Pakistan's Special Operations Forces: SSG | SSGN | SSW | SOW | SOG

[blain2]

Irfan, what's this? Don't tell me you are beginning to see why we offer the criticism we do? But be careful, don't find yourself in agreement with the likes of us, you risk much, but not conscience nor patriotism.
When we highlight why that Army motto is a problem, we were generally misunderstood - we seek an army that is concerned with killing the enemy and surviviing to kill even more enemies, not concerned with confession or sectarian ideals.

See, it's not about fear - You are are always afraid, trust that - the point is that the training is supposed to take over, not freaking suicide, but training - and that training is supposed to be all about killing the enemy and coming back to your wife, children, neighbors, your comrades...not fascination with seeking your own death.

Muse,

Training is one aspect, keeping the morale of the troops up is another. In the most secular days of Pakistan (50s and 60s), we went to war with the battle cry of Allahu-akbar. This was because this is how the nation and the Army had always been oriented.

Yes some people are emotional and make take this notion too far, but at the end of the day, the Army is being trained to fight and win a war against a much bigger adversary. What is the equalizer then? Its the morale. How do you raise the morale? By training hard and having a nationalistic/Islamic motivation for the officers and troops.

 

[blain2]

All military outfits have their own unique ways of upping morale using symbolism or indoctrinating themselves to a code etc. There are many who have a firm belief to not leave a fallen comrade behind. While it is absolutely noble to do so, it is also realistically an illogical military tactic (I understand the issues around not wanting to leave your dead behind for propaganda or desecration etc.), yet armies do it and find that by doing so their morale is raised.

On our end, we have this idea of embracing a fact of life, which is death and that in a profession like the military, one's life would be endangered and some level of self-sacrifice has to be accepted and embraced.

 

[Jango]

The concept of dying for religion or country in Pakistan, and specifically in the military is that go in the war without an fear, fear of what one might say, fear of being shot and dead. That is what the morale boosting is for . To not be afraid of death, because it is for a noble cause, and put in an equal effort. It does not mean to go in front of the enemy like a moron and get yourself killed. Some people do misinterpret it.

 

[krash]

Guys lets please keep this thread to pics only discussions can be done else where.

 

[blain2]

Great pics .......
How come members of the British, Australian, NZ SAS, US Seal team 6 never show faces in public.... how come they are blanked out.
Are they involved in illegal activities ?

That was the case with the SSG too and it changed in the 90s because of SSG being used more and more in plain public view. There are still teams within the SSG who typically do not allow pictures to be published. In all honesty, anyone within the SSG would frown upon these pictures being posted on public boards, but the reality is that the Internet has made this very difficult.

 

[Jango]

OK, just clearing up an issue.

 

[blain2]

musa kaleemullah frogmans painting army mess

This is actually a portrait of the Counter-Terrorism operators associated with Zarrar ATC.

 

[Jango]

That was the case with the SSG too and it changed in the 90s because of SSG being used more and more in plain public view. There are still teams within the SSG who typically do not allow pictures to be published. In all honesty, anyone within the SSG would frown upon these pictures being posted on public boards, but the reality is that the Internet has made this very difficult.

The PNS mehran siege, you could clearly see trucks of SSG in the morning, with M-4 and hats going into the facility.

 

[blain2]

The biggest joke is using highly trained SSG operators to protect the hides of the likes of AZ and others. Nothing kills the
morale of professional troops, trained to extremely high standards to be wasting their time on useless things like this.
The country's civil leadership should have a dedicated CP unit, highly trained in their role so the SSG can be withdrawn and allowed to stay out of the circus.

 

[Bharat Ratna]

even though im indian im really impressed by the slogan "WE DESIRE DEATH MORE ARDENTLY THAN YOU DESIRE LIFE"
we have cases of our soldiers in siachen having the same spirit as pak army ssg but im really say hats off to pak army ssg they have done wonderful job in conquering the fear of death...im just curious what actually in training of ssg induces this spirit can someone answer me..thankyou

 

[Xestan]

even though im indian im really impressed by the slogan "WE DESIRE DEATH MORE ARDENTLY THAN YOU DESIRE LIFE"
we have cases of our soldiers in siachen having the same spirit as pak army ssg but im really say hats off to pak army ssg they have done wonderful job in conquering the fear of death...im just curious what actually in training of ssg induces this spirit can someone answer me..thankyou

Well, as far as I have known some SSG guys, they are quite religious in their own way, the spirit of sacrificing life for the motherland mostly comes from the idea of Shahadat, sacrificing one's life for Islam, a Islamic state, etc. Training obviously is a vital part but I think this idea more comes form the religion and from their love towards their country, that's natural in Pakistan Army, actually.

