Procurement of Transport Aircraft by IAF

[kurup]

The Indian Ministry of Defence has cleared a proposal worth over Rs 12,000 crore for the procurement of 56 transport aircraft for the Indian Air Force. The new aircraft would replace its fleet of vintage Avro HS748 planes acquired in the sixties from the UK. Procurement of the first batch of 16 aircraft through a global tender would be off-the-shelf from foreign vendor who would need to partner with a local private or public sector firm for the manufacture in India of the rest and more. The next batch of 16 would have a 30 per cent indigenous content, while the component of locally-procured and produced items in the remaining 24 planes would be 60 per cent. The government-owned aerospace major Hindustan Aeronautics Limited is not to be involved in the project as it is already burdened with the production of the SU-30MKI upgrades of the Mirage, MiG 29 and Jaguar aircraft.

Procurement of Transport Aircraft by IAF » Indian Defence Review

 

[1nd1a]

The government-owned aerospace major Hindustan Aeronautics Limited is not to be involved in the project

Do I need to say the reason why I am smiling...

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

what category is it ?
is it smaller class than C130j ?

 

[janon]

what category is it ?
is it smaller class than C130j ?

Yes, it is in the C-27J class if I'm not mistaken.

So by the time the final batch is manufactured, there would be 60 percent ToT for private Indian companies. Very major decision, IMO.

 

[sancho]

what category is it ?
is it smaller class than C130j ?

C295 and C27J class:

EADS CASA C-295 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Alenia C-27J Spartan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[sancho]

Do I need to say the reason why I am smiling...

They should have diverted it to NAL and added a privat partner to them, instead of letting the the foreign companies decide for a private company and having no advantage for the government companies. For NAL with projects like Saras or RTA this licence production experience, ToT and foreign partners would be more than valuable and developing NAL to an alternative to HAL, should be important for indigenous developments in future too!
And MoD is nuts if they don't combine this deal with the other deals of BSF, ICG, IN, there is actually a requirement of around 100 aircrafts of this class and it's completely absurd to field dedicated tenders, evaluations and trials for them.

 

[Rajaraja Chola]

Perhaps Mahindra or TATA will be blessed with this project. a good decision

 

[Tshering22]

SO happy to hear that sarkari bureaucracy is not there to spoil this project.

 

[danger007]

thanks to HAL ....lol

 

[Abingdonboy]

And MoD is nuts if they don't combine this deal with the other deals of BSF, ICG, IN, there is actually a requirement of around 100 aircrafts of this class and it's completely absurd to field dedicated tenders, evaluations and trials for them.

You are right but that would have to mean everyone was at the same point in time, reading off the same hymn sheet! As it stands all the proposals for such a/c for the IAC,BSF and IN are at different stages of being drawn up. And to be fair the IAF shouldn't have to delay its own plans because others can't get their acts together. However even if the IAF goes on alone any seperate orders for Spartans by the BSF/IN/ICG should still benifit from the IAF's deal with the infrastuctutre likely having been set up for the IAF's order already.

The funny/tragic thing is it wouldn't be hard to imagine the IN/ICG/BSF going for the C-295 and the IAF going for the C-27J!


But then I also think each and every force has its own unique selection critieria and what may suit one force may not suit another so why should a certain product be forced upon a service that would prefer another?

 

[sancho]

You are right but that would have to mean everyone was at the same point in time, reading off the same hymn sheet! As it stands all the proposals for such a/c for the IAC,BSF and IN are at different stages of being drawn up. And to be fair the IAF shouldn't have to delay its own plans because others can't get their acts together.

Actually, IAF as is the one that is late. BSF already had decided for C295 over C27J, ICG and IN had opened tenders long ago for MPA versions, with ICGs tender cancelled just a while ago, INs re-issued just recently again. But the main point is, that we can benefit way more by combineing these tenders, be it speeding up the process of evaluation, be it less costs for MoD, be it the ease of interchangable training, spares and logistics, be it reduced unit costs, be it more ToT, be it even more political influence...and most of all, it reduced the chances for bribery, because there will be only 1 decison and not 4.

