PCSIR successfully produces electricity from coal

[Cheetah786]

Hon Sir,

I don’t mean to cast a slur on your knowledge of Thermodynamics. However, Gibbs energy or Gibbs free energy as you have called it a very difficult abstract concept and your post indicates that you have not fully understood it.
This was first coined by James Willard Gibbs in 1873.

The Gibbs Free Energy is a thermodynamic quantity which can be used to determine if a reaction is spontaneous or not. The definition of the Gibbs free energy is

∆G = ∆H- T∆S

Where ∆G is the free energy, ∆H is the enthalpy and ∆S is the entropy
Entropy is also a measure of the tendency of a process, such as a chemical reaction, to proceed in a particular direction and therefore entropy is an expression of disorder or randomness.

Second law of thermodynamics states that the entropy of an isolated system always increases or remains constant. Enthalpy is a measure of total energy of a thermodynamic system. The total enthalpy, H, of a system cannot be measured directly. Most common measure is the change in enthalpy.

Enthalpy of formation of water is -285.83 KJ/mol. Enthalpy of splitting of water is exactly the same?

Car can run on hydrogen or any combustible liquid or gas. Per JW Gibbs equation, since Enthalpy of formation of water and splitting is the same; you cannot split water using car battery, run the car on the hydrogen thus formed and recharge the battery from the car running solely on hydrogen produced thru splitting the water as there is no extra/ free energy leftover to run the car.


Hydrogen Fuel cells have been with us since 1959. In fact US have spent millions on research but todate no Hydrogen Fuel cell car is being produced which costs the same as gasoline/diesel powered cars.

Most promising fuel cell is Polymer Exchange Membrane Fuel Cell or PEFMC. Here the pressurized hydrogen gas (H2) enters the fuel cell on the anode side. This gas is forced through the catalyst by the pressure. When an H2 molecule comes in contact with the platinum on the catalyst, it splits into two H+ ions and two electrons (e-). The electrons are conducted through the anode, where they make their way through the external circuit (doing useful work such as turning a motor) and return to the cathode side of the fuel cell.

Meanwhile, on the cathode side of the fuel cell, oxygen gas (O2) is being forced through the catalyst, where it forms two oxygen atoms. Each of these atoms has a strong negative charge. This negative charge attracts the two H+ions through the membrane, where they combine with an oxygen atom and two of the electrons from the external circuit to form a water molecule (H2O).
This reaction in a single fuel cell produces only about 0.7 volts. To get this voltage up to a reasonable level, many separate fuel cells must be combined to form a fuel cell stack. Bipolar plates are connecting one fuel cell to another and are prone to corrosion.

Please note that this requires Hyrdogen & Oxygen gas under pressure and hydrogen obtained from electrolysis from water as indicated by Mr. Waqar is not suitable.

I repeat, a car cannot run on water alone as claimed by the Khairpur Engineer Waqar. Anyone who concurs with this has no knowledge of Science or thermodynamics and is not worthy of being Chairman of PCSIR.

The fact that Dr Pervez is Chairman of the PCSIR: proves that currently in Pakistan merit has no place and only nepotism/toadyism is the way forward.

I am not a scientist nor do i pretend to be one i have zero knowledge of Thermodynamics nor did i put up a formula to prove others right or wrong .

Water for Fuel Fact or Fiction


The straightforward way to start the discussion is to talk about the run your car on water scams first. There are two typical types of scammers that I observe on the Internet. The first type of run your car on water scammer has a determined disregard for the truth. The second kind is blissfully ignorant of the true facts, those kinds just wants to make a quick buck and put up a website overflowing with myths and egregious factual errors. Both of these kinds of people harm the run your car on water industry at large. So let’s chat about what “run your car on water” truly and realistically means. It basically means operation your internal combustion engine (gasoline or diesel) partly on H2O.

If a run your car on water website is mentioning on the subject of driving a vehicle 100% on water with no other resources of powering the vehicle, then this is a rip-off. There is no magical way of utilizing water to harness energy form H2O alone, at least not yet. In other word, there is no free energy, there is no perpetual motion machines that exist. It would violate the laws of thermodynamics. As an alternative, you can partially run your vehicle on water. This is done through basic electrolysis technique. Water is electrolyzed with an electrical current from the car’s battery or alternator and the H2O turns into HHO gas. The HHO gas is then pushed and delivered into the car’s intake system where it will burn up alongside with the gasoline inside the engine. The plain fact of introducing gasoline together with HHO gas means less gasoline is used. This converted into lower emission and boost gasoline mileage. The HHO gas that is burned is cleaner than gasoline and the only emissions from HHO is a slight amount of water vapor or H2O.