One incident I remember, in the GHQ attacks in 2009, Hostage scenario was faced by the SSG, there was a problem in initiating the operation as there were suicide bombers present in the same room in which hostages were kept, it was clear that the operation can't go on without giving some sacrifices, 2 SSG guys volunteered for that job, both of them were martyred but they achieved their target which was getting terrorist confused and getting their attention towards them, while other commandos rushed in and took out the bombers and then other terrorists.

Correct me Blain2, if I'm wrong about the incident, anyways, I hope others can explain you too, about your question Bharat Ratna.

btw, to

 

[krash]

even though im indian im really impressed by the slogan "WE DESIRE DEATH MORE ARDENTLY THAN YOU DESIRE LIFE"
we have cases of our soldiers in siachen having the same spirit as pak army ssg but im really say hats off to pak army ssg they have done wonderful job in conquering the fear of death...im just curious what actually in training of ssg induces this spirit can someone answer me..thankyou

Ill add a little to what Xestan has said:

This concept is not new. Almost all the warrior nations in legends of old had this concept. The Spartans were one people who 'desired death more ardently than life'. Their warriors prayed before a battle that they be slain in a manner and by a warrior worthy of them. The Samurai too were in thirst of an honorable death on the battle field. The Vikings were another lot who vehemently believed that the most honorable death was one attained on the battle field fighting against ones enemies. They even went as far as believing that the only people who would enter Valhalla (heaven) would be the ones who would die while fighting on the battle field. Everyone else would go to hell. Muslim soldiers in history have also displayed this desire quite passionately. Khalid-bin-Walid, while on his deathbed, expressed his dissatisfaction at not having died in battle while fighting in the name of Allah. This is not to say that what they desire going into battle is death but instead an honorable death, a fall worthy of them, a fall while fighting for their cause. Some of our members took the slogan quite literally i.e. going into battle so as to loose ones life in other words suicidal tendencies. But this interpretation would be very simplistic and quite unfair. This slogan does not just demand death but a death worthy of a warrior and worthy of his cause, in the line of duty. Simply put it points to a desire to die while fighting with all ones might when the cause that one is fighting for demands it. This is also the concept behind 'Shahadat'. Suicidal actions are barred, correction abhorred in this idea. This concept of an 'honorable death befitting a warrior' has long been romanticized in song and poetry. In stories of old this desire is what raises a soldier from a mere human to a warrior of legends. It instills in the soldier the ideal to fight against his enemies without fear or intimidation and if the situation demands lay his life down, intentionally or otherwise, for his cause not just without fear but with fervor.

Us being Muslims 'Shahadat' is the ultimate manner in which to die. And hence, ideally, every Muslim soldier desires it. Thus the slogan of the SSG. The whole PA has slogans of such sort. I for one admire them with great awe and respect.

 

[MadDog]

This was actually a quote of Khalid Bin Waleed (R), a companion of Holy Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) and a General who fought both the Roman/Byzantine and Persian Empires and defeated both in numerous battles despite being militarily inferior.

Here is the actual letter which he (R) wrote to Persian Kings/nobles

" In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful. From Khalid ibn Walid to the kings of Persia.
Praise be to Allah who has disrupted your system and thwarted your designs. And if He had not done so it would have been worse for you. Submit to our orders and we shall leave you and your land in peace; else you shall suffer subjugation at the hands of a people who love death as you love life."

Pakistan named its Main Battle Tank Al-Khalid after him (R) and Khalid Bin Waleed (R) was given the title of Saifullah (Sword of Allah) by Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) himself during His (PBUH)'s lifetime.

Hope this info helps !!!!

 

[MadDog]

Another famous quote about him by a Byzantine priest is ;

"Is the standard of this army a black one? Is the commander of this army a tall, powerfully built, broad shouldered man with a large beard and a few pock marks on his face? Then beware of fighting this army." Byzantine priest. (633 A.D)

 

[Rao Sahab]

nice pics....