PTI Vs PMLN + PPP => Governance Comparison

[FaujHistorian]

Then what about all this?

NADRA report says 77,643 fake votes cast in NA-256 - thenews.com.pk
NA118 vote recount: No record of 50k votes, 25k unverified, NADRA presents report | Pakistan | Dunya News
Dunya News: Pakistan:-57,426 votes cast in NA-256 fake: NADRA...
Dunya News: NA118 vote recount: No record of 50k votes, 25k unverified, NADRA presents report.
Pakistan Elections 2013: 7 Videos Proving Election Was Rigged - Mic
Voter fraud: 65% of votes in Balochistan were bogus – The Express Tribune

I didn't vote for PMLN last time. Practically everyone I know in Pakistan did not vote for PMLN. That's why so many people are supporting PTI for electoral reforms and investigation. Where did our votes go? What makes you so sure that ''each party will have a shot at winning in 2018''?
If there will be no electoral reforms, no investigation and no proper action taken against the culprits, what's stopping them from rigging the next elections too? PMLN ?

Electoral reforms are essential. PMLN shouldn't have sidelined this issue for 14 months.

This was the case on seats where PTI won.

This was the case on seats in KP where PTI formed the gov.


your selective attacks on PMLN are nothing but the old anarchist attacks on civilians since 1947.


Yes. 2018 elections if PTI wins there will be irregularities too. that is a given.

Nobody is perfect and no system is perfect.

Only Allah swt is perfect.

 

[Icewolf]

Potians better first fix polio in your province before doing dharnas

 

[TankMan]

This was the case on seats where PTI won.
This was the case on seats in KP where PTI formed the gov.

The fact that PTI won there doesn't mean PTI rigged the elections, just like the fact that PMLN won in other places doesn't mean they rigged the elections.

your selective attacks on PMLN are nothing but the old anarchist attacks on civilians since 1947

My links included both places where PTI won and places where PMLN won. So, it was not 'a selective attack on PMLN', unless PTI is somehow a part of PMLN.

Did you see what you just said? First you tell me that 'this was the case on seats in KP where PTI formed the gov', then you accuse me of selectively attacking PMLN. Not only did you make a selective attack yourself, you also proved that my post was not a selective attack, contradicting yourself twice. That is a perfect example of a hilariously obvious U-Turn, so congrats on that.

My post was an attack on electoral rigging and nothing else.
If, like you claim, PTI was behind the rigging and not PMLN, why didn't PMLN take advantage for that and push for an investigation? Instead, they opposed it while PTI pushed for it. Something is inconsistent here.

The fact remains that PMLN was wrong to sideline the issue of electoral reform and that proper reforms are required to make the next elections fair.

 

[FaujHistorian]

The fact that PTI won there doesn't mean PTI rigged the elections, just like the fact that PMLN won in other places doesn't mean they rigged the elections.


My links included both places where PTI won and places where PMLN won. So, it was not 'a selective attack on PMLN', unless PTI is somehow a part of PMLN.

Did you see what you just said? First you tell me that 'this was the case on seats in KP where PTI formed the gov', then you accuse me of selectively attacking PMLN. Not only did you make a selective attack yourself, you also proved that my post was not a selective attack, contradicting yourself twice. That is a perfect example of a hilariously obvious U-Turn, so congrats on that.

My post was an attack on electoral rigging and nothing else.
If, like you claim, PTI was behind the rigging and not PMLN, why didn't PMLN take advantage for that and push for an investigation? Instead, they opposed it while PTI pushed for it. Something is inconsistent here.

The fact remains that PMLN was wrong to sideline the issue of electoral reform and that proper reforms are required to make the next elections fair.

Election process should be reformed and will be reformed. Rest assured.

 

[TankMan]

Yes. 2018 elections if PTI wins there will be irregularities too. But that is a given.
Nobody is perfect and no system is perfect.

Isn't it still worth it to try to improve? By that logic, we should still be living in caves because nothing is perfect. But no, we still tried to improve. So why not try to improve here?

 

[TankMan]

Election process should be reformed and will be reformed. Rest assured.

Well I don't see that happening as long as PMLN doesn't actively push for it. They have the most influence, both legally/openly and behind the scenes. If they don't want it to happen, it probably won't happen unless someone else does it.
If you have any reason to believe it will happen, please do share it, or am I just supposed to take your word for it?

 

[FaujHistorian]

Well I don't see that happening as long as PMLN doesn't actively push for it. They have the most influence, both legally/openly and behind the scenes. If they don't want it to happen, it probably won't happen unless someone else does it.
If you have any reason to believe it will happen, please do share it, or am I just supposed to take your word for it?

They will be defeated if they don't perform during this term.

Why you are spreading mischief.

 

[TankMan]

They will be defeated if they don't perform during this term.

Why you are spreading mischief.

They didn't perform during most of their previous terms but they still won.
Do you have absolutely any evidence or even a simple clue indicating that 'they will be defeated if they don't perform'? I will not take some dude on the internet's word for it. If you tell me what makes you think this, I will consider believing it. Otherwise, it's your word against my word and at least my word has some facts backing it.

Questioning politics is 'mischief' for you? Good lord, are you that naive and close-minded? Do you seriously believe that trying to analyse politics from different points of view is 'mischief' or are you just saying that out of personal bias and general dislike for me and PTI?

