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Pork or nothing: how school dinners are dividing France

What are you talking about?


How can it hurt them when it is just following their culture?

Kindly keep your indianess in yourself


Maybe if Moghul and British had told that to india...we wouldnt have hindus, right? - just an example coz I can see indians dont understand something without putting the same in india...


They also didnt ask an indian's opinion


Yea and I responded to him so if you saw the pix you saw my reply...your post here serves no purpose!


And if you dont want to read then dont post....I made my post clear now you cherry pick and have comprehension issues isnt my problem!

And Indian tradition,culture and Hinduism made a good impact in Britian .Moghul diluted in our vast culture.AFAIK French are not religion oriented.
But this OP represents something that dont like in there nation .Theirs opinion is important than any outsiders including you ,a Pakistani and an Indian like me.
Muslims are immigrants in there .Your comparison between the Brit and Moghul role and this situation is quite ridiculous.We are natives and they were outsiders.
In here French are natives and immigrants are outsiders..

Wow...1 French gives you a thanks and everything else is a rant :rofl: learn the meaning...you are the actual ranter as France has nothing to do with you except your emotional rant!

Let me define the word you so much use yet have no clue you are actually ranting:

  1. 1.
    speak or shout at length in an angry, impassioned way.
Since France has nothing to do with you you are the one who is ranting.... :rofl:

Thanks for the joke!

Dont bother quoting me coz the Frenchie and I agreed on 1 thing not my fault if you still want to cherry pick!

Go seek a doctor you are suffering from psychological projection ...Hope get well soon!


Really ???
Why did you take soo long to digg out dictionary ?:sarcastic:
I have seen entite posts in thread and also saw your elaborate speech of Islamophobia.
When that French posted the real situatoon with pictures your emotions ended there.Same shit happens to any South Asians .Directly blame without any knowledge about ground situation.
 
Pork is a significant part of the French culture, so it is natural to serve it also at school.
School restaurants should provide variations, so they will not serve pork everyday anyway.

Immigrants should adopt to their society, not the other way around.
Refusal to give preferential treatment, is not discrimination.

In this case, Muslims need to just avoid the pork and eat the rest, or bring their own food
when pork is served, or just abide by the Qu'ran which says it is OK
to eat pork if that is all that is served.

I think culture was more of an afterthought in this decision, it was driven by simple economics with observant Muslim, Jews and Vegan folks are in the receiving end of this.

Here is a quote from abc.au,

"
Prices for beef, dairy, and pork in Europe, have been tumbling on the back of export bans to Russia, the cyclical nature of some commodity prices, according to an agricultural and trade-law analyst.

Agra-Europe editorial director, Chris Horseman, said livestock producers in France and across the European Union were facing low prices.

"The biggest problem is the Russian trade embargo, which has been going on for 12 months and shows no sign of ending," he said.

"That has had a big impact on traditional export patterns, particularly for pork and dairy products."

But the pork market is also at the bottom of a well-known cycle, adding to the downward pressure on prices."


Beef, pork and dairy prices in Europe plummet; French farmers again take to the streets - Rural News - ABC Rural (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)
Why is the French pork industry in crisis? - FRANCE - RFI
 
Muslim women wear Burqa or cover themselves, I strongly urged the Right-wing Anti Muslim politicians to make it that most of their 20 to 40 years old Good looking one's Only female supporters, go everywhere ''Naked'' it will teach Muslims a lesson. I know it will teach me a lesson, for sure,:D please offend the Muslims and start going ''Naked'' everywhere.:enjoy:

Muslims also don't drink Alcohol, I would recommend that all right-wing start drinking heavily. Just to teach Muslims a lesson, don't even bother touching Water as Muslims drink that, That will teach Muslims a lesson.

Muslim don't gamble, I would recommend start gambling. Everything you own. That will teach Muslims a lesson.

Please eat nothing, but pork for breakfast, launch&dinner, eat as much pork as you like. That will teach Muslims a lesson.
 
I think culture was more of an afterthought in this decision,
it was driven by simple economics with observant Muslim,
Jews and Vegan folks are in the receiving end of this.

I think the French are in the receiving end, because they get
criticized for not giving preferential treatment.
 
Religion has no place in public schools,why should we change everything just to make a minority happy ?
There arent soldiers behind every kid that threatens them to eat pork or they will be killed,if you cannot eat pork because of religion,or being vegetarian,then do not eat it. Is that difficult ?
It isnt the Republic that should adapt things for a minority....