This type of technology has been around for decades. Scientists in the 1700s and 1800s were experimenting with electrolysis techniques. William A. Rhodes patented a technique for creating HHO gas In the 1960s. Yull Brown adapted a similar patent In the 1970s. IN 1977 or thereabouts, The Bulgarian Australian inventor, Yule Brown was covered in a press article in a Sydney suburb, with a recent GM Holden Monaro coupe – a solid 6 cylinder sports car after the American manner. HE claimed to have converted it to electrlyse water into HHO for ignition in the conventional GM 6 piston engine. Australian Parliament’s Hansards record shows that he was said to have driven 4,000 – from Sydney to Perth and back – on one tank of water. As a quote from Yull Brown “Everyone wins, except the greedy energy tycoons” says Yull, “Right now they are waisting big dollars on Gasoline manufacturing. They have refused to listen to my invention-because money gets in the way”. There are lots of ‘Free Energy’ devices that have been made from my Browns Gas” Simply put the technology has been with held so oil companies and car makers can extract huge profits from us the consumer.Both Rhodes and Brown’s HHO technology has been employed in the welding industry for many years now. The famous National Hydrogen Association also endorses the technology by another term, “hydrogen fuel injection” systems referring as an exciting emerging technology. Numerous number of car, trucks and other vehicles are using these hydrogen fuel injection systems right now with very encouraging results in regard to reduce emissions and boost gas mileage.

HHO Fuel Cells | www.hhofuelcells.com

 

[VCheng]

I am sorry, I thought this thread was on the PCSIR work on Thar coal, but it has turned into a comedy section.

 

[SQ8]

Consider that many so called "senior" Scientists in Pakistani government organizations are actually ******** of the highest order..
Rote learner Folks who made it up the ladder.. or those that decided never to pick a book again after getting a post.
The only actual intellect that has made it up.. SHOWS itself.

Dr Atta ur Rehman for eg.. was one man who usually knew what he was talking about before making a statement.
But then he was removed for political interests...
There are some very qualified and astute folks still in the Realm of the Strategic Planning Division(NESCOM)..and otherwise..
But the majority of those that really knew what they were talking about.. left the country because they found that only Bureaucrats and stuffed Chair types rule the roost in this country.
Dont rock the boat.. dont actually do anything.. Until India does the same..till then.. sit back and organize those files with stamps and signs.. they are important.
Then what incentive do achieving people actually have to stay in this rotten system?

Those that stay, are those that are happy with their morning tea's.. 8 - 3 working hours.. and Pay scale upgrades.
But then again.. its preferable for us Pakistanis to believe in the possibility of quick miracles..
be it water powered cars or Jinn Energy.

 

[ziaulislam]

Consider that many so called "senior" Scientists in Pakistani government organizations are actually ******** of the highest order..
Rote learner Folks who made it up the ladder.. or those that decided never to pick a book again after getting a post.
The only actual intellect that has made it up.. SHOWS itself.

Dr Atta ur Rehman for eg.. was one man who usually knew what he was talking about before making a statement.
But then he was removed for political interests...
There are some very qualified and astute folks still in the Realm of the Strategic Planning Division(NESCOM)..and otherwise..
But the majority of those that really knew what they were talking about.. left the country because they found that only Bureaucrats and stuffed Chair types rule the roost in this country.
Dont rock the boat.. dont actually do anything.. Until India does the same..till then.. sit back and organize those files with stamps and signs.. they are important.
Then what incentive do achieving people actually have to stay in this rotten system?

Those that stay, are those that are happy with their morning tea's.. 8 - 3 working hours.. and Pay scale upgrades.
But then again.. its preferable for us Pakistanis to believe in the possibility of quick miracles..
be it water powered cars or Jinn Energy.

ultimately its the fualt of the people, remeber there is whole bunch of very intellectual people who either vote the current parties or dont vote...both equally responsible for this condition