But then I also think each and every force has its own unique selection critieria and what may suit one force may not suit another so why should a certain product be forced upon a service that would prefer another?

Because this is neither a high end procurement, nor has any strategic inportance! In IAF and BSF, these aircrafts are meant for very simple utility and troop transport roles and both will get the least capable versions too. ICG wants an MPA version, which is not available of the C27J yet, but on offer from the manufacturer if a customer wants it, for IN it also will be a low end MPA only, with the more expensive and capable P8I above it.
So what all forces have in common is, cost-effectivety and that is where a combined order of up to 100 aircrafts obviously is better than ordering 16 for BSF, 10 for ICG...

When you leave it to the forces alone, they obviously will route for the best that is available for them, although certain technical capablities are of no use for the other forces. The fact that the C27J can be used from unpaved airstripes for example is not important for ICG or IN, not for IAF, since it will have C130Js and MTAs to do the main tactical transport roles. So by combining the deals, MoD can put a focus on really important requirements, instead of letting the forces simply waste money.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Actually, IAF as is the one that is late. BSF already had decided for C295 over C27J, ICG and IN had opened tenders long ago for MPA versions, with ICGs tender cancelled just a while ago, INs re-issued just recently again. But the main point is, that we can benefit way more by combineing these tenders, be it speeding up the process of evaluation, be it less costs for MoD, be it the ease of interchangable training, spares and logistics, be it reduced unit costs, be it more ToT, be it even more political influence...and most of all, it reduced the chances for bribery, because there will be only 1 decison and not 4.




Because this is neither a high end procurement, nor has any strategic inportance! In IAF and BSF, these aircrafts are meant for very simple utility and troop transport roles and both will get the least capable versions too. ICG wants an MPA version, which is not available of the C27J yet, but on offer from the manufacturer if a customer wants it, for IN it also will be a low end MPA only, with the more expensive and capable P8I above it.
So what all forces have in common is, cost-effectivety and that is where a combined order of up to 100 aircrafts obviously is better than ordering 16 for BSF, 10 for ICG...

When you leave it to the forces alone, they obviously will route for the best that is available for them, although certain technical capablities are of no use for the other forces. The fact that the C27J can be used from unpaved airstripes for example is not important for ICG or IN, not for IAF, since it will have C130Js and MTAs to do the main tactical transport roles. So by combining the deals, MoD can put a focus on really important requirements, instead of letting the forces simply waste money.

You are right my freind but the MoD isn't blessed with this foresight just yet.

 

[Killswitch]

Its about time HAL was given a break.

 

[sancho]

Its about time HAL was given a break.

It's not about government own companies OR privat companies, it should be about including both! NAL has a JV with Mahindra for developing and producing fixed wing prop aircrafts, that's why I would love to see this procurement to be diverted to them. NAL will benefit in terms of knowledge and experience, Mahindra can bring in their production capabilities and HAL could be limited to the engines only, while Samtel could take over parts of the avionics too.
We have the right capabilities, we only need to use them in a logical manner!

 

[Gessler]

@ Sancho

If you ask me, I'd say state-run companies should not even be allowed to come 1000 ft near this deal.

Even if the foreign OEM routes tech transfer to NAL, whats the use? PSUs like these have received a ton of such ToT from various companies and they have totally failed to put into effect any of it. We must'nt think that ToT will help NAL with Saras, RTA etc. The mismanagement of these PSUs will make sure of it that any progress on projects the RTA does not take speed anytime before 2030. And by that time, any actual exp. gained in proudction of, say, C-27J, will be gradually lost.

But if a private player like Mahindra Aerospace gets that ToT and production exp. they can efficiently evolve it into something really productive, Mahindra engineers already have been engaged in fabricating aircraft like C-NM5 and GA-10, albeit not all by themselves.