But then Republic should also not force values on the minority. There is a basic freedom and that is of choice. For some that freedom is encapsulated in religious values.

Forcing pork into menus is actually a form of extremism. Jews too have been living in France for ages. Have they adopted to eating pork to be French? No! So why should it be forced on Muslims then?

Remember that people from rest of the world look up to West for its choice and right of freedom. If West too begins to behave like some extremist of the kind we have come to hate, West too will become a target and symbol of hate.
 
But then Republic should also not force values on the minority. There is a basic freedom and that is of choice. For some that freedom is encapsulated in religious values.

Forcing pork into menus is actually a form of extremism. Jews too have been living in France for ages. Have they adopted to eating pork to be French? No! So why should it be forced on Muslims then?

I would be surprised if French schools have not been serving pork for a very long time.
Swedish schools have been serving pork for 100 years+.
Way before any muslims were more than a handful.
The extremist view is that schools should change the menus to accommodate religious habits.
 
France’s much vaunted secularism is not the neutral space it claims to be
Giles Fraser
There is a huge difference between targeting grand bishops in Rome and a beleaguered, economically fragile Muslim community

At the start of this year, the school in the little French town of Sargé-lès-le-Mans instituted a “pork or nothing” policy. Muslim and Jewish kids have either to eat pork or go hungry. Apparently this move is necessary to “save secularism”, according to National Front leader Marine le Pen. “We will accept no religious requirements in the school lunch menus,” she said. “There is no reason for religion to enter the public sphere.”

The glorious triumph of atheistic rationality over the dangerous totalitarian obscurantism of the Catholic church is one of the great foundation myths of republican France. And coded within this mythology is the message that liberty, equality, fraternity can flourish only when religion is suppressed from the public sphere. It is worth remembering what this ideological space-clearing involved.

At the end of the 18th century, France’s war against the Catholic church reached its bloody conclusion. By Easter 1794, the same revolution that once proclaimed freedom of conscience had forcedly closed down the vast majority of France’s 40,000 churches. What began with the confiscation of church property and the smashing of crosses and chalices, ended with forced conversions and the slaughter of priests and nuns at the guillotine.

It is in this period, the so-called Reign of Terror, that the modern English word terrorism – deriving from the French terrorisme – has its origins. “Terror is nothing but prompt, severe, inflexible justice; it is therefore an emanation of virtue,” argued Robespierre, in what now sounds like a sick press release from Islamic State. Over in the Vendée, those who remained loyal to their centuries-old faith were massacred in what historian Mark Levene has called “an archetype of modern genocide”. The systematic de-Christianisation of France was not the natural and inevitable collapse of sclerotic religion and the natural and inevitable rise of Enlightenment rationality. It was murderous, state-sponsored suppression.

Of course, there are those who think the Catholic church had it coming. Yes, it had cornered a huge proportion of France’s wealth. Yes, it had a dangerously symbiotic relationship with the monarchy and reactionary aristocrats in powdered wigs. But these days, the Catholic church is no longer any political challenge to the French state. And the reason publications such as Charlie Hebdo persist with their crass anti-clerical cliches (where the joke is usually a variation on bishops buggering each other) is that a powerful strain of French self-understanding actually requires a sense of external religious threat against which to frame itself. But as the Catholic church is no longer planning to sponsor a coup against the state, Republican identity requires something new to define itself against – something just like radical Islam. As Voltaire put it: “If God did not exist it would be necessary to invent him.” Thus France picked a fight with Islam by banning the headscarf from schools in 2004 and the niqab from all public life back in 2010 – bans which closely echo the hostility of earlier generations to the veiling of nuns.

But there is a huge difference between targeting grand bishops in Rome and a beleaguered, economically fragile Muslim community that has received a great many knocks at the hands of the French state and its colonial past. Rabelaisian derision aimed at the House of Saud or Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi is one thing. But aimed at the disaffected banlieues it is bullying and goading. You have to be suspicious that French secularism is not the neutral thing it purports to be when racists such as Le Pen start defending it so enthusiastically. And yet there is nothing the leaders of al-Qaida want more than the French state to be seen to declare war on its religious citizens once again. They know that many young, disaffected Arab immigrants on the sink estates outside Paris are itching for a fight. The French government must not give it to them. And that means re-thinking their precious laïcité.

