PKK ambush caught on tape by Heron UAV.

[Last Hope]

??? This report is about kurdish militia (PKK) and Turk Army ... Pak army has nothing to do with it ...

Oooh !!
Sorry !
I take back my words !!
I saw PKK as PAK !!
Sorry all !!

 

[500]

Last thing: If this is true, is it our heron? Everybody knows Israil have UAVs at this area, to support PKK. (Not just UAVs, they are supporting PKK at nearly everything. This includes political and military trainings of 2000 PKK militans at islands of guam by mossad and cia agents in 2002-2008.)

1) "Everybody knows" = rumor without any proofs.
2) If you think that you can safely penetrate the Turkish airspace with huge propeller aircraft, then I am very sorry for you.

RIP to the soldiers.

 

[mete]

Jigs, it is probably our heron, actually i am nearly sure it is ours. But ithe news are full with lies.(Mixed with some truth, that makes a lie dangerous.) I just wanted to show another perspective.

I can talk too much about this issues. But this is our internal problem and I dont want to talk our internal weaknesses on net. For example, I think Erdogan and its AKP is the biggest problem for next 50 years.(With them or without them.) But telling these issues on net doesnt solve them even creates other problems.(even if they were false analyses) I think you can understand what I said. Think like this is a family issue.

That is classified and no one on here would know that based on solid information.

This may be classified for Israilies, but in our army even lieutenants know Israil have patrolling drones at our border, gathering information. This information is used for diffirent causes:

- Israil feels unsafe everytime.(and they should, because this is the thing holds their nation united.)

- Israil needs PKK for many reasons. This includes their long term ideological perspective and their economy like drug jobs of Israili intelligence agencies. (PKK is the biggest international drug carrier on this planet. Working with many countries, not just Israil.) Another reason is keeping busy Turkey with anti-terror war. In long term an etnical seperation would be great for Israil. (This is not good for us but good for Israil.)

- Israil needs information about us. Because we are strong in this region. (and we need information about other countries too. This is normal.)

- Israil also using these information for infiltration at borders. (For example Iskenderun incident this year.)

I can count many things. I think all these are normal. In internal politics everybody does nasty things including killing another nations members(at war or peace.), selling drugs for many reasons, supporting problematic fractions or creating problematic fractions. We are doing too, but not that much for last 50 years.

We are a threat for Israil's long term plans, and Israil is a threat for us too. This is normal too, these things happens. We are in a big conflict, but which country doesnt have conflicts with another country?

Many things are generally kept secret even from our own nations. But if you trace leaks and know how to reach information these are not big secrets. Actually all these information are easy to gather, just need to work on.

note: About classified informations: They may be classified in your country but your countries actions might be known by others. In this condition, that action is not a secret anymore. Might be secret in your people, it doesnt change anything.

 

[Saithan]

I agree that it's a rumour unless you have a source for your claim, but on the other hand I'd be a fool if I didn't believe that Israel one way or other is involved, just like how the US is involved with the terrorist organization PKK.

It's easy, help PJAK (who annoys Iran) and among them you'll find PKK people as well who in return terrorizes Turkey. And they can with good conscience deny they aid PKK because they're aiding PJAK.

 

[Jigs]

There is certainly something going on. Weather it be domestic political stuff or foreign involvement.

Recent article from Hurriyet on this matter.

Investigations into possible breaches of Turkey’s national security gained new dimensions last week as both the so-called “Heron investigation” and an investigation into a spying and prostitution racket allegedly operating out of the Navy were expanded.

The families of some of Turkey’s fallen soldiers have filed criminal complaints, demanding investigations into whether recent leaked footage from a Heron surveillance aircraft indicates that army commanders might be guilty of neglect.

The demand comes after videos from unmanned Heron surveillance aircraft of two assaults allegedly coordinated by the Kurdistan Workers’ Party, or PKK, on military posts in Gediktepe and Çukurca, in Hakkari, on June 19 and July 20 which resulted in heavy Turkish casualties, were leaked. Following the leak of the footage, daily Taraf accused the military of not adequately defending Turkish troops.

The Van Prosecutor’s Office with Special Authority is running the investigation, which is currently collecting evidence, identifying suspects and hearing testimony.

It was reported on Thursday that the Military Prosecution Office of the General Staff has begun an additional investigation into the matter, based on a wiretapped conversation which allegedly features the voice of Col. Ünal A. who can reportedly be heard saying: “we didn’t respond to the recordings of the unmanned surveillance aircraft. Eight-ten terrorists… I mean, you do not respond to every intelligence report, every recording.” The PKK is listed as a terrorist organization by Turkey, the United States and the European Union.

This recording is expected to be included in the Van Prosecutor’s investigation dossier.

Idk if this is the work of the AKP trying to work more of this Coup stuff or if there is corruption in the army.

 

[Saithan]

Jigs I think it's worth keeping in mind that the military has not had any watchdog over its actions thus I am very inclined to believe that corruption among the ranks exists.

I read this news on Zaman, about leaking military secrets and such:

Today's Zaman, your gateway to Turkish daily news

this kind of news makes me wonder whether TSK should establish a battalion of IT engineers and hackers to safeguard military secrets.

It's worth remembering another thing, We turks hold our mehmetcik in high regard, but that doesn't mean the officers in charge are of the same caliber. If you look at movies, series etc. the mehmetcik are portrait as soldiers doing their duty, but why isn't there any movie praising the actions of generals.....

 

[mete]

Idk if this is the work of the AKP trying to work more of this Coup stuff or if there is corruption in the army.

If there is only 7-8 people as threat factor generally you dont send a lot of force there. (Generally there are enough counter elements for these kind of ambushes.)

About our soldiers dying; I lost my cousin too. I know what kind of pain is this. And I know they are not just numbers. (Allah sehitlerimizin yuzu suyu hurmetine bize rahmetle muamele etsin. Onlar zaten rahmettedir.)

I washed and burried a 9 months old baby who is killed by a PKK member, babies head was crushed by a gunstoke. Sometimes I wake up with the mothers screams in my head.

Be sure I know what happens there, and be sure our generals and privates have same worries, same emotions about this situation. Problem here can be discussed in 2 diffirent areas:

1) Our army is very efficient and succesful at this anti-terror. This situation is not solved because of politics. This is a very long story and I wont dicuss this here.(I told the reasons.) I suggest you Umit Ozdag, he is one of the biggest specialists about PKK and its sociological-political basis.

2) Our nation is in a critical time, there is a great psycological operation. We are under heavy information bombardment and a standart person can easily be convinced in anything. Because a standart person dont have time and knowlage to analyse all these misinformation. This is another issue I dont want to talk here. May be in other platforms we can talk. (Laf olsun diye soylemiyorum, cidden konuşmak isterim.)

note: Some Turkish sentences used, sorry for that. I couldnt translate my thoughts to English there.

 

[Rafi]

My sincere and heartfelt condolences for the loss of brave and loyal Mehmetcik, any wrong doing should be punished, but what we should do is salute these men, they did perform at and above the call of duty.

A suggestion, the quicker we can (I include Pakistan in this) get an armed drone in the sky the better. Imagine if there was a drone in the class of a reaper, these PKK scum could have been vaporised before they got near the post.