. Roughly half to 2/3rd world population would be affected and there may be no India or Pakistan left to talk about. The rest of us miserable folk would be destined to scrape a living out of rummaging through rubbish heaps. May Allah help us all.

 

[Pakistani Fighter]

On 27th February 9 Su30 were locked with BVR, this means clean hitting from distance and blame all responsibility on Indians.
On ground Indians surely would have no respite from Kashmiris.
An army with dead chief and commander of front lines would only be like a mad elephant.
Khalid bin Walid won his wars against Persian infidels, with same strategy.
Now we will ever get similar opportunity, is difficult to say.

What about Mirage 2000s? 9 SU 30s is a huge number. Looks exageration.
@airomerix @Dazzler @khanasifm @Oscar

To the poster who put this up for discussion.
Sir.
What your are premising is a war or a pre war situation. Currently we are in peace times and contrary to the war mongers, at least at the defence and admjn level would like to avail all opportunities within that sphere maximally before moving on.
The admin(civil and military) has certain red lines beyond which it will cross the threshold of war. So far this has not happened.
When it comes to war there are different considerations. The number of airfields, the range of the enemy fighters, the range of your armaments and fighters, and the projected losses vs gains. Generally as an offensive measure you will lose 3 fighters to enemy's one fighter. If you look at the enemy air bases the operational air bases maybe in range but the enemy has long range fighters for a reason( at least 250 MKIs) which it will keep as far away from these bases as it can. You may therefore achieve a victory over a hundred bosons which maybe fodder for your planes in any case. If you lose 50 planes in doing so you have eff3ctively lost /4 of your effective AF( you may want to use M3/5s as well as JFTs for this so you may be able to incur that loss. However to what effect on your enemy remains to be seen. Again if you cause too much damage their nuclear threshold would be crossed.
This translates into a CM/BM type attack at multiple targets. There would need to be a barrage of them to be effective. You also have to cater to the fact that the enemy will also try the same techniques so you will lose fighters on the ground as well.
If I were the adversary and I saw the launch of multiple CM/BMs simultaneously, I would institute the MAD scenario and let loose with all of my might. You dont want to wait to find out whether these are nuke tipped or not.
So this debate becomes a mute point simply because how so ever you analyse the situation unless you are in a position to kill a billion people on both sides there is no such technique that would be effective now.
The only way I see an outcome in your favour is a massive Nuke strike at all key points throughout India and face the consequences afterwards. What that would do to the region in particular and the world in general is too horrific to contemplate. Roughly half to 2/3rd world population would be affected and there may be no India or Pakistan left to talk about. The rest of us miserable folk would be destined to scrape a living out of rummaging through rubbish heaps. May Allah help us all.

Well India was ready for Missile attack when thier just 2 planes were shot down

 

[BATMAN]

Well India was ready for Missile attack when thier just 2 planes were shot down

Why did they changed their mind?? and what would be the difference, if 11 jets were down, with dead military leadership, weapon depots gone, northern command head quarter gone, and all at same instant.

 

[araz]

What about Mirage 2000s? 9 SU 30s is a huge number. Looks exageration.
@airomerix @Dazzler @khanasifm @Oscar


Well India was ready for Missile attack when thier just 2 planes were shot down

They desisted when told we will respond with all and the kitchen sink at hand. What made them stop?
The fact remains that a war at the end of which there is nothing to gain is a useless venture. Indo Pak war whenever it happens (and it will happen !)will be devastating.
A

Why did they changed their mind?? and what would be the difference, if 11 jets were down, with dead military leadership, weapon depots gone, northern command head quarter gone, and all at same instant.

Can you elaborate on the iranian friends of Imran Khan bit please?

 

[BATMAN]

Can you elaborate on the iranian friends of Imran Khan bit please?

 

[araz]

Sorry being out of Pakistan for the last 4 decades I need a bit more elaboration.
Regards
A