@giles_fraser

France’s much vaunted secularism is not the neutral space it claims to be | Giles Fraser | Comment is free | The Guardian
 
Pork is a significant part of the French culture, so it is natural to serve it also at school.
School restaurants should provide variations, so they will not serve pork everyday anyway.

Immigrants should adopt to their society, not the other way around.
Refusal to give preferential treatment, is not discrimination.

In this case, Muslims need to just avoid the pork and eat the rest, or bring their own food
when pork is served, or just abide by the Qu'ran which says it is OK
to eat pork if that is all that is served.

So is a Muslim allowed to eat pork in extentuating circumstances? Second I would be obliged if you have any referance for this? I know this is strange a Muslim asking a non Muslim but internet can be strange place.
 
I would be surprised if French schools have not been serving pork for a very long time.
Swedish schools have been serving pork for 100 years+.
Way before any muslims were more than a handful.
The extremist view is that schools should change the menus to accommodate religious habits.

Who are the persons over here to say what we should do and not do ?
 
Wow...1 French gives you a thanks and everything else is a rant :rofl: learn the meaning...you are the actual ranter as France has nothing to do with you except your emotional rant!

Let me define the word you so much use yet have no clue you are actually ranting:

  1. 1.
    speak or shout at length in an angry, impassioned way.
Since France has nothing to do with you you are the one who is ranting.... :rofl:

Thanks for the joke!

Dont bother quoting me coz the Frenchie and I agreed on 1 thing not my fault if you still want to cherry pick!

Go seek a doctor you are suffering from psychological projection ...Hope get well soon!

Now you know why I don't give any quarter to these "things"? People think I am harsh on them. I was not always like that. I concluded that there is precious little we can talk and accomodate with these people. Had that been the case 1947 would not have happened. So now whilst I don't quite uphold Gen. Custers distum "The only good Indian is a daydd Indian" but for sure it is "bare knuckles".

On the subject of "Indianess" can you ask him would he clarify if this one example of two million is Indianess?

rickshaw.jpg


1383792652-hazardous-situation-for-rickshaw-puller-during-strikes_3154029.jpg


Man as Beast - India

Talking of pork could the French be convinced to ship some prime chops over to India. You got the thankless Muslims who won't eat. Then you got starving Indian's who would be thankfull for any shred of protien. Please do not send any beef or else they will kill them consumers. The news headlines will read "Death by starving or death by eating?"

Starving in India: The Forgotten Problem - India Real Time - WSJ
No one starves in India. The poor drink, get sick and die - Firstpost

@Akhelios I know one of the days I wil get banned. I have this crowd of Indian's (below) baying for my blood and applying pressure on the PDF staff. So if go without bidding farewell don't be offended.

Can you guess what they are shouting? "Go Atanz Go".

kumbh.jpg


And @Gabriel92 I agree it is your country. You have your own sense of secularism. So I understand your sentiment. Let those who don't want to eat not eat. Freedom, Liberty, Fraternity.
 
But then Republic should also not force values on the minority. There is a basic freedom and that is of choice. For some that freedom is encapsulated in religious values.

Forcing pork into menus is actually a form of extremism. Jews too have been living in France for ages. Have they adopted to eating pork to be French? No! So why should it be forced on Muslims then?

Remember that people from rest of the world look up to West for its choice and right of freedom. If West too begins to behave like some extremist of the kind we have come to hate, West too will become a target and symbol of hate.

Nobody is forcing them to eat pork,nobody is forcing pork into menus,there are sometimes pork like sometimes there are fish.
See my last post on page 2.
 
So is a Muslim allowed to eat pork in extentuating circumstances? Second I would be obliged if you have any referance for this? I know this is strange a Muslim asking a non Muslim but internet can be strange place.
Read the Qur'an 2:172-173 and You will find that if there is no alternative to eating pork,
god is a forgiving god, so if that is what is served, go for it.
When the days of judgement arrives,
do you think god will prioritize the guy enjoying a ham and cheese sandwich,
or the guy killing Muslims with barrel bombs.
Do you think the "sins" are equal, so they deserve the same punishment?
 
Last edited:
Read the Qur'an 2:172-173 and You will find that if there is no alternative to eating pork,
god is a forgiving god, so if that is what is served, go for it.

Blessed may you be. Go forth and may you multiply. You have saved me from eternal damnation for once making a mistake. Just once. Swear.

Now this feels like a Catholic Church confession box.:-)
 

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