 

[mr.robot]

They will be defeated if they don't perform during this term.

Why you are spreading mischief.

I have a simple question for you. Why form 14,15,16,17 haven't been released which are public documents and were even released in previous elections.

 

[FaujHistorian]

I have a simple question for you. Why form 14,15,16,17 haven't been released which are public documents and were even released in previous elections.

All public records must be released.

I am not favor of hiding things.

I am also not in favor of dharnas and anarchy.

 

[FaujHistorian]

They didn't perform during most of their previous terms but they still won.
Do you have absolutely any evidence or even a simple clue indicating that 'they will be defeated if they don't perform'? I will not take some dude on the internet's word for it. If you tell me what makes you think this, I will consider believing it. Otherwise, it's your word against my word and at least my word has some facts backing it.

Questioning politics is 'mischief' for you? Good lord, are you that naive and close-minded? Do you seriously believe that trying to analyse politics from different points of view is 'mischief' or are you just saying that out of personal bias and general dislike for me and PTI?

There was no previous full term.

This is like kicking out PTI from KP now and claiming they did not do much beyond doing some internet trickery.

Please do not be an anarchist.

let the system function

thank you.

 

[TankMan]

This is like kicking out PTI from KP now and claiming they did not do much beyond doing some internet trickery.

Please do not be an anarchist.

let the system function

thank you.

There was no previous full term.

I know for a fact that PMLN had a previous full term in Punjab, the wealthiest and most important part of Pakistan. Also, they had plenty of time in their previous terms (even if they were not full), as the OP correctly points out. So, your comparison with 'kicking PTI out of KP now' is a massive overstatement and is logically incorrect.

On what basis are you assuming that i'm trying to be an anarchist? You see, that's the problem with you, you're assuming too much. You're assuming that PMLN will be kicked out if they don't perform, you're assuming that the 2018 elections will be mostly fair and you're assuming that I am an anarchist.

I am perfectly in favour of letting the system function. That's why I want electoral reforms and investigation. That's exactly why PTI spent 14 months trying the ECP, trying the courts and trying to talk to people. There was nothing stopping them from starting a massive dharna on the 12th or 13th of May, why didn't they do it then? They had the momentum, they had the support base, they had a perfect opportunity. Then why not? Because they too wanted the system to function. When it failed, that's when they strayed from it.

If anyone is against the democratic system, it's PMLN. THEY sidelined and avoided perfectly legitimate demands for an investigation and reforms, not PTI and not me.

At the end of the day, you are doing EXACTLY what the Original Poster talked about

When it comes to their own accountability the answer is: System is in danger, democracy will be overthrown

 

[mr.robot]

All public records must be released.

I am not favor of hiding things.

I am also not in favor of dharnas and anarchy.

When system is not releasing public documents even after all this "anarchy", isn't something fishy? The whole reason behind hiding that public information is that fraud (Election 2013) will be exposed... It is not a rocket science to understand....

They don't even have a large number of these forms upon which all this fraud stands and those forms which they have managed to create afterwards will be exposed when compared with ones given at polling stations

 

[FaujHistorian]

When system is not releasing public documents even after all this "anarchy", isn't something fishy? The whole reason behind hiding that public information is that fraud (Election 2013) will be exposed... It is not a rocket science to understand....

They don't even have a large number of these forms upon which all this fraud stands and those forms which they have managed to create afterwards will be exposed when compared with ones given at polling stations

During anarchy and dharna, release of public records is like adding fuel to the fire.

When a man is sick like IK, you don't give him normal food. He cannot digest it.

you give sick man, just medicine, very simple baby food and pray that the sick man recovers.

We are all hoping that he recovers and doesn't drag our beautiful country into another military rule aka umpire rule.

 

[FaujHistorian]

I know for a fact that PMLN had a previous full term in Punjab, the wealthiest and most important part of Pakistan. Also, they had plenty of time in their previous terms (even if they were not full), as the OP correctly points out. So, your comparison with 'kicking PTI out of KP now' is a massive overstatement and is logically incorrect.

On what basis are you assuming that i'm trying to be an anarchist? You see, that's the problem with you, you're assuming too much. You're assuming that PMLN will be kicked out if they don't perform, you're assuming that the 2018 elections will be mostly fair and you're assuming that I am an anarchist.

I am perfectly in favour of letting the system function. That's why I want electoral reforms and investigation. That's exactly why PTI spent 14 months trying the ECP, trying the courts and trying to talk to people. There was nothing stopping them from starting a massive dharna on the 12th or 13th of May, why didn't they do it then? They had the momentum, they had the support base, they had a perfect opportunity. Then why not? Because they too wanted the system to function. When it failed, that's when they strayed from it.

If anyone is against the democratic system, it's PMLN. THEY sidelined and avoided perfectly legitimate demands for an investigation and reforms, not PTI and not me.

At the end of the day, you are doing EXACTLY what the Original Poster talked about

Sheikh Rasheed has been talking about military rule.

Imran Khan is nothing but a sock puppet of Sh rasheed.

So any effort by the likes of you to say "Sh Rasheed just wants a little baby food/ aka 4 halqas" is dishonest to